Conservativedog, you’re my new favorite poster, you say “Liberals” lack imagination and then you point out all the inventive and imaginative things “Conservatives” do (i.e. don’t fuck and drive good old fashioned gas powered cars), you point out that liberals are trying to do uber-gay shit like develop alternative fuels and cure AIDS while you are fairly certain that the best way to fix stuff is to NOT do anything (again very imaginative), I am sure you have a great strategy for reducing teen pregnancy (abstinence anyone?) and a wonderful system for handling whatever other crises are facing America nowadays, but honestly I would prefer if you just added to your extremely informative “Black People That I like” thread, I think that one had real potential.
[quote]groo wrote:
Lol you sound like a fantastic senate candidate throw in that rape is gods gift to women and you can’t lose.[/quote]
LOL! Best post of the thread. At least the best laugh.
[quote]florelius wrote:
[quote]pittbulll wrote:
@florelius I am not going to argue with you . You have your points and I respect them :)[/quote]
Okay I understand, but I need to say my goal wasnt to argue, but to have a discourse and to throw some different perspectives out there and I welcome a discourse beetwen you and me on the subject of what a true conservative is or is not 
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I know , I genuinely like you, I also enjoy civil discourse . The problem is it requires time
[quote]pittbulll wrote:
[quote]florelius wrote:
[quote]pittbulll wrote:
@florelius I am not going to argue with you . You have your points and I respect them :)[/quote]
Okay I understand, but I need to say my goal wasnt to argue, but to have a discourse and to throw some different perspectives out there and I welcome a discourse beetwen you and me on the subject of what a true conservative is or is not
[/quote]
I know , I genuinely like you, I also enjoy civil discourse . The problem is it requires time
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Thanks appreciate it, I like you to especially the fact that you are always positiv and rarely fall down to the infantil levels as others.
I agree that a thoughtfull discoussion takes time and that not always possible.
How to think like a liberal step 1: Abandon reason and logic.
[quote]H factor wrote:
[quote]csulli wrote:
Ew that pic is fucking gross. Did you really need to post that shit? I’m against abortion too, but I don’t see why you people always want to put up these disgusting pictures about it.[/quote]
The problem is the pro life camp fights the battle all wrong. I think we can all agree abortions are largely caused by unwanted pregnancies? How can we limit unwanted pregnancies? Increase use of contraception, teach better sex ed (not hope and a prayer bullshit like abstinence only), educate impoverished people, etc. A LOT of pro lifers are all high and mighty and against this type of stuff (people are only going to have sex to procreate and other fairy tales that they get). THIS is the type of stuff that could REALLY help the issue, instead they oppose all of this and go for the big enchilada Roe vs. Wade which probably won’t be changed in my lifetime.
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The pro-life camp simply realizes that the life you take in an abortion is a human life and no one has the right to take a human life. I don’t have an issue with sex ed and all the other stuff, but the elephant in the room that nobody teaches is personal responsibility. YOU are responsible for YOUR actions. Their is no out, there is no free ride, there is no running away. If you cannot handle the responsibility of your actions, then you have no business doing the action.
[quote]
I find abortion unmoral as well, but I also realize the difference between a winnable battle and a losing one and just how much work could be done by trying to limit the amount of unwanted pregnancies instead of doing stuff like threatening or actually shooting doctors who perform abortions.
Not to mention these pro life people are also usually some of the biggest to hell with education, to hell helping poor people, etc type of cats. I have a friend who calls them pro birth. They want every child to be born, but once they are here fuck em they are on their own to these people. I don’t think that’s very moral either, but perhaps a different debate. [/quote]
We need to teach personal responsibility above all. The focus should be less on how to get away with having sex and not getting pregnant and focus on the fact that the number one cause of pregnancy is sex. If you cannot deal with that, then you have no business doing it. We can teach all the other stuff too, but that has to be paramount. I don’t agree that teaching how to get away with sex with out getting pregnant is more important that teaching that pregnancy is a natural consequence of it.
It should be taught that you cannot run away, get away or hide from this fact. You can take all the precautions you BETTER deal with it. Not dealing with it hurts everybody.
Instead, it seems, that we teach how not to get pregnant and ignore the fact that it can happen. And it if does, oh well, just kill it and move on. But that’s not the end of the story, it never is.
