Crime Scenarios & What to Do

Off Topic
41

[quote]Claudan wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]Claudan wrote:
This.[/quote]

Yep you play the kickball.

Edit: You have a hearing problem?[/quote]

Nah, that’s called being a boss after you help your team win. Apparently, you’ve never had that happen to you.[/quote]

Being a boss? Also never seen anyone running around holding their ears as a celebration. Usually they carry you off the field on their shoulders. I opened holes for my running back to run through for touchdowns. My running back knew who made him “the boss”.

I guess you put the I in team.

42

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

[quote]StevenF wrote:

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

[quote]batman730 wrote:
Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer. At all.
[/quote]

Then don’t give out legal advice.[/quote]

Says the guy that told someone that’s depressed to take LSD. [/quote]

I’ve been depressed before and I’ve taken LSD on multiple occasions. Unless the Batman has made an argument in front of a judge defending or prosecuting a client, I’m infinitely more qualified to hand out advice about avant garde depression-fighting techniques than he is to hand out advice about the legality of anything. [/quote]

Again, I gave the OP no “advice” beyond familiarizing himself with his local legislation and understanding all the risks (physical, moral and legal) and make his own, internal determinations as to what is or isn’t worth it before he forms a plan of action for a given scenario. If you think this is bad advice, by all means tell us why, I’d love to know. I expanded upon my understanding of the laws I live under in hopes of illustrating that it’s a complex issue with few easy, black and white answers. Again, none of this is to be construed as legal advice. It’s a conversation.

As to my qualification to comment at all, I am a Sworn Peace Officer (Reserve) and Special Municipal Constable. I have some training and a passing familiarity with Criminal Code statutes as they pertain to powers of arrest and the application of force. I have, on occasion, been involved in the of making arrests and the application of force. I am by no means an authority on the subject (and didn’t hold myself out as such), but I am not exactly ignorant on the topic either. I am, perhaps, less qualified to comment on legal issues than someone who has been depressed and taken LSD is to give medical advice, but I’m not sure that I’m infinitely less qualified.

Idaho, with his far superior base of experience to draw upon, gives far better advice IMO, as does WN76. Yet presumably neither of them are practicing attorneys either, they just arrest people for a living. That’s great. It’s how these boards are supposed to work, I thought.

Anyway, OP be smart, be safe.

Edited for clarity.

43

[quote]WN76 wrote:

[quote]batman730 wrote:

[quote]WN76 wrote:
Like idaho said, develop your own terms of action. They should be limited to your loved ones and the truly helpless people out there. You don’t want to expose yourself to unnecessary risk for people you don’t know. Sometimes shitty things happen and you can’t do anything about it.

In my hometown’s bar district, it’s common for a group of thugs to have one guy (usually a smaller one) in the group grab the ass of a woman walking with a man. The others stand back, and wait for the man to confront the small guy. This usually results in a swarm and the beating of the guy who thought it was just some small punk trying to get a piece of his woman’s ass.

[/quote]

We had a rash of this type of thing a few years ago. A co worker of mine caught a pretty decent beating in basically exactly that scenario. Just because something is “right” doesn’t necessarily make it a good idea.

[/quote]

If you don’t mind me asking, how far up the island are you? If you don’t want to disclose that info, I understand completely.
[/quote]

I don’t mind you asking. I’m South Island. Beyond that I prefer to imagine that my comments on these boards are somewhat anonymous, and the Island is a small place.

If you don’t mind my asking, is there a particular reason that you’re asking?

44

[quote]batman730 wrote:

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

[quote]StevenF wrote:

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

[quote]batman730 wrote:
Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer. At all.
[/quote]

Then don’t give out legal advice.[/quote]

Says the guy that told someone that’s depressed to take LSD. [/quote]

I’ve been depressed before and I’ve taken LSD on multiple occasions. Unless the Batman has made an argument in front of a judge defending or prosecuting a client, I’m infinitely more qualified to hand out advice about avant garde depression-fighting techniques than he is to hand out advice about the legality of anything. [/quote]

Again, I gave the OP no “advice” beyond familiarizing himself with his local legislation and understanding all the risks (physical, moral and legal) and make his own, internal determinations as to what is or isn’t worth it before he forms a plan of action for a given scenario. If you think this is bad advice, by all means tell us why, I’d love to know. I expanded upon my understanding of the laws I live under in hopes of illustrating that it’s a complex issue with few easy, black and white answers. Again, none of this is to be construed as legal advice. It’s a conversation.

