T Nation

My TRT Story So Far. Need Advice


#1

Hi! I’m TRT-Jon and am new to this website. I’m 27 and have been on trt for about 6 months now. My issue is, I don’t trust my trt doctor and need some advice on what I should do (am I over reacting?,should I dump the doc and get a new one?, take some matters into my own hands? etc). Here is my story.

I started BB at 17. At 18 I started taking the original M5 extreme supplement (the tin can with 36 packets inside) and did an EOD BB routine workout. The supp gave me fast recovery and great pumps. I got huge by 20 y/o. At 22 y/o they took M5 off the shelves and replaced it with the “new and improved” which I hated. It gave me jitters, no pump and slowed my recovery down badly.

At 23 I started to notice I was drastically losing muscle and gaining fat,no energy etc.

Just an fyi I’ve never had morning wood, even as a teenager and my testicles have always been very small.
I had an extremely abusive childhood and my doc said the trauma probably caused a hormone imbalance.

At 26 I lost all my muscle and got chubby while trying desperately to continue BB, trying all kinds of supplements (not steroids). Finally I got checked out for Low T 6 months ag.

My trt doc is someone my mothers friend is close with (he’s an Urologist). When my mother and I walked in, my mother told doc how her best friend is one of his fave patients and he immediately was more interested in helping.

I told him how I felt, my story etc. I noticed he didn’t seem confident in TRT but he wrote a script to take a “total testosterone level” blood test.
btw I did a lot of research on low T and TRT before hand so I wouldn’t be totally blind to what my doc is putting in me (I have trust issues especially with doctors).

He walked in the door with a nervous look on his face and told me I was at 146 for total T and suggested I start taking the gel. I said at a level of 146 I should just take the shots. He agreed and put me on 200mg Test cyp every 2 weeks. I suggested that would make my T levels go up and down and he said Ill be fine and told me to come back 5 weeks from now. I told him my research and knowledge suggests it takes at least 6-8 weeks for the T cyp to start working and he just blabbled some crap that made no sense.

5 weeks later and my total T levels were at 200 (I was write) he suggested he didn’t know why my levels weren’t going up, I said 5 weeks isn’t long enough for the Testosterone to go through my system.

A few weeks later I came back with another test and it was up to roughly 360, total T. He increased my dosage to 200mg every week. I asked what my free Test and estrogen levels were and he said there was no need in checking free T and Estro levels. I told him I was bloated with water weight,low sex drive, sweating a lot but my sweat has no smell (all signs of high Estrogen) he said change my diet.

Few months go by and my total T is now at 630 and a nurse walked in and told me they weren’t going to prescribe me any more Test cyp than 200mg per week. I said I still felt bloated, not really normal, too sore in gym, low libido etc and my body is telling me I need an AI. She said it’s in my head and i need to work on diet.

Im going back in for another test this February. I feel like something isn’t write but I don’t trust these idiots to help me out. The only good thing about this Urologist so far is he charges hardly anything for visits since my mother is friends with his fave patient and he’s prescribed a fairly high amount of T (200mg per week which i hear is unusual) but he won’t check my free T or Estrogen levels which im sure is way too high.

I think my low T is from childhood trauma and probably that product that got me big years ago had pro hormones in it (maybe idk).

I’m afraid to dump this doc and get a new one who might prescribe less Testosterone than 200mg per week. I hear it’s hard to get a good TRT doc who cares and I want to be high as possible for BB reasons but I want to be balanced.
I’m thinking of just having the attitude of “gimme my test and I’ll take care of the rest”.
I split my dosages, 100mg 2 times per week (wed and sat) but still feel bloated with water, e.d low libido etc.
sorry for this being so long, please help me fellas I need some advice :frowning: what should I do?


Lab Work, Blood Testing and Symptoms
#2

Question: are you taking an estrogen blocker, like anastrozole?

Odd that he doesn’t want to check your estrogen - your current symptoms suggest that some of the testosterone is aromitizing into estrogen.

As far as finding a different doc - very hard to find one who will give you 200mg weekly. You might want to find another doc who will look out for your estrogen and see both. Good luck!


#3

There are many idiot docs and urologists seem to be very bad.

Please read these stickies:

  • advice for new guys — note the first paragraph!!!
  • things that damage your hormones - may not apply to your case
  • protocol for injections
  • finding a TRT doc

Labs, please post in list format with ranges:
TT
FT
E2
LH/FSH, do not do on TRT, should have been done prior to TRT. We can expect was low based on your descriptions
prolactin
CBC with hematocrit
cholesterol [could be low]
DHEA-S
TSH

We have many guys here in your age group.


#4

Thanks guys for the feed back. Idk why he won’t check my free T or estrogen levels. I’m not at all on any sort of AI. Even when my total T was very low I was showing signs of high estrogen levels. I think I have low T and high Estrogen. You’re right that it’ll be hard to find a doc who will prescribe that much Testosterone. I get the feeling that my urologist is just trying to get my total T “normal on paper” and leave me at that to cover his own ass or to cover the fact that he doesn’t know what he’s doing. At 200mg every week why are my levels at only 630? I heard 200mg every week gets guys in the 1000 range. Maybe it’s because I’m naturally so low? Does high estrogen effect Total T even with cyp injections? I still have no motivation especially for the gym.

Today is workout day and I am skipping it out of frustration. I think I’m going to keep this doc and buy some aromasin off a web site and take it at 6.25 eod. What do you guys think? doc wouldn’t know since he’s not checking my E levels anyway. Like I said, only good thing about him is he charges like $25 for visits and has me at 200mg per week. Other than that I don’t think he knows what he’s doing.


#5

I forgot to mention. My prolactin is aparently high. at 18.3. At for free test, E2 etc my urologist isn’t testing for anything except for prolactin and total T.


#6

[quote]TRT-Jon wrote:
Thanks guys for the feed back. Idk why he won’t check my free T or estrogen levels. I’m not at all on any sort of AI. Even when my total T was very low I was showing signs of high estrogen levels. I think I have low T and high Estrogen. You’re right that it’ll be hard to find a doc who will prescribe that much Testosterone. I get the feeling that my urologist is just trying to get my total T “normal on paper” and leave me at that to cover his own ass or to cover the fact that he doesn’t know what he’s doing. At 200mg every week why are my levels at only 630? I heard 200mg every week gets guys in the 1000 range. Maybe it’s because I’m naturally so low? Does high estrogen effect Total T even with cyp injections? I still have no motivation especially for the gym.

Today is workout day and I am skipping it out of frustration. I think I’m going to keep this doc and buy some aromasin off a web site and take it at 6.25 eod. What do you guys think? doc wouldn’t know since he’s not checking my E levels anyway. Like I said, only good thing about him is he charges like $25 for visits and has me at 200mg per week. Other than that I don’t think he knows what he’s doing.[/quote]

I think you better get blood work done before you start taking an AI.

Discount labs E2, TT AND FT is about $69 dollars on special right now.


#7

Is there a way I can get my E2 levels checked without my urologists knowledge? I get a funny feeling about him, like he could drop the weekly dosage at any time. I don’t think he likes that I ask questions and do my own research and he gets weird when I ask for a copy of my labs but I am not a jerk to him. I play it cool. I worry he may think I’m an ex gear head and am just looking for legal steroids which I’m not. What I’d like is high as possible testosterone with balanced E levels etc so I can start enjoying the BB life style and I love being big. Anyway… I’d worry that if he caught wind of me doing behind his back lab work he’d probably drop me as a patient or something and I worry he may be the type of guy to say “your estrogen is too high? Simple we’ll just decrease your cyp injections” -__-


#8

SOMETHING ELSE I FORGOT TO MENTION. Apparently my thyroid is fine. The first test I took my doc said my total T was 146 but my cholesterol, thyroid, blood pressure etc etc was fine. I have a copy of my first lab test and don’t know how to read it but he literally said (nervous face included) the good news is your cholesterol, thyroid, blood pressure etc etc is perfectly healthy but your testosterone level is at 146 and your prolactin is high 18.3 and you don’t have a tumor so something is pressing up against the back of your brain but we aren’t sure what" so that’s an update of my first test. Few months ago was my last test which came back as total T 630. Free T unchecked since beginning, Estro levels unchecked since beginning and prolactin still 18.3 and it is supposed to be 15.


#9

(LAB TEST #1)
(DATE 06/11/15)
Fyi it’s from Lab"C" (not sure if I can say the “whole name” of the lab where I get my bloods taken).

