Hell. We added that much to the debt in the last 9 years easy.
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Well in this case your underlying belief is that per capita spending shows who is doing it right. You canât judge âbetterâ, âworseâ, ârightâ, âwrongâ without having a criteria to do so. And youâre beliefs provides that criteria.
Someone else thinks that âdoing it rightâ means having a higher percentage of successful treatments. Someone else thinks it should be percentage of treatments compared to per capita cost. Someone else thinks that all of these should be used. Someone else thinks blah blah blah - you get the point
Anyone who subscribes to a belief system is brainwashed. Anyone that doesnât is ignorant. Thatâs why I avoid labels.
If you have ever seen an advertisement, you have been brainwashed. If you have ever purchased anything as a result of an advertisement, you have been severely brainwashed. Welcome to the club. Now try and be nice about it
Iâm still waiting for the actual per capita numbers of single payer Zep is always bragging about. Iâve asked like 4 times and he still canât produce per capita numbers from EU and USA
AS USUAL, NO ANSWER. Oh wait, you did answer the medicinal cannabis question that went something like âI donât care as I wouldnât cry over yesterdayâs spilled milkâ. And youâre not even embarrassed by some lame as answer.
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Yes, youâre right Iâm just a shill for Big Pharma. And what leads you to that conclusion?
Who funds The Cato Institiute?
The Cato Institute is an American libertarian think tank headquartered in Washington, D.C. It was founded as the Charles Koch Foundation in 1974 by Ed Crane, Murray Rothbard, and Charles Koch,[6]
Surprise, surprise!
The Cato Institute would be well advised to look at the world evidence. But this would conclude against their paymasters. So it canât be done. Do not follow the evidence, twist the evidence so that it comes out to be beneficial to our financial ends. This is what an ideology directs one to do. Fold and shape the truth no matter what until you come out with a âstudyâ that you like.
Would this make a difference?
All estimates are of the costs of military operations only and do not include costs of veterans benefits, interest paid for borrowing money to finance wars, or assistance to allies.
Your constant spouting of alt left propaganda. You turn people so far away from your views it actually helps them. Dead serious. Big companies (pharma, ISPs, energy, etcetc) absolutely love crackpots like you. They donât have to convince anyone of anything. They just have to wait for you to say enough stupid shit that people oppose you on principle.
Otoh, I am still waiting for you to provide current per capita HC costs both here and in the EU along with expected per capita costs should America go the single payer route.
Iâve only asked for you to back up that statement like 4-5 times so far. If you donât actually have supporting evidence just let me know.
Whatever gets one closer to the truth is the one who is right. Are you saying itâs impossible to discern the truth?
So the person who espouses a belief system that goes against reality is in the same field as someone who follows the evidence and truth?
Here are some estimates from the 90âs up to 2012.
http://www.pnhp.org/facts/single-payer-system-cost
A comparison of other countries with some form of single-payer and the glorious for profit system in the U.S.
Donât ever remembering you asking.
No. I read that but to try to assess and estimate the costs of all those items is exponentially more complex than estimating the direct cost of wars, which is already complicated. You wouldnât be able to follow the conversation or the methods and I wouldnât have the patience to explain it 1001 times.
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Belief systems are systems. Some are closer to the truth than others. Some are more complicated systems than others. Some are needlessly overcomplicated. Some are overly simplistic. But the beauty of it is also that for the person using it - itâs just right
Getting closER to the truth is much different than having arrived. We should all continue to march closer. And help each other do the same
Yes. We are all on the same field. All belief systems go against reality at least some of the time. Reality doesnât fit into a neatly packageable, comprehendible system
So first thing first. Iâm sure youâre aware, but 6 year old data in an industry as volatile as HC is worthless. 6 year old data in non volatile industries is usually also garbage, but not always.
So from your decisiondata.org link,
One of the things you ABSOLUTELY need to let go is this concept of UHC being âcheaper.â Youâre constantly arguing the wrong numbers to the wrong people. UHC in America will UNDENIABLY make taxes go up, they simply have to (from your links above even).
The next thing is you not seeming to understand who pays said taxes. As a large % of taxpayers (ie, the people who + into the govt each year after filing taxes) are also outside the range of qualifying for government assistance, a UHC concept is 1000% going to result in less money in their pockets (due to the need for increased taxes).
That means, I, personally, will pay more taxes in a UHC world. I will spend more of my money supporting other people. FWIW, Iâm alright with that, as Iâm a supporter of a single payer structure. Other people arenât required to feel how I feel. I know exactly what I spend per capita in my household, and itâs far lower than any EU per capita cost you can deliver. But Iâm young and healthy.
Next. Without you diving into the current health state of Americans vs EU (because we have a ton of stupid fat lazy people in this country), pretending like the PER CAPITA costs will decrease by as much as they did in the EU just canât be backed up with math.
From this article
This means, for those of us that actually pay taxes, outcomes (on average) are going to decrease and wait times (on average) are going to increase. What you need to understand, is thatâs alright. With proper preventative care, thereâs statistically very low chances of anyone needing anything âemergencyâ but also stuck in a wait time (which will inevitably happen because we have a lot of fat stupid lazy people).
The takeaway here is UHC isnât best for EVERYONE. Itâs best for most people. So when a lot of people say they donât want UHC because they get better care now, theyâre correct. Quit dodging peoples VALID complaints of a system that will put them at a disadvantage compared to now.
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Can confirm. Before I didnât like UHC because I know corrupt/incompetent politicians will do it wrong and people will die needlessly.
Now I donât want UHC because Zep wants it. 
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Who funds all your bullshit? Mouth breathers like you.
*Two posts later you link to pnhp⊠Lol, clown show as usual.
This is you to the letter. How you donât see that is hilarious.
Great post. Weâve explained all of this to him already. His next post will ignore everything you just wrote for his typical talking points.
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One other thing to consider (that has been brought up before). In the US employers shoulder a significant portion of the insurance burden where they pay the provider. Iirc, my employer covers roughly 80% of my total premiums. I might pay $2k they pay like 10k. Transforming that into a pass through tax on employers is going to CRUSH small businesses unless Congress structures the tax policy right (lol).
Not only will my tax bill go exponentially, but so will all the small businesses tax through entities that employ something like 80% of the workforce.
Now, Dum Dumb, will say something about âplain corporationsâ paying their fair share of taxes, but, of course, he wonât understand that a) C corps make up a very small portion of US businesses b) the # of C corps continues to decline as it has for sometime (havenât checked this recently. The trend could have stabilized or reversed), and/or c) issuers have a lot more flexibility in regards to tax planning/strategy (meaning their criteria for capital project could change and they might invest more into capital projects as a tax avoidance strategy for example). Small businesses simply canât do this.
Add in the pending ruling on the internet sales tax and weâre setting the backbone of our economy up for a big hit. Something he probably loves, but thatâs because he has no idea what a true socialist state would be like.
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This whole post was on the money, and I particularly loved this bit. I think having a reasonable conversation about UHC (ROFL, never happen) sans our resident crazy would be interesting.
One thing USMC brings up wrt employer healthcare cost is really seriousâŠIâd be interested in your take on it
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If you honestly believe that veterans problems when coming home wouldnât or is not a cost to be calculated in regards to war you are either incredibly stupid or naĂŻve. Maybe both. Because it may be complicated doesnât mean it doesnât count.
To think there is such a thing as homeless veterans in this country ought to be a crime. Especially when you consider the amount of money spent in terms of the military.