As to my qualification to comment at all, I am a Sworn Peace Officer and Special Municipal Constable. I have some training and a passing familiarity with Criminal Code statutes as they pertain to powers of arrest and the application of force. I have, on occasion, been involved in the of making arrests and the application of force. I am by no means an authority on the subject (and didn’t hold myself out as such), but I am not exactly ignorant on the topic either. I am, perhaps, less qualified to comment on legal issues than someone who has been depressed and taken LSD is to give medical advice, but I’m not sure that I’m infinitely less qualified.

Idaho, with his far superior base of experience to draw upon, gives far better advice IMO, as does WN76. Yet presumably neither of them are practicing attorneys either, they just arrest people for a living. That’s great. It’s how these boards are supposed to work, I thought.

Anyway, OP be smart, be safe.[/quote]

You’re a constable? I thought you were a vigilante operating without any sort of official sanction of law enforcement.

And you could definitely win in a fight with Ironman.

45

The thing about crime and trying to stop it that concerns me is that you never really know what the person committing the crimes tendency or limits of violence may be.

Just because someone is committing a petty crime doesn’t mean that they won’t kill or seriously hurt you if you try to stop them.

46

[quote]pushharder wrote:

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:

[quote]StevenF wrote:

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

[quote]batman730 wrote:
Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer. At all.
[/quote]

Then don’t give out legal advice.[/quote]

Says the guy that told someone that’s depressed to take LSD. [/quote]

And this is why I love this site…[/quote]
Tutu Bert definitely helps the TN earth rotate on its axis.
[/quote]

What the hell, DB lost another bet already?

47

[quote]WN76 wrote:
In my hometown’s bar district, it’s common for a group of thugs to have one guy (usually a smaller one) in the group grab the ass of a woman walking with a man. The others stand back, and wait for the man to confront the small guy. This usually results in a swarm and the beating of the guy who thought it was just some small punk trying to get a piece of his woman’s ass.
[/quote]

Call me ignorant… But why? Are they just looking to beat the shit out of someone and this is how they get him to be the one who “started it?” Or do they want to beat up someone who is trying to do the “right thing?”

If they’re just looking to beat up some poor mark, why not just go beat someone up?

This sounds awfully Clockwork Orange to me.

48

[quote]SkyzykS wrote:
The thing about crime and trying to stop it that concerns me is that you never really know what the person committing the crimes tendency or limits of violence may be.

Just because someone is committing a petty crime doesn’t mean that they won’t kill or seriously hurt you if you try to stop them.

[/quote]

This.

49

It’s really a case by case thing. With regards the example featured in the Op…I dunno!!

Thing is though, (in britain at least), MOST muggers, random yobs lookin for trouble, habitual criminals especially etc are almost always NOT the kind of people to pursue legal action.

The usual, worst case scenario when it comes to defending yourself/someone else against some idiot is…other idiots jump in & you wake up in hospital.

So, yeah, with regards the OP I dunno, with regards other situations, I feel confident enough in my own abilities to know when to intervene & when to just stand back & observe.

50

[quote]Lonnie123 wrote:

[quote]WN76 wrote:
In my hometown’s bar district, it’s common for a group of thugs to have one guy (usually a smaller one) in the group grab the ass of a woman walking with a man. The others stand back, and wait for the man to confront the small guy. This usually results in a swarm and the beating of the guy who thought it was just some small punk trying to get a piece of his woman’s ass.
[/quote]

Call me ignorant… But why? Are they just looking to beat the shit out of someone and this is how they get him to be the one who “started it?” Or do they want to beat up someone who is trying to do the “right thing?”

If they’re just looking to beat up some poor mark, why not just go beat someone up?

