[quote]yorik wrote:
Mad_Duck wrote:
From Page 2 of the article:
NEARLY 10 PERCENT of morbidly obese individuals carry defects in genes that regulate food intake, metabolism, and body weight. The evidence further indicates that the rest of the obese population carries genetic alterations in other, as yet unidentified, single genes or combinations of genes (polygenes) interacting with environmental factors.
Beans is a math guy, so he can check this for us… but wouldn’t the amount of morbidly obese people WITHOUT a valid genetic excuse be greater than 90%. You know, like a one in ten chance that you get to be the ‘lucky’ one?
What’s your point? You don’t need to be a “math guy.” If 10 percents are known to have some defects, that leaves 90 percent without a KNOWN defect. There’s no way to tell how many of the remaining 90 percent have an as-yet unknown defect and how many don’t.[/quote]
the rest of the portion of the article I quoted seems to imply that either:
A) The other 90% have some mystery gene or gene-combination leading to obesity. or
B) Environmental Factors (but still interacting with the mystery gene, which is causing all the obesity)
Now, if by environmental factors they mean a pantry full of crap, and being brainwashed by fast-food advertising, I somewhat agree.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
I saw a homeless extremely obese man today holding a “Help, I’m out of work” sign. I don’t know why, but I am guessing his ability to acquire spare change is greatly reduced as a result.
[/quote]
Part of the problem for fat homeless people though, is that eating healthy is a hell of a lot more expensive than eating crap. Homeless people are often overweight because if you have scrounged up $2 from cans, you can either find a “2 Big Macs for $2” type special or a couple of loaves of cheap white bread. But you can’t get a turkey sandwich with tomatoes, spinach, and thin sliced whole grain bread.
Granted, you could get Apples, and a few other things. So it could be done. But it would take a lot more knowledge that many such people probably don’t have.
I’m not trying to excuse bad choices. Just saying that it is much harder for a homeless person to stay healthy than someone in a better situation.
[quote]jasmincar wrote:
IME if poor people are fat it is mostly because they are stupid. It is like: ‘‘I’ll eat nothing but a snicker bar and a can of coke while I am working and I still cant finish my secondary 2 french course at 18 years old’’ on a 55 hours a week horrible job[/quote]
or maybe it is the fact that healthy food which is marketed to a specialty group of people is alot more expensive than the unhealthy food.
being poor,which do you think is a better choice money wise to feed your family?
alot of poor people are over weight because it does take alot of money to feed yourself right in some cases
[quote]humanjhawkins wrote:
Professor X wrote:
I saw a homeless extremely obese man today holding a “Help, I’m out of work” sign. I don’t know why, but I am guessing his ability to acquire spare change is greatly reduced as a result.
Part of the problem for fat homeless people though, is that eating healthy is a hell of a lot more expensive than eating crap. Homeless people are often overweight because if you have scrounged up $2 from cans, you can either find a “2 Big Macs for $2” type special or a couple of loaves of cheap white bread. But you can’t get a turkey sandwich with tomatoes, spinach, and thin sliced whole grain bread.
Granted, you could get Apples, and a few other things. So it could be done. But it would take a lot more knowledge that many such people probably don’t have.
I’m not trying to excuse bad choices. Just saying that it is much harder for a homeless person to stay healthy than someone in a better situation.[/quote]
[quote]humanjhawkins wrote:
Professor X wrote:
I saw a homeless extremely obese man today holding a “Help, I’m out of work” sign. I don’t know why, but I am guessing his ability to acquire spare change is greatly reduced as a result.
Part of the problem for fat homeless people though, is that eating healthy is a hell of a lot more expensive than eating crap. Homeless people are often overweight because if you have scrounged up $2 from cans, you can either find a “2 Big Macs for $2” type special or a couple of loaves of cheap white bread. But you can’t get a turkey sandwich with tomatoes, spinach, and thin sliced whole grain bread.
Granted, you could get Apples, and a few other things. So it could be done. But it would take a lot more knowledge that many such people probably don’t have.
I’m not trying to excuse bad choices. Just saying that it is much harder for a homeless person to stay healthy than someone in a better situation.[/quote]
WTF?
First, eating two big macs when you don’t know where your next meal is coming from does not turn you into what must have been at least around 300lbs. Second, did you really just go off into some mental fantasy where homeless people care more about WHAT they eat rather than simply THAT they eat?
I think you missed the point if you thought I was criticizing homeless eating patterns.
[quote]Mad_Duck wrote:
From Page 2 of the article:
NEARLY 10 PERCENT of morbidly obese individuals carry defects in genes that regulate food intake, metabolism, and body weight. The evidence further indicates that the rest of the obese population carries genetic alterations in other, as yet unidentified, single genes or combinations of genes (polygenes) interacting with environmental factors.
Beans is a math guy, so he can check this for us… but wouldn’t the amount of morbidly obese people WITHOUT a valid genetic excuse be greater than 90%. You know, like a one in ten chance that you get to be the ‘lucky’ one? [/quote]
Let us bear in mind that if obesity is based on your BMI than most of us should be technically obese or really damn close. Are we included in the 90% or what?
reminds me of getting life insurance and the lady just kept saying quizzically, “but you’re not fat”
I know a woman at work who was morbidly obese (before I knew her) and required a wheelchair to get around, had gastric bypass surgery, lost most of the weight, got married, a new job, enjoying her life for the first time in a long time but now is starting to put weight back on, rapidly. I don’t know why she is heading down the path that brought her so much misery but it is clear to me she is struggling with it and she certainly has a problem. It has hard to watch and reminds me of watching people close to me struggle with alcohol.
I don’t really have a point other than to acknowledge what she is going through is very difficult for her, for whatever reason.
Obesity is simply a pleasurable food addiction. It’s pure hedonism. I view obese people the same way I view crack addicts. They have no self-respect. Treating obese people with drugs, surgery and exercise is like treating a crack addict with psychiatric drugs to ease their comedown - it’s useless. They have to stop using what they are addicted to and let time heal their damaged dopamine systems.
Which came first the hormone issues or the fat?
some it can be either, but then again what food are they putting into their mouth?
I just had my hormones tested, lets see it was adrenals where over stressed, cortisol was upped and now went way down, in turn low testosterone.
I figured this much cause i burnt myself out a bit ago, the candle can burn at both ends for so long.
So saying that, i am also at my leanest, most muscle mass and feel pretty darn good, except for some of the drive that is lacking from low T. 240 and about 12% bf
I eat great, take supps. But its my body saying Slow down, which i am with a cruise to alaska.
Not with 2 Pizzas a 2 litter of coke and some ice cream for breakfast while sucking back tums and pain killers because my fat arm is putting to much pressure on my weak shoulder.
There are some genetics, hince while I could never be a sprinter representing the US, but that doesnt stop me from training to run fast.
Some have more fast twitch fibers, others have more slow twitch fibers.
When i was young i was chunky, I ate the same as my friends, did more physically, and still was chunky. Found out later it was a low thyroid, so i have been taking Iodine, fixed it !!!
I think they needs to start doing studies from birth, feed the babies the same, have them grow up similar but feed one crap and the other good clean foods, check their hormone levels and see which one is fat!
Which brings me to this, Science also says the we happened by the BIG bang (yes i lowercased it for a reason).
So i think science can be very wrong, just to bad its giving people excuses.
[quote]jfreidt wrote:
Notice, too, that the author is a research physician in a genetics lab. It’s in his best interests to make a statement like this, because then he gets more grants and research money to fund further research so that he make more claims to support this, thus getting more money, etc, etc. I completely agree that obesity is totally a choice. 9 months ago, I was 225 at 24% BF; now down to 195 and about 12% BF because I chose to stop making the excuse that I had too much work to do and get out of bed an hour earlier and get my fat ass into the gym. I hate crap like this, and it extends to so many other facets in life. We truly are the excuse generation.[/quote]
There are also plenty of qualified biochemists and scientists that disagree with his assertion quite aggressively. No one is saying genes are completely out of the picture. But it’s quite asinine to say that they’re the WHOLE picture, or even most of the picture in this case.
There are some exceptions to this out there, where they have been struggling their whole lives without binge eating or what-have-you. But they are the vast, vast, vast minority on the bell curve.
[quote]debraD wrote:
I know a woman at work who was morbidly obese (before I knew her) and required a wheelchair to get around, had gastric bypass surgery, lost most of the weight, got married, a new job, enjoying her life for the first time in a long time but now is starting to put weight back on, rapidly.
I don’t know why she is heading down the path that brought her so much misery but it is clear to me she is struggling with it and she certainly has a problem. It has hard to watch and reminds me of watching people close to me struggle with alcohol.
I don’t really have a point other than to acknowledge what she is going through is very difficult for her, for whatever reason.[/quote]
That is a sad story, but it is most likely due to her resorting to her old habits. People comment on how diets eventually fail, well if you go back to your old shitty eating patterns then yes you do.
If you stick with a healthy maintenance diet or set a new goal (prepare for a sport or go on a clean bulk), then you have no direction and inevitably fall back to your old self. You gotta change your brain along with your body.
[quote]MaximusB wrote:
debraD wrote:
I know a woman at work who was morbidly obese (before I knew her) and required a wheelchair to get around, had gastric bypass surgery, lost most of the weight, got married, a new job, enjoying her life for the first time in a long time but now is starting to put weight back on, rapidly.
I don’t know why she is heading down the path that brought her so much misery but it is clear to me she is struggling with it and she certainly has a problem. It has hard to watch and reminds me of watching people close to me struggle with alcohol.
I don’t really have a point other than to acknowledge what she is going through is very difficult for her, for whatever reason.
That is a sad story, but it is most likely due to her resorting to her old habits. People comment on how diets eventually fail, well if you go back to your old shitty eating patterns then yes you do.
If you stick with a healthy maintenance diet or set a new goal (prepare for a sport or go on a clean bulk), then you have no direction and inevitably fall back to your old self. You gotta change your brain along with your body. [/quote]
But what if you can’t just change your brain? Can anyone say for certain you can in all cases? It’s been years since I’ve smoked but I’m still as addicted as ever and all it might take is some shitty life events and a pack of smokes to send me back smoking.
I’m not trying to take away personal responsibility or anything like that because I see people who are skinny fat or carrying muffin tops and fat guts around who are just too lazy to look after themselves. But there are some, like this woman, who are really truly in a battle with themselves.
[quote]debraD wrote:
I don’t know why she is heading down the path that brought her so much misery but it is clear to me she is struggling with it and she certainly has a problem. It has hard to watch and reminds me of watching people close to me struggle with alcohol.[/quote]
Call her out on it (if you think you won’t get fired or something). It may seem and feel mean. And she may not take it right. But I know at least two people, plus myself, who turned that part of their life around when someone had the balls to straight up say “You’re going to get really fat if you keep it up.”
Hearing someone tell me that once, was enough to remind me every night why I was eating cans of green beans for dinner. It brought me back from 20 pounds overweight heading toward 50, to right on target. and years later when I let myself go again, thinking about that incident helped me to call myself out and get back on track.