People need to own their behavior, until they do, all the other gymnastics will just move the problem around until there is a hard stop. The people who pay the biggest price of all are the kids.
[quote]pat wrote:<<< How to think like a liberal step 1: Abandon reason and logic.[/quote]I disagree entirely. It is a telling symptom of shallow thought to presume stupidity upon your opponent as the necessary explanation of his error. The wrongest people I can think of are also some the most brilliant. Intelligence unbounded by principle is the very fount of spectacular folly. The greater the former, the greater the latter.
[quote]pat wrote:
The pro-life camp simply realizes that the life you take in an abortion is a human life and no one has the right to take a human life. I don’t have an issue with sex ed and all the other stuff, but the elephant in the room that nobody teaches is personal responsibility. YOU are responsible for YOUR actions. Their is no out, there is no free ride, there is no running away. If you cannot handle the responsibility of your actions, then you have no business doing the action.
We need to teach personal responsibility above all. The focus should be less on how to get away with having sex and not getting pregnant and focus on the fact that the number one cause of pregnancy is sex. If you cannot deal with that, then you have no business doing it. We can teach all the other stuff too, but that has to be paramount. I don’t agree that teaching how to get away with sex with out getting pregnant is more important that teaching that pregnancy is a natural consequence of it.
It should be taught that you cannot run away, get away or hide from this fact. You can take all the precautions you BETTER deal with it. Not dealing with it hurts everybody.
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I agree with most of this, but it’s a little starry eyed. You aren’t going to get rid of all abortions, even if you make them illegal (see the myriad of countries where it is illegal but still happens in back alley type operations). Illegal drugs doesn’t stop people from doing them either. But what CAN lessen abortions is lowering unwanted pregnancies. What is one way we can lower unwanted pregnancies? Keep people from getting pregnant who don’t want to be pregnant. And at least some of that is education and access to contraceptives. Only the wacko religious people who want to legislate morality have a problem with things like condoms, sexual education, birth control. The pro life camp harms themselves in my opinion in this regard.
[quote]H factor wrote:
[quote]pat wrote:
The pro-life camp simply realizes that the life you take in an abortion is a human life and no one has the right to take a human life. I don’t have an issue with sex ed and all the other stuff, but the elephant in the room that nobody teaches is personal responsibility. YOU are responsible for YOUR actions. Their is no out, there is no free ride, there is no running away. If you cannot handle the responsibility of your actions, then you have no business doing the action.
We need to teach personal responsibility above all. The focus should be less on how to get away with having sex and not getting pregnant and focus on the fact that the number one cause of pregnancy is sex. If you cannot deal with that, then you have no business doing it. We can teach all the other stuff too, but that has to be paramount. I don’t agree that teaching how to get away with sex with out getting pregnant is more important that teaching that pregnancy is a natural consequence of it.
It should be taught that you cannot run away, get away or hide from this fact. You can take all the precautions you BETTER deal with it. Not dealing with it hurts everybody.
[/quote]
I agree with most of this, but it’s a little starry eyed. You aren’t going to get rid of all abortions, even if you make them illegal (see the myriad of countries where it is illegal but still happens in back alley type operations). Illegal drugs doesn’t stop people from doing them either. But what CAN lessen abortions is lowering unwanted pregnancies. What is one way we can lower unwanted pregnancies? Keep people from getting pregnant who don’t want to be pregnant. And at least some of that is education and access to contraceptives. Only the wacko religious people who want to legislate morality have a problem with things like condoms, sexual education, birth control. The pro life camp harms themselves in my opinion in this regard.
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I do agree that the only focus of the pro-life movement should be abortion and nothing else. But the movement isn’t over run wth ‘wacko religious people’. That’s like saying the proabortion movement is run by a bunch of ugly, militant lesbians who want to kill with impunity.
I don’t think it’s ‘starry eyed’ to focus on personal responsibility. It’s what needs to happen. It is the cornerstone of the problem. People want to have their cake and eat it to and that can’t be the case as a MO. Teaching only how not to get pregnant ignores the bigger issue of what happens if you do, what do you do? Are you prepared to be a parent? What are you doing to prepare for that if is happens? It’s stupid to hedge your bets as if it can never happen. It does happen, even when steps to prevent it has been taken. Stepping up to the plate is something that needs to be taught. We only teach how to shirk responsibility not how to take it.