This sounds awfully Clockwork Orange to me.[/quote]

I have no idea why they actually do it, but it’s probably because they are drunk, like grabbing asses, and then fighting people who have a problem with it. Maybe it’s a power thing and they enjoy humiliating the victims. All I know is when I’m back home, I avoid this area like the plague.

51

[quote]batman730 wrote:

[quote]WN76 wrote:

[quote]batman730 wrote:

[quote]WN76 wrote:
Like idaho said, develop your own terms of action. They should be limited to your loved ones and the truly helpless people out there. You don’t want to expose yourself to unnecessary risk for people you don’t know. Sometimes shitty things happen and you can’t do anything about it.

In my hometown’s bar district, it’s common for a group of thugs to have one guy (usually a smaller one) in the group grab the ass of a woman walking with a man. The others stand back, and wait for the man to confront the small guy. This usually results in a swarm and the beating of the guy who thought it was just some small punk trying to get a piece of his woman’s ass.

[/quote]

We had a rash of this type of thing a few years ago. A co worker of mine caught a pretty decent beating in basically exactly that scenario. Just because something is “right” doesn’t necessarily make it a good idea.

[/quote]

If you don’t mind me asking, how far up the island are you? If you don’t want to disclose that info, I understand completely.
[/quote]

I don’t mind you asking. I’m South Island. Beyond that I prefer to imagine that my comments on these boards are somewhat anonymous, and the Island is a small place.

If you don’t mind my asking, is there a particular reason that you’re asking?[/quote]

I remember reading you were from the Island. I spent about a month there a few years ago. I was curious if I had visited your area. From reading your posts, I always had a suspicion that you were LE of some type. Your other post confirms it.

BTW, I always enjoy reading your posts.

52

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

[quote]batman730 wrote:

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

[quote]StevenF wrote:

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

[quote]batman730 wrote:
Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer. At all.
[/quote]

Then don’t give out legal advice.[/quote]

Says the guy that told someone that’s depressed to take LSD. [/quote]

I’ve been depressed before and I’ve taken LSD on multiple occasions. Unless the Batman has made an argument in front of a judge defending or prosecuting a client, I’m infinitely more qualified to hand out advice about avant garde depression-fighting techniques than he is to hand out advice about the legality of anything. [/quote]

Again, I gave the OP no “advice” beyond familiarizing himself with his local legislation and understanding all the risks (physical, moral and legal) and make his own, internal determinations as to what is or isn’t worth it before he forms a plan of action for a given scenario. If you think this is bad advice, by all means tell us why, I’d love to know. I expanded upon my understanding of the laws I live under in hopes of illustrating that it’s a complex issue with few easy, black and white answers. Again, none of this is to be construed as legal advice. It’s a conversation.

As to my qualification to comment at all, I am a Sworn Peace Officer and Special Municipal Constable. I have some training and a passing familiarity with Criminal Code statutes as they pertain to powers of arrest and the application of force. I have, on occasion, been involved in the of making arrests and the application of force. I am by no means an authority on the subject (and didn’t hold myself out as such), but I am not exactly ignorant on the topic either. I am, perhaps, less qualified to comment on legal issues than someone who has been depressed and taken LSD is to give medical advice, but I’m not sure that I’m infinitely less qualified.

Idaho, with his far superior base of experience to draw upon, gives far better advice IMO, as does WN76. Yet presumably neither of them are practicing attorneys either, they just arrest people for a living. That’s great. It’s how these boards are supposed to work, I thought.

Anyway, OP be smart, be safe.[/quote]

You’re a constable? I thought you were a vigilante operating without any sort of official sanction of law enforcement.

And you could definitely win in a fight with Ironman.[/quote]

Well, I eventually had to get sworn for insurance reasons. The liability on vigilantism is horrendous.

No comment on the Ironman issue.

53

[quote]WN76 wrote:

[quote]batman730 wrote:

[quote]WN76 wrote:

[quote]batman730 wrote:

[quote]WN76 wrote:
Like idaho said, develop your own terms of action. They should be limited to your loved ones and the truly helpless people out there. You don’t want to expose yourself to unnecessary risk for people you don’t know. Sometimes shitty things happen and you can’t do anything about it.

In my hometown’s bar district, it’s common for a group of thugs to have one guy (usually a smaller one) in the group grab the ass of a woman walking with a man. The others stand back, and wait for the man to confront the small guy. This usually results in a swarm and the beating of the guy who thought it was just some small punk trying to get a piece of his woman’s ass.

[/quote]

We had a rash of this type of thing a few years ago. A co worker of mine caught a pretty decent beating in basically exactly that scenario. Just because something is “right” doesn’t necessarily make it a good idea.

[/quote]

If you don’t mind me asking, how far up the island are you? If you don’t want to disclose that info, I understand completely.
[/quote]

I don’t mind you asking. I’m South Island. Beyond that I prefer to imagine that my comments on these boards are somewhat anonymous, and the Island is a small place.

If you don’t mind my asking, is there a particular reason that you’re asking?[/quote]

I remember reading you were from the Island. I spent about a month there a few years ago. I was curious if I had visited your area. From reading your posts, I always had a suspicion that you were LE of some type. Your other post confirms it.

BTW, I always enjoy reading your posts.

[/quote]

Cool. Where have you been on the Island?

Yeah, I am LE, but as a Reserve I only work part time (in my case about 30 hrs a month) on a volunteer basis. We don’t carry firearms, just batons and OC, so we always have a Regular Member as armed overrwatch when we’re on patrol/enforcement duties, but it allows you to get an extra body on scene to lend a hand. We also do community policing/crime prevention stuff (block watch, personal safety and fraud prevention presentations etc.) and assist in the training of our Regular members.

Policing is brutally competitive to get into here and, while it’s not an official requirement, the Reserve program can potentially really help in the hiring process. It also gets you out there getting some experience and allows you to determine if it really is for you before you get hired, go to the academy etc, etc only to find out it’s not a good fit.

I enjoy reading your posts as well.

54

[quote]illadelphia91 wrote:

This article makes me want to find out what is okay and what it not okay to do when you’re faced with someone doing a criminal act

There have been times on the subway where I see people get their phones snatched and a buddy of mine once got punched in the face for no apparent reason (wasn’t there to witness it). I have never been in situations where I could do anything about it, but if I were I am curious as to what I am allowed to do without facing any lawsuits.

If a guy steals a phone, am I allowed to tackle him and hold him until the police come? What if I break his arm when trying to tackle him?

You may be a "good citizen and apprehend him. I’d caution that you better have seen it happen if you do this- don’t just tackle some guy because people are yelling and pointing at him. If he struggles and his arm breaks, you’re not going to be in trouble for that- as far as police are concerned. The their can always file a suit against you later, because that’s the world we live in. If you tackle him, then while holding him decide you’re going to teach him a lesson and break the arm, different story.

If I see a cop struggling to arrest someone, is it okay for me to help him out?

Yes, in fact if you feel safe doing so, you may NEED to help. Keep in mind, you need to be careful. There could be a weapon involved that you don’t see- you could rush to help get control of the subjects arm/hand and find that there’s a gun waiting there that you didn’t see. This will be case by case and you’ll just have to use your judgement in the moment. If you rush in to help, act fast but make your intentions VERY clear by saying loud and clear, over and over “OFFICER IM HERE TO HELP YOU” or something like that. Once cuffs are on, keep your hands on the subject to help keep control, ask officer if they’re ok- this will help them remember you were helping them- and you’re not another bad guy. Then follow whatever directions they give you.

Or with the San Francisco video recently posted, obviously that guy was harassing people, but would it be okay for me to punch him?

What if a guy grabs my girls ass… Am I really expected to do nothing about it?

That’s a sexual assault, an arrestable offense. You may detain him, but you’ll have to resist your urge to beat his ass. If you assault the original assaulter, they dot cancel each other out.

I know these are a lot of hypothetical situations, but it seems that people are always in fear of doing the right thing because of the possibility of being sued.

[/quote]

I don’t know how to split this up, my answers are above between the spaces. Lastly- be careful- you are not batman.

55

[quote]batman730 wrote:

[quote]WN76 wrote:

[quote]batman730 wrote:

[quote]WN76 wrote:

[quote]batman730 wrote:

[quote]WN76 wrote:
Like idaho said, develop your own terms of action. They should be limited to your loved ones and the truly helpless people out there. You don’t want to expose yourself to unnecessary risk for people you don’t know. Sometimes shitty things happen and you can’t do anything about it.

In my hometown’s bar district, it’s common for a group of thugs to have one guy (usually a smaller one) in the group grab the ass of a woman walking with a man. The others stand back, and wait for the man to confront the small guy. This usually results in a swarm and the beating of the guy who thought it was just some small punk trying to get a piece of his woman’s ass.

[/quote]

We had a rash of this type of thing a few years ago. A co worker of mine caught a pretty decent beating in basically exactly that scenario. Just because something is “right” doesn’t necessarily make it a good idea.

[/quote]

If you don’t mind me asking, how far up the island are you? If you don’t want to disclose that info, I understand completely.
[/quote]

I don’t mind you asking. I’m South Island. Beyond that I prefer to imagine that my comments on these boards are somewhat anonymous, and the Island is a small place.

If you don’t mind my asking, is there a particular reason that you’re asking?[/quote]

I remember reading you were from the Island. I spent about a month there a few years ago. I was curious if I had visited your area. From reading your posts, I always had a suspicion that you were LE of some type. Your other post confirms it.

BTW, I always enjoy reading your posts.

[/quote]

Cool. Where have you been on the Island?

Yeah, I am LE, but as a Reserve I only work part time (in my case about 30 hrs a month) on a volunteer basis. We don’t carry firearms, just batons and OC, so we always have a Regular Member as armed overrwatch when we’re on patrol/enforcement duties, but it allows you to get an extra body on scene to lend a hand. We also do community policing/crime prevention stuff (block watch, personal safety and fraud prevention presentations etc.) and assist in the training of our Regular members.

Policing is brutally competitive to get into here and, while it’s not an official requirement, the Reserve program can potentially really help in the hiring process. It also gets you out there getting some experience and allows you to determine if it really is for you before you get hired, go to the academy etc, etc only to find out it’s not a good fit.

I enjoy reading your posts as well.
[/quote]

I was in the Victoria area mostly, but made a trip up to Nanaimo to visit friends. I loved my time on the Island and hope to return someday.

Yea, it’s really hard to get hired right now. Unless you’re a female or a visible minority, you really have to stand out as an applicant. Even then, it’s still a coin toss. I have a buddy out your way in the process with a few muni services and the RCMP. How far are you willing to relocate?

56

[quote]Lonnie123 wrote:

[quote]WN76 wrote:
In my hometown’s bar district, it’s common for a group of thugs to have one guy (usually a smaller one) in the group grab the ass of a woman walking with a man. The others stand back, and wait for the man to confront the small guy. This usually results in a swarm and the beating of the guy who thought it was just some small punk trying to get a piece of his woman’s ass.
[/quote]

Call me ignorant… But why? Are they just looking to beat the shit out of someone and this is how they get him to be the one who “started it?” Or do they want to beat up someone who is trying to do the “right thing?”

If they’re just looking to beat up some poor mark, why not just go beat someone up?

This sounds awfully Clockwork Orange to me.[/quote]

Everytime I have seen these types of idiots, they’re doing it to impress a woman or a number of them.

Yes you may find this beyond stupid but it is real. You may not see the women because they’re a fair distance away but its always for pussy.

“yeah we beat that guy, now blow me”. And it works.

57

[quote]WN76 wrote:

[quote]batman730 wrote:

[quote]WN76 wrote:

[quote]batman730 wrote:

[quote]WN76 wrote:

[quote]batman730 wrote:

[quote]WN76 wrote:
Like idaho said, develop your own terms of action. They should be limited to your loved ones and the truly helpless people out there. You don’t want to expose yourself to unnecessary risk for people you don’t know. Sometimes shitty things happen and you can’t do anything about it.

In my hometown’s bar district, it’s common for a group of thugs to have one guy (usually a smaller one) in the group grab the ass of a woman walking with a man. The others stand back, and wait for the man to confront the small guy. This usually results in a swarm and the beating of the guy who thought it was just some small punk trying to get a piece of his woman’s ass.

[/quote]

We had a rash of this type of thing a few years ago. A co worker of mine caught a pretty decent beating in basically exactly that scenario. Just because something is “right” doesn’t necessarily make it a good idea.

[/quote]

If you don’t mind me asking, how far up the island are you? If you don’t want to disclose that info, I understand completely.
[/quote]

I don’t mind you asking. I’m South Island. Beyond that I prefer to imagine that my comments on these boards are somewhat anonymous, and the Island is a small place.

If you don’t mind my asking, is there a particular reason that you’re asking?[/quote]

I remember reading you were from the Island. I spent about a month there a few years ago. I was curious if I had visited your area. From reading your posts, I always had a suspicion that you were LE of some type. Your other post confirms it.

BTW, I always enjoy reading your posts.

[/quote]

Cool. Where have you been on the Island?

Yeah, I am LE, but as a Reserve I only work part time (in my case about 30 hrs a month) on a volunteer basis. We don’t carry firearms, just batons and OC, so we always have a Regular Member as armed overrwatch when we’re on patrol/enforcement duties, but it allows you to get an extra body on scene to lend a hand. We also do community policing/crime prevention stuff (block watch, personal safety and fraud prevention presentations etc.) and assist in the training of our Regular members.

Policing is brutally competitive to get into here and, while it’s not an official requirement, the Reserve program can potentially really help in the hiring process. It also gets you out there getting some experience and allows you to determine if it really is for you before you get hired, go to the academy etc, etc only to find out it’s not a good fit.

I enjoy reading your posts as well.
[/quote]

I was in the Victoria area mostly, but made a trip up to Nanaimo to visit friends. I loved my time on the Island and hope to return someday.

Yea, it’s really hard to get hired right now. Unless you’re a female or a visible minority, you really have to stand out as an applicant. Even then, it’s still a coin toss. I have a buddy out your way in the process with a few muni services and the RCMP. How far are you willing to relocate?

[/quote]

I have family in both Nanaimo and Victoria. If you’re out this way again, let me know.

As far as relocation goes, I’m willing to go to the back of beyond myself, but my wife’s having some pretty major health issues and treatment, family, support etc, are all here. For the time being, it’s the local muni road for me. That’s ok, I love living here.

It’s going ok, just gotta pay your dues and keep hammering away. There’s some light at the end of the tunnel, but it could always turn out to be an oncoming train.

58

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]Claudan wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]Claudan wrote:
This.[/quote]

Yep you play the kickball.

Edit: You have a hearing problem?[/quote]

Nah, that’s called being a boss after you help your team win. Apparently, you’ve never had that happen to you.[/quote]

Being a boss? Also never seen anyone running around holding their ears as a celebration. Usually they carry you off the field on their shoulders. I opened holes for my running back to run through for touchdowns. My running back knew who made him “the boss”.

I guess you put the I in team.[/quote]

Yeah, I’m a central mid-fielder, I run about 10 miles a game, I play defense and offense. I guess I don’t do shit for the team.

59

[quote]Claudan wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]Claudan wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]Claudan wrote:
This.[/quote]

Yep you play the kickball.

Edit: You have a hearing problem?[/quote]

Nah, that’s called being a boss after you help your team win. Apparently, you’ve never had that happen to you.[/quote]

Being a boss? Also never seen anyone running around holding their ears as a celebration. Usually they carry you off the field on their shoulders. I opened holes for my running back to run through for touchdowns. My running back knew who made him “the boss”.

I guess you put the I in team.[/quote]

Yeah, I’m a central mid-fielder, I run about 10 miles a game, I play defense and offense. I guess I don’t do shit for the team.
[/quote]

Again with the I…

I am just busting your balls.

60

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]Claudan wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]Claudan wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]Claudan wrote:
This.[/quote]

Yep you play the kickball.

Edit: You have a hearing problem?[/quote]

Nah, that’s called being a boss after you help your team win. Apparently, you’ve never had that happen to you.[/quote]

Being a boss? Also never seen anyone running around holding their ears as a celebration. Usