Transitioning from Cutting to Bulking

Bigger Stronger Leaner
1

(Long post, sorry guys)

So ive been cutting since close to the beginning of the year, and the last month in particular ive really ratcheted things up. Im finally getting close to where i feel im comfortable stopping, so my tentative plan right now is to continue cutting at the current macros and calories im at until June, and then transition to a relatively lean bulking diet.

Obviously my big fear is that i jump into a bulking diet and a month later i look like i did before i cut. I want to avoid this at all costs, however after over 5 months of dieting down im dying to build back the muscle i lost.

Basically i just want any and all advice that some of the more experienced guys around here have in regards to this. Heres an outline of what my current diet is that has been working very well for me. Im using a carb cycling approach, currently not counting fat;

Low day: 2500 calories/303g protein/71g carbs

Med day: 2640 calories/304g protein/147g carbs

High day: 3600 calories/320g protein/361g carbs

I lift 5 days a week. My workouts are pretty intense. 4 of the 5 days are medium days, and 1 of them is a high day. My two “off” days are low days, and i do fasted morning cardio in the form of taking my dog for a brisk walk that lasts between 35 and 45 minutes on those days.

My current bodyweight is sitting at about 240 at 6’3, and ive been dropping weight steadily with the previously mentioned approach. Im at the point where my top 4 abs are all visible and in general i dont look soft. Unsure of my exact bodyfat.

Here is what my current tentative bulk diet i have drawn up looks like (still carb cycling);

Low day: 3400 cal/348g protein/161g carbs/160g fat

Med day: 4050 cal/347g protein/282g carbs/158g fat

High day: 4725 Cal/378g protein/443g carbs/151g fat

I plan to continue cycling the days the same as i am now while on my cut. On medium days i will only have 12g of carbs before lunch, and on low days although i will be having carbs with breakfast, i will be doing Fasted morning cardio beforehand. In general the food i will be eating is pretty damn healthy, though there will be a fair amount of dairy (Horizon organic whole milk with DHA Omega 3’s) and on high days i will be eating a personal home run inn pizza for dinner. I am allowing myself one cheat meal per week.

How does my fat intake look? I was purposely trying to keep it about the same every day so that i could manipulate the other macros to where i wanted.

Should i ramp up calories slowly during the transition from cutting to bulking? And if so, at what rate would be good to start adding carbs and calories in?

Sorry for the long post but i figure the more detail, i give you, the more you guys can help. Hopefully some experienced people will actually take the time to read all this lol.

Any other information you need, please let me know. I can go into more detail about macro timing and what food selections ill be using if need be.

Any criticisms and advice welcome.

Thanks!

2

Bump

3

From talking to jskrabc and all, along with reading stuff by Layne Norton, Mighty Stu, and even Ebomb and AustinBicep off here, i’d suggest you go slowly. Add in a bit of carbs and/or fats every week, and let yourself build back up to a higher calorie intake.

However, this advice is not only for natural lifters, but also those going from VERY lean to gaining again, at least that’s what I took as their 'audience. So this advice may not apply to you perfectly (not saying these don’t apply to you, just not trying to assume anything).

4

Personaly that’s way too much fat for me with carbs still being pretty high. But I am hoping you know your body

Slowly add in cals. That’s a long cut. 250-500 and then In week see how that went if weight didn’t fly up do it again. Analyze in a week. Repeat until at your macros. But jumping up too fast after a big cut is bad imo

5

You are in a different league than me developmental wise so my thoughts are not too valued ha but just in general what is your fat intake? I could probably work out with the calories you gave but i’m lazy and its exam time :slight_smile:

6

If you’re serious about staying lean on the reverse add 100 cals/day each WEEK. What’s the rush? Condition your metabolism.

I’m serious. Your initial calorie jump is way too much, and you may look awesome for a week or two…fuller, dryer, etc. but then you will “spill over” and be right back where you started.

7

Appreciate the feedback, id really like to get some feedback that relates directly to my macros and carb cycling.

By the way, if the fat seems a little high relative to the carbs, last time i was bulking (which is pretty much since i started) i was eating this pretty much every day and only lifting 4 days a week;

4750 cals
491g carbs
368g protein
160g fat

As you can imagine, my insulin resistance was ridiculous eating this many carbs everyday plus i didnt monitor fat at all. So on the new bulk diet, not only will i be burning significantly more calories, but ill be eating less carbs/cycling and eating cleaner/less calories. However if someone really thinks that the fat needs to come lower to accomodate the carbs, im definitely willing to take that into consideration.

8

[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:
Appreciate the feedback, id really like to get some feedback that relates directly to my macros and carb cycling.
[/quote]

Like how? I recommended adding 100 cals/day. Could be from carbs and/or fat. Doesn’t really matter.

[quote]
By the way, if the fat seems a little high relative to the carbs, last time i was bulking (which is pretty much since i started) i was eating this pretty much every day and only lifting 4 days a week;

4750 cals
491g carbs
368g protein
160g fat

As you can imagine, my insulin resistance was ridiculous eating this many carbs everyday plus i didnt monitor fat at all. So on the new bulk diet, not only will i be burning significantly more calories, but ill be eating less carbs/cycling and eating cleaner/less calories. However if someone really thinks that the fat needs to come lower to accomodate the carbs, im definitely willing to take that into consideration. [/quote]

That’s last bulk. Your body’s used to new cals now. Adjust according to those. You said yourself you’re afraid of jumping too much, so I think you should go with a very conservative approach for your peace of mind.

9

[quote]jskrabac wrote:

[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:
Appreciate the feedback, id really like to get some feedback that relates directly to my macros and carb cycling.
[/quote]

Like how? I recommended adding 100 cals/day. Could be from carbs and/or fat. Doesn’t really matter.

[quote]
By the way, if the fat seems a little high relative to the carbs, last time i was bulking (which is pretty much since i started) i was eating this pretty much every day and only lifting 4 days a week;

4750 cals
491g carbs
368g protein
160g fat

As you can imagine, my insulin resistance was ridiculous eating this many carbs everyday plus i didnt monitor fat at all. So on the new bulk diet, not only will i be burning significantly more calories, but ill be eating less carbs/cycling and eating cleaner/less calories. However if someone really thinks that the fat needs to come lower to accomodate the carbs, im definitely willing to take that into consideration. [/quote]

That’s last bulk. Your body’s used to new cals now. Adjust according to those. You said yourself you’re afraid of jumping too much, so I think you should go with a very conservative approach for your peace of mind. [/quote]

Ive been leaning towards taking an approach of slowly adding calories. So if i take an approach of adding lets say 100 or 200 calories per day every week, im curious as to whether or not people think i can do that until ive built up to the macros/calories i listed for my bulk diet.

10

I’m in no way as big as you, but I am in the same boat. I’ve been dieting down since January and will be probably through June also. I plan on going slow bc last time I did this, I just got fat again. Starting with adding an intraworkout drink on workout days and a larger dinner (I workout at night) every day. Every 2-3 weeks, adjust as necessary. Not worth rushing it. Like a lot of people have been saying, treat your bulk like your cut.

Edit: forgot to mention I’m going to keep eating the same types of foods, just more or less as needed. Not worried about Macros as long as a balanced diet

11

[quote]jskrabac wrote:
If you’re serious about staying lean on the reverse add 100 cals/day each WEEK. What’s the rush? Condition your metabolism.

I’m serious. Your initial calorie jump is way too much, and you may look awesome for a week or two…fuller, dryer, etc. but then you will “spill over” and be right back where you started. [/quote]

This is what ive been thinking too. Im wondering what people think about the total macros and calories ive given for the carb cycling bulk diet though once ive ramped up. So after a couple months of adding calories back in slowly until i reach the numbers ive listed, does it look decent for what my goals are?

To be a little more specific, i understand i will gain a little fat in the process, im not looking to gain solely lean mass as that approach is too slow for me. I just want to keep the fat gain low enough that as i gain weight, people notice that im looking more muscular rather than fatter.

12

Do not go with your initial plan.
That was a 900, 1,400 & 1,100 calorie bump PER DAY!!!
Way too much.
Start slower, like many have said, and bump things up 200 cals a day or so
Do that for a week or two and bump up from that.
Slow and steady, my man.
Slow and steady

13

[quote]Smashingweights wrote:
Do not go with your initial plan.
That was a 900, 1,400 & 1,100 calorie bump PER DAY!!!
Way too much.
Start slower, like many have said, and bump things up 200 cals a day or so
Do that for a week or two and bump up from that.
Slow and steady, my man.
Slow and steady[/quote]

Thats really what the plan is, but i wanna know if its reasonable to take that approach until my calories and macros are eventually bumped up to what i provided.

I know the caloric increase is a lot, but other than the one high day per week, the average increase is about 1000 calories. I chose this because i figured right now i must be in AT LEAST a 500 calorie deficit because of the fast rate i have been losing adipose tissue, so my idea was to eventually ramp calories up until i am at 500 calories over maintenance.

Is the general consensus that this seems a bit unreasonable? Again, I AM PLANNING on ramping calories up slowly, im referring to where they would be after 6 to 8 weeks of slowly adding calories back in.

Thanks again for the input ive received so far.

14

I was just shopping at the grocery store and though im not starting the bulk diet yet, i got some ideas and changed a few small things around. No huge differences but here are upgraded macros that i’d like to ramp up to;

Low day: 3215 cal/351 pro/145 carb/145 fat

Med day: 3900 cal/348 pro/259 carb/151 fat

High day: 4350 cal/371 pro/408 carb/135 fat

Basically cut out a bit of extra sugar and fat so cals are slightly reduced as well as carbs and fats, and protein remained very high.

Im definitely gonna take everyone’s advice and add slowly but this is (tentatively) what im eventually going to be working towards.

15

I’m not sure what you’re looking for here. Everyone has unanimously given you the opinion to slowly add cals back.

ex:

next week: +100 cals

week after: +100 cals

Each week look at bodyweight. If you’re losing, keep adding. If you’re stalling keep adding. If you’re gaining at a steady pace…stay. If you’re gaining too much, scale back.

Week by week. No one knows where you’ll be in 6-8 weeks.

You are way overthinking this at this point.

16
17

[quote]RATTLEHEAD wrote:

Some how i missed that thread, thanks for that one.

18

[quote]jskrabac wrote:
I’m not sure what you’re looking for here. Everyone has unanimously given you the opinion to slowly add cals back.

ex:

next week: +100 cals

week after: +100 cals

Each week look at bodyweight. If you’re losing, keep adding. If you’re stalling keep adding. If you’re gaining at a steady pace…stay. If you’re gaining too much, scale back.

Week by week. No one knows where you’ll be in 6-8 weeks.

You are way overthinking this at this point. [/quote]

Yeah, ive acknowledged this approach several times now…

At this point i was interested to see if anybody had any criticisms for the tentative template i provided for macros and calories. Yes everybody’s different and will respond differently but i was interested to see if anyone who has taken a similar carb cycling approach for bulking would have any criticism or tips regarding the numbers provided.

And i know that adding calories back in slowly will require a good deal of instinctive training here to evaluate how things are going, but i’d like to have some sort of template for reference as an overall “end result” diet to help guide the manner in which i add back macros and foods.

If you feel i’ve received the best feedback im gonna get, so be it. I welcome any other opinions though. I dont think its “over-thinking” to want to explore every piece of advice or criticism i can get. Much of this is for the sake of discussion and to generate new ideas. If bodybuilding was so cut-and-dry it would take all the fun out of it. I appreciate the feedback provided so far though.

19

You probs know more than me but why aren’t you counting your fats? And why aren’t you wanting to cycle fats with the different carb intake, is this norm for carb cycling and I’m just slow?

In shelbys lean gain book he advocates when carb cycling in bulk season:

High Day: 2-4g carbs x bodyweight, 1-1.25g protein x bodyweight, low fat
Medium Day: 1-2g carbs x bodyweight, 1-1.25g protein x bodyweight, 0.25-0.5g fat x bodyweight
Low Day: .5-1g carbs x bodyweight, 1-1.25g protein x bodyweight, 0.25-0.75g fat x bodyweight

For you it would be 240 x bodweight so;

High Day: 480-960g carbs, 240-300g protein, low fat
Medium Day: 240-480g carbs, 240-300g protein, 60-120g fat
Low Day: 120-240g carbs, 240-300g protein, 60 - 180g fat

Currently you are :

Low day: 2500 calories/303g protein/71g carbs
Med day: 2640 calories/304g protein/147g carbs
High day: 3600 calories/320g protein/361g carbs

I think you should scrap your idea and move to shelbys template when wanting to start gaining (at the lower range of grams he suggests though).

Your protein would be staying the same at 300g each day. Carbs would be increased by 50g on low day, 93g on medium day and by nearly 120g on your high days. Since I dont know your fat intake its hard to gauge if that will be way above or below your calories the now and may have to altered to fit.

Start at the lower range of his suggestions then up it to the upper limits when necessary.

20

[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:

[quote]jskrabac wrote:
I’m not sure what you’re looking for here. Everyone has unanimously given you the opinion to slowly add cals back.

ex:

next week: +100 cals

week after: +100 cals

Each week look at bodyweight. If you’re losing, keep adding. If you’re stalling keep adding. If you’re gaining at a steady pace…stay. If you’re gaining too much, scale back.

Week by week. No one knows where you’ll be in 6-8 weeks.

You are way overthinking this at this point. [/quote]

Yeah, ive acknowledged this approach several times now…

At this point i was interested to see if anybody had any criticisms for the tentative template i provided for macros and calories. Yes everybody’s different and will respond differently but i was interested to see if anyone who has taken a similar carb cycling approach for bulking would have any criticism or tips regarding the numbers provided.

And i know that adding calories back in slowly will require a good deal of instinctive training here to evaluate how things are going, but i’d like to have some sort of template for reference as an overall “end result” diet to help guide the manner in which i add back macros and foods.

If you feel i’ve received the best feedback im gonna get, so be it. I welcome any other opinions though. I dont think its “over-thinking” to want to explore every piece of advice or criticism i can get. Much of this is for the sake of discussion and to generate new ideas. If bodybuilding was so cut-and-dry it would take all the fun out of it. I appreciate the feedback provided so far though. [/quote]

The problem is that you won’t know if that end goal works until you get there. It may turn out that the template doesn’t work but you can’t know until you get there.
That is why everyone is suggesting the slow #s, because you’re going to have to adjust as you go and then at some point you’ll have found a balance with macros.