Ufc 165

[quote]Aussie Davo wrote:

[quote]AsaAkira13 wrote:
I thought jones won that, not even close. watched again before on mute and still thought Jones dominated.

Gus was barely conscious in the fifth and Jones landed the bigger strikes, a few stiff jabs and right hands were all Gus landed.

I think people have bias because they want to see Jones lose and when Gus stuffed those takedowns and landed a few shots people kinda selectively viewed that fight.

Just watch on mute and look at who landed what, jones landed hard elbows, uppercuts, knees, head kicks and lots of hard leg kicks. Gus landed lesser shots and was in a really bad state in the fourth and fifth.

Also all the haters on sherdog were “shut down” by schaub. Good for him.[/quote]

I did watch it on mute because I don’t care for goldberg or rogaine’s commentary most of the time.

I don’t see how you can say other people have selective viewing and then turn around and say jones dominated. In what reality is that a dominant performance? He got fed. I could understand if you felt he won, personally I had gustaffason at 3 rounds to Jones 2, but I could understand if someone felt jones edged a win.

But DOMINANT? That’s ridiculous. In what reality is that a dominating performance?[/quote]

I used the pride scoring criteria. How many heavy shots did Gus land? When did Gus have jones in trouble? When did Gus rock Jones?

Jones won pretty much every round of that fight for me.

You’re deluding yourself.

You cannot score Pride style and also score every round “10-must”.
If you use “Pride scoring”, you cannot score rounds.

If you score rounds, Gustaffson won at least one or more rounds.
If you score Pride style, why ignore the fact the Jones was carried out by his homies, mauled into hospital while Gustaffson was bangin Arianny Celeste in the cloakroom at the afterparty, happily going for the championship rounds, again?
They even made up some “shattered foot” story to obfuscate how much Alex hurt him.

What you’re saying is: Gustaffson lost round x because he was hurt in round y.
That’s no Pride scoring.

Regardless of how you score it, it still was a fantastic fight. It was awesome to watch and had me on the edge of my seat. I was angry for a few days as I do believe The Swede was robbed. But I could see how someone might score it in favor of Jones. Their rematch is inevitable so long as Gus doesn’t start sucking all of a sudden.

What I am interested in is others opinions of Jones Vs. Glover. This dude on paper seems great. He has won like 20 straight fights and knocked out Ryan Bader. But I watched a few of this guys fights and there is no way in hell this guy is going to last more then one round with Jones. Glover is unathletic and slow. He has some pretty heavy hands which is how he knocked out Bader who was winning their stand up exchange.

Bader should have won that fight but got sloppy which led to him getting dropped by a lucky punch. Only the last five of Glovers fights have been in the UFC, of which the only win worth mentioning is his last one over Ryan Bader.

So Jones beats Glover TKO during superbowl fight and then Gus gets his rematch.

Agreed to the first part- the fight was amazing.

Texeira will have a very hard time.
In an interview, the challenger was defending himself when asked how he’d press the fight, how he’d hope to come inside given his tiny reach: “Mike Tyson was smaller and did it, too.” (from memory)
The thing is, Iron Mike was training everyday for dealing with reach properly. That was a huge part of his style.

And a lot of these movements are poison for an MMA fight.
Slip too much and you’ll eat a kick with your teeth.
Duck and weave too predictably and a knee might drop by to say hello.
Donald Cerrone destroyed Dennis Siver with high and middle kicks because his bob & weave is way to predictable.

Jones will have an easy time setting up a nice high kick vs Glover. He’ll then either take down the wobbly brazilian and cut him silly via ellbows or deliver some Jonesesque, swaggering finish right there.
Two or three rounds.

Texiera is just what Jones -and the UFC- needs at that point:
A legitimate, dangerous challenger with just the right style to make the champ feel invincible again.

Haha

You give Glover way too much credit in my opinion. Three rounds? No way he makes it that far. But you certainly are right about Glover being just what Jones and UFC/Dana need/want right now. Gotta let Jones feel like he is the man again. I read an article in which Jones says, after viewing the fight several more times, he believes he decisively won four out of five rounds. What criteria is everybody using to score these fights.

I wonder if this fight has removed any inclination on Jones part of jumping up to heavy weight, where his reach and height are no longer an outlier.

[quote]Schwarzfahrer wrote:
Agreed to the first part- the fight was amazing.

Texeira will have a very hard time.
In an interview, the challenger was defending himself when asked how he’d press the fight, how he’d hope to come inside given his tiny reach: “Mike Tyson was smaller and did it, too.” (from memory)
The thing is, Iron Mike was training everyday for dealing with reach properly. That was a huge part of his style.

And a lot of these movements are poison for an MMA fight.
Slip too much and you’ll eat a kick with your teeth.
Duck and weave too predictably and a knee might drop by to say hello.
Donald Cerrone destroyed Dennis Siver with high and middle kicks because his bob & weave is way to predictable.

Jones will have an easy time setting up a nice high kick vs Glover. He’ll then either take down the wobbly brazilian and cut him silly via ellbows or deliver some Jonesesque, swaggering finish right there.
Two or three rounds.

Texiera is just what Jones -and the UFC- needs at that point:
A legitimate, dangerous challenger with just the right style to make the champ feel invincible again.[/quote]

[quote]A-rod wrote:
Regardless of how you score it, it still was a fantastic fight. It was awesome to watch and had me on the edge of my seat. I was angry for a few days as I do believe The Swede was robbed. But I could see how someone might score it in favor of Jones. Their rematch is inevitable so long as Gus doesn’t start sucking all of a sudden.

What I am interested in is others opinions of Jones Vs. Glover. This dude on paper seems great. He has won like 20 straight fights and knocked out Ryan Bader. But I watched a few of this guys fights and there is no way in hell this guy is going to last more then one round with Jones. Glover is unathletic and slow. He has some pretty heavy hands which is how he knocked out Bader who was winning their stand up exchange.

Bader should have won that fight but got sloppy which led to him getting dropped by a lucky punch. Only the last five of Glovers fights have been in the UFC, of which the only win worth mentioning is his last one over Ryan Bader.

So Jones beats Glover TKO during superbowl fight and then Gus gets his rematch. [/quote]

Jones did the most damage and won the most rounds, so to be fair he would of won in pride and ufc.

But even if Gus had won more rounds, Jones landed the far heavier shots. People are so threatened by black America they want the blonde viking to win so bad haha.

(Not implying you are threatened by the way, I just think black superiority is a fear of many fight fans)

I think you are right probably about black superiority being a fear of some fight fans, however I don’t have a fear of black superiority (I’ve long come to terms with the fact that millions of people are better than me at just about everything and it has nothing to do with skin colour) … and i still think gustafson won the fight. I just watched it again, and to be honest i just don’t get how anyone could think jones won that fight, it was close for sure though.

[quote]zenontheterrible wrote:
I think you are right probably about black superiority being a fear of some fight fans, however I don’t have a fear of black superiority (I’ve long come to terms with the fact that millions of people are better than me at just about everything and it has nothing to do with skin colour) … and i still think gustafson won the fight. I just watched it again, and to be honest i just don’t get how anyone could think jones won that fight, it was close for sure though. [/quote]

I didn’t mean to imply that was everyone’s reason for saying Gus won, I just thought that was an overriding theme combat sports and in this fight in particular, there were very irrational displays of hatred for Jones. In fact, when weidman won against Anderson, some of my relatives who couldn’t even be described as casual fans were super pumped that he won, they were clearly getting off on some great white hope thing, made me feel weird.

[quote]AsaAkira13 wrote:

[quote]zenontheterrible wrote:
I think you are right probably about black superiority being a fear of some fight fans, however I don’t have a fear of black superiority (I’ve long come to terms with the fact that millions of people are better than me at just about everything and it has nothing to do with skin colour) … and i still think gustafson won the fight. I just watched it again, and to be honest i just don’t get how anyone could think jones won that fight, it was close for sure though. [/quote]

I didn’t mean to imply that was everyone’s reason for saying Gus won, I just thought that was an overriding theme combat sports and in this fight in particular, there were very irrational displays of hatred for Jones. In fact, when weidman won against Anderson, some of my relatives who couldn’t even be described as casual fans were super pumped that he won, they were clearly getting off on some great white hope thing, made me feel weird. [/quote]

did you ever stop to consider that you’re projecting your own world view onto them?

Very few people like jones because he comes across as narcissistic, not because he’s black lmfao. By your logic people should’ve hated rampage except he was hugely popular.

Also if its a “white” fear why aren’t you saying the same shit about the Brazilian domination of the sport?

[quote]AsaAkira13 wrote:

[quote]zenontheterrible wrote:
I think you are right probably about black superiority being a fear of some fight fans, however I don’t have a fear of black superiority (I’ve long come to terms with the fact that millions of people are better than me at just about everything and it has nothing to do with skin colour) … and i still think gustafson won the fight. I just watched it again, and to be honest i just don’t get how anyone could think jones won that fight, it was close for sure though. [/quote]

I didn’t mean to imply that was everyone’s reason for saying Gus won, I just thought that was an overriding theme combat sports and in this fight in particular, there were very irrational displays of hatred for Jones. In fact, when weidman won against Anderson, some of my relatives who couldn’t even be described as casual fans were super pumped that he won, they were clearly getting off on some great white hope thing, made me feel weird. [/quote]

I actually think you’re right about that. Even if a person isn’t outwardly racist, or think of themselves as racist, its easier to identify with someone who looks similar to you and the people you grew up with. Racism/tribalism and all that are touchy subjects so thats all i think i want to say on the matter.

[quote]Aussie Davo wrote:

[quote]AsaAkira13 wrote:

[quote]zenontheterrible wrote:
I think you are right probably about black superiority being a fear of some fight fans, however I don’t have a fear of black superiority (I’ve long come to terms with the fact that millions of people are better than me at just about everything and it has nothing to do with skin colour) … and i still think gustafson won the fight. I just watched it again, and to be honest i just don’t get how anyone could think jones won that fight, it was close for sure though. [/quote]

I didn’t mean to imply that was everyone’s reason for saying Gus won, I just thought that was an overriding theme combat sports and in this fight in particular, there were very irrational displays of hatred for Jones. In fact, when weidman won against Anderson, some of my relatives who couldn’t even be described as casual fans were super pumped that he won, they were clearly getting off on some great white hope thing, made me feel weird. [/quote]

did you ever stop to consider that you’re projecting your own world view onto them?

Very few people like jones because he comes across as narcissistic, not because he’s black lmfao. By your logic people should’ve hated rampage except he was hugely popular.

Also if its a “white” fear why aren’t you saying the same shit about the Brazilian domination of the sport?[/quote]

Personally for me i used to be a huge jon jones fan, but lost interest in cheering for him after he started to drink his own UFC hype cool-aid. Talking about how he’s gunna be the best figher of all time, and not quite human and all that. Its the same with Silva, I’m still in awe of his abilities, but his arrogance annoys me. To a certain extent it comes with being champion for a long time though i think… its only human to justify your own greatness and superiority over other people… still GSP isn’t like that, and neither is Cain, but they both have those knock out losses to look back on and remind themselves, they are human.

[quote]Aussie Davo wrote:

[quote]AsaAkira13 wrote:

[quote]zenontheterrible wrote:
I think you are right probably about black superiority being a fear of some fight fans, however I don’t have a fear of black superiority (I’ve long come to terms with the fact that millions of people are better than me at just about everything and it has nothing to do with skin colour) … and i still think gustafson won the fight. I just watched it again, and to be honest i just don’t get how anyone could think jones won that fight, it was close for sure though. [/quote]

I didn’t mean to imply that was everyone’s reason for saying Gus won, I just thought that was an overriding theme combat sports and in this fight in particular, there were very irrational displays of hatred for Jones. In fact, when weidman won against Anderson, some of my relatives who couldn’t even be described as casual fans were super pumped that he won, they were clearly getting off on some great white hope thing, made me feel weird. [/quote]

did you ever stop to consider that you’re projecting your own world view onto them?

Very few people like jones because he comes across as narcissistic, not because he’s black lmfao. By your logic people should’ve hated rampage except he was hugely popular.

Also if its a “white” fear why aren’t you saying the same shit about the Brazilian domination of the sport?[/quote]

Because there is a clear difference in white peoples psyche between portugese speaking caramel delicious men from Brazil and genetic gods from America who were molded into the greatest athletes history has ever seen from decades upon decades of the harshest conditions that led to an immense pool of genetic prowess.

White boys aren’t as threatened by Brazilians because they don’t picture them the same way as they do black men, with ten inch cocks stuffing their pretty white girlfriend into the sofa ad gorilla fucking her senseless.

Dr H Newton talked about white fear of black superiority and white people were so angry at it, I have only seen white men react with more vitriol to feminism and homosexuality lol.

My plan is to impregnate a black ghetto chick, mix my white slow twitch shit with her fast twitch and make an epic milk chocolate baby.

Enroll it in grappling and kickboxing classes at an early age.

Wait 25 years, then retire a millionaire.

this is a joke right

I’m being trolled

right?

haha after that last post i’m haveta say yes.

You certainly are. As I believe we all are. I was hoping for some proper discourse when this clown throws race into the mix. That is more a social/psychological/cultural issue then it is a fight issue.

Now to that idiot:

Your logic is impeccable. You are right about white fear of black superiority. You are attempting to address issues that are way beyond your comprehension and most others for that matter.

I love the argument that slavery bred genetically superior humans. Now I am not saying selective breeding could not improve the quality of the progeny/offspring but that is not what happened. I will concede that most likely the most hearty of the group would survive the voyage across the Atlantic. But most hearty does not equate to six foot five and two hundred and fifty lbs specimens or mean that that person has a preferential ratio of fast to slow twitch fibers. Also there are so many factors involved that it is very difficult to make such a claim.

Also you have poor slave owners who could not shell out top dollar for the most robust of slaves. What do they do? They purchase the “runts” of the group, the less robust individuals. So you have struggling plantations with “inferior” product. Now this inferior product is left to procreate at their leisure more or less. So you have inferior product mating with other inferior product to produce a similar product.

Then throw on top of that the fact that you have 160 (post emancipation) years of blacks choosing who they want to mate with. So you having mingling of all the groups for a 160 years. That is over six generations. That would definitely negate any sort of advantage of the selective breeding process that you believed to have happened. This sort of breeding happened far less then you think. Slaves had slave quarters where they pretty much did whatever they wanted. Control over the slaves was not as extensive as most people believe.

By your same logic I could argue that blacks are in significant deficit cognitively when compared to whites. Why you might ask? Oh because surviving the voyage across the Atlantic did not demand any sort of superior intelligence just simple brawn. Also that the blacks once they got here were not selectively bred for intelligence but physical characteristics therefore blacks are intellectually inferior in the same capacity in which you are implying whites are physically inferior to blacks.

Perhaps the differences are cultural but that is not as interesting so no one likes to discuss that. The fact that the majority of blacks come from lower socio-economic class and have a disproportionate amount of emphasis on athletics could be a reason.

My point is humans are not dogs or rats. You can breed for certain traits but it would take a highly controlled breeding program and some time to produce the kind of people that you think the slave trade produced.

Oh and as for 10 inch black cocks stuffing white girlfriends. GTFO with that shit. That is equally ridiculous. I have reviewed that literature and while it does show that people from the continent of Africa are slightly more endowed it is not a very significant difference. It also was a measurement of flaccid length not erect length. Some people are growers not showers. Also at the top of the list were North Africans which would be Moroccans, Algerians, Egyptians Etc. These are considered white people. Egyptians especially where at the top of that list. Oh and one more thing to take into account is the fact that these measurements were self reported. There was no researcher with a ruler measuring dicks which provides a margin for infallibility.

I am biracial before you ask.

So if you want to get back to actually discussing the fight that would be nice.

[quote]Aussie Davo wrote:
this is a joke right

I’m being trolled

right?[/quote]

[quote]AsaAkira13 wrote:

[quote]Aussie Davo wrote:

[quote]AsaAkira13 wrote:

[quote]zenontheterrible wrote:
I think you are right probably about black superiority being a fear of some fight fans, however I don’t have a fear of black superiority (I’ve long come to terms with the fact that millions of people are better than me at just about everything and it has nothing to do with skin colour) … and i still think gustafson won the fight. I just watched it again, and to be honest i just don’t get how anyone could think jones won that fight, it was close for sure though. [/quote]

I didn’t mean to imply that was everyone’s reason for saying Gus won, I just thought that was an overriding theme combat sports and in this fight in particular, there were very irrational displays of hatred for Jones. In fact, when weidman won against Anderson, some of my relatives who couldn’t even be described as casual fans were super pumped that he won, they were clearly getting off on some great white hope thing, made me feel weird. [/quote]

did you ever stop to consider that you’re projecting your own world view onto them?

Very few people like jones because he comes across as narcissistic, not because he’s black lmfao. By your logic people should’ve hated rampage except he was hugely popular.

Also if its a “white” fear why aren’t you saying the same shit about the Brazilian domination of the sport?[/quote]

Because there is a clear difference in white peoples psyche between portugese speaking caramel delicious men from Brazil and genetic gods from America who were molded into the greatest athletes history has ever seen from decades upon decades of the harshest conditions that led to an immense pool of genetic prowess.

White boys aren’t as threatened by Brazilians because they don’t picture them the same way as they do black men, with ten inch cocks stuffing their pretty white girlfriend into the sofa ad gorilla fucking her senseless.

Dr H Newton talked about white fear of black superiority and white people were so angry at it, I have only seen white men react with more vitriol to feminism and homosexuality lol.

My plan is to impregnate a black ghetto chick, mix my white slow twitch shit with her fast twitch and make an epic milk chocolate baby.

Enroll it in grappling and kickboxing classes at an early age.

Wait 25 years, then retire a millionaire.

[/quote]

This is the combat forum, where very knowledgeable people contribute to a wide variety of fighting/survival/ combat issues. Take this filth you wrote over to GAL, where the bullshit is deep and wide, provided by ignorant children with no profession and a keyboard.

[quote]A-rod wrote:
You certainly are. As I believe we all are. I was hoping for some proper discourse when this clown throws race into the mix. That is more a social/psychological/cultural issue then it is a fight issue.

Now to that idiot:

Your logic is impeccable. You are right about white fear of black superiority. You are attempting to address issues that are way beyond your comprehension and most others for that matter.

I love the argument that slavery bred genetically superior humans. Now I am not saying selective breeding could not improve the quality of the progeny/offspring but that is not what happened. I will concede that most likely the most hearty of the group would survive the voyage across the Atlantic. But most hearty does not equate to six foot five and two hundred and fifty lbs specimens or mean that that person has a preferential ratio of fast to slow twitch fibers. Also there are so many factors involved that it is very difficult to make such a claim.

Also you have poor slave owners who could not shell out top dollar for the most robust of slaves. What do they do? They purchase the “runts” of the group, the less robust individuals. So you have struggling plantations with “inferior” product. Now this inferior product is left to procreate at their leisure more or less. So you have inferior product mating with other inferior product to produce a similar product.

Then throw on top of that the fact that you have 160 (post emancipation) years of blacks choosing who they want to mate with. So you having mingling of all the groups for a 160 years. That is over six generations. That would definitely negate any sort of advantage of the selective breeding process that you believed to have happened. This sort of breeding happened far less then you think. Slaves had slave quarters where they pretty much did whatever they wanted. Control over the slaves was not as extensive as most people believe.

By your same logic I could argue that blacks are in significant deficit cognitively when compared to whites. Why you might ask? Oh because surviving the voyage across the Atlantic did not demand any sort of superior intelligence just simple brawn. Also that the blacks once they got here were not selectively bred for intelligence but physical characteristics therefore blacks are intellectually inferior in the same capacity in which you are implying whites are physically inferior to blacks.

Perhaps the differences are cultural but that is not as interesting so no one likes to discuss that. The fact that the majority of blacks come from lower socio-economic class and have a disproportionate amount of emphasis on athletics could be a reason.

My point is humans are not dogs or rats. You can breed for certain traits but it would take a highly controlled breeding program and some time to produce the kind of people that you think the slave trade produced.

Oh and as for 10 inch black cocks stuffing white girlfriends. GTFO with that shit. That is equally ridiculous. I have reviewed that literature and while it does show that people from the continent of Africa are slightly more endowed it is not a very significant difference. It also was a measurement of flaccid length not erect length. Some people are growers not showers. Also at the top of the list were North Africans which would be Moroccans, Algerians, Egyptians Etc. These are considered white people. Egyptians especially where at the top of that list. Oh and one more thing to take into account is the fact that these measurements were self reported. There was no researcher with a ruler measuring dicks which provides a margin for infallibility.

I am biracial before you ask.

So if you want to get back to actually discussing the fight that would be nice.

[quote]Aussie Davo wrote:
this is a joke right

I’m being trolled

right?[/quote][/quote]

You seem irrationally angry.

Also, no it was not the voyage that led to black genetic superiority. It was white americva keeping black people as slaves for so long, working them horrendously, the weak dying of and a truly masterful race emerging, after slavery was abolished this continued with jim crow and black people still pretty much slaves, no access to to the things white people had, this continued to kill off the black people who were weaker.

If you look at the historical writing about the vikings we see the same thing, white giants with blonde and red hair, double the size of the Romans who ran away in fear of the Germanic tribes upon first encounters.

The vikings had to plunder because they lived in such harsh lands, the result was a form of naturally enforced eugenics that led to a genetic level where they all reached a certain stature, like Giraffes did and black people in North America have today.

This stuff really inst up for debate, it is just a fact.

Also on a side note I was being silly because of your response which itself was pretty dumb.

French people have the largest penis on average.

And I still maintain white fear of black superiority is the number one reason white people are desperate to see black champions dethroned throughout the last hundred years of combat sports, particularly in boxing.

White people often try and salvage their self imposed masculine integrity by using the racist throw out of " they are only good at sports like animals chimps etc"

That’s why you see racism most angry nowadays when it is thrown at black intelligentsia like Huey P or N . D Tyson or even a black president, who while he has lots of issues to be criticized on, most often gets hate because of his biracial heritage. It is because while black people are dominating sports, the intellectual leadership needs to be kept in the race of the dominant culture, in lots of people minds.

Jones has received overwhelming hate since becoming champion yet Nick Diaz got massive amounts of support.

Nick Diaz acted cocky and mouthy and proclaimed himself the best in the world, yet Nick did not come close to threatening white masculinity did he. There are some terrific books on the subject that I won’t name because I don’t want people to think I am hawking products.

Jones has one major flaw, He is a black, confident champion who acknowledges how great He is and will go on to be.

The same as Ali was called an uppity this and that in his time. People need to address the racism that persists and flourishes in combat sports. I have black family and black friends and it would be nice to think when they go on to have grandchildren they won’t have to worry about being hated for being great.

But yes lets get back to the fight. How did you actually score the fight?

edit

*“Perhaps the differences are cultural but that is not as interesting so no one likes to discuss that. The fact that the majority of blacks come from lower socio-economic class and have a disproportionate amount of emphasis on athletics could be a reason”

This is the continuation of the enforced only the strong survive. Worse healthcare, worse housing, harder environment, etc etc. The fact some people would as you say not even look at that situation kind of proves my point on the attitude to race.

People don’t like Jones because he is a phony. Diaz is what he is and doesn’t try to be someone else. There is a difference and a lot of people don’t like him either.

Example: Jones spoke about how he will represent the UFC in a dignified manner:

“I’m glad the UFC wanted to work with me, as well. I think they trust that I will never make them look bad. You never have to worry about me getting a DWI or doing something crazy. I think I’m a good company guy.”

Then he crashes his Bentley and gets charged with DUI to which he pled guilty.

I didn’t catch the fight.

I think the reach advantage Jones has will give Glover fits.

Regards,

Robert A

[quote]zecarlo wrote:
People don’t like Jones because he is a phony. Diaz is what he is and doesn’t try to be someone else. There is a difference and a lot of people don’t like him either.

Example: Jones spoke about how he will represent the UFC in a dignified manner:

“I’m glad the UFC wanted to work with me, as well. I think they trust that I will never make them look bad. You never have to worry about me getting a DWI or doing something crazy. I think I’m a good company guy.”

Then he crashes his Bentley and gets charged with DUI to which he pled guilty. [/quote]

I wasn’t aware of the quote. That makes his DUI arrest even worse.

For the record I don’t hate Jones. I kind of “nothing” him as far as personality goes. I think his skill and build can keep him at the top for quite a while.

Regards,

Robert A