(PAGE ONE)

TESTS - RESULT

WBC - 7.1
RBC - 4.95

Hemoglobin - 15.1
Hematocrit - 44.6

MCV - 90
MCH - 30.5

MCHC - 33.9
RDW - 12.5

Platelets - 219
Neutrophils - 45

Lymphs - 43
Monocytes - 8

EOS - 3
Basos - 1

Neutrophils (Absolute) - 3.2
Lymphs (Absolute) - 3.1

Monocytes (Absolute) - 0.6
EOS (Absolute) - 0.2

Baso (Absolute) - 0.0
Immature Granulocytes - 0

Immature Grans (Abs) - 0.0

(BOTTOM OF PAGE ONE)

Comp. Metabolic Panel (14)
Glucose, serum - 80 (mg/dl)

BUN - 21 High (mg/dl)
creatinine, serum - 1.12 (mg/dl)

(PAGE TWO)

TESTS - RESULTS

eGFR If NonAfrican Am - 90
eGFR If African Am - 104

BUN/ Creatinine Ratio - 19
Sodium, serum - 142

Potassium, Serum - 4.0
Chloride, Serum - 100

Carbon Dioxide, Total - 25
Calcium, Serum - 9.7

Protein, Total, Serum - 6.6
Albumin, Serum - 4.2

Globulin, Total - 2.4
A/G Ratio - 1.8

Bilirubin, Total - 0.2
Alkaline Phosphatase, S - 54

AST (SGOT) - 25
ALT (SGPT) - 30

Testosterone, Serum - 146 Low (ng/dl)
TSH - 4.080 (uIU/mL)

Thyroxine (T4) - 5.4 (ug/dl)


#10

(TEST #2)
(DATE 07/21/15)

Testosterone, Serum - 265 LOW (ng/dl)
Prolactin - 18.0 High (ng/ml)

(TEST #3)
(DATE 10/01/15)

Testosterone, Serum - 630 (ng/dl)
Prolactin - 18.3 High (ng/ml)


#11

I am sorry, I don’t have the lab ranges for Labcorp memorized.
You can edit your post above with [edit] in lower LH corner of post above.

You can order your own labs in most “USA States” at LEF.org or some other WW sites, then stick in front of your docs face.

I get the impression that you have not spent days working trough the suggested stickies. You do the work and get more specific.


#12

I understand but I have another lab test coming up soon. I was just trying to give the basics of my experience so far with my doc and see if anyone with experience thinks that I should keep my urologist or not. I’ll do some more reading.


#13

I could not care less about Labcorp’s ranges.
Assuming the ng/dL value is accurate, who cares? What if the population that Labcorp tests for TT turns out to be mostly in their late 30s? Or conversely, the group is primarily made of boys in the throws of puberty? Either way, it would throw off Labcorp’s range for "normal."
In any event, Labcorp’s Reference Interval for TT is 348-1197.


#14

[quote]NeverAlone wrote:
I could not care less about Labcorp’s ranges.
Assuming the ng/dL value is accurate, who cares? What if the population that Labcorp tests for TT turns out to be mostly in their late 30s? Or conversely, the group is primarily made of boys in the throws of puberty? Either way, it would throw off Labcorp’s range for "normal."
In any event, Labcorp’s Reference Interval for TT is 348-1197.[/quote]

There is a lot more that TT that we need to be concerned with.


#15

Thyroxine (T4) - 5.4 (ug/dl)

TSH should be closer to 1.0
T3, T4, fT3 fT4 should be near or a bit above mid-range.

T4=5.4 is low
This might be caused by an iodine deficiency from not using iodized salt and/or vitamins that list iodine+selenium

Need TSH, fT3, fT4

Please check oral body temperatures as per the thyroid basics sticky.

Do you feel cold easily?
General hair thinning?
Outer eyebrows sparse?


#16

I definitely don’t get cold easily. Quite the opposite actually, I get over heated easily but yes my hair has fallen out in the front since 2013.


#17

and btw all he’s test for now is prolactin an TT


#18

Do your own labwork and pay out-of-pocket,


#19

That’s my initial plan. I’m guessing I’ll have to go to a different lab if I don’t want my doc to know I’m doing tests behind his back? and i don’t have insurance so I already am paying out of pocket :confused:


#20

You will want to show those labs to your doc and explain what you want done. Maybe he will not be happy, but this is about your health, not his/her ego.

You can get labs at lef.com | products | blood work
There are other places too.
Some USA states do not allow this.
Then you have to see if there is a lab station near you.

Labs will be cheaper than through your doc.
You will be looking for a male panel, with add-ons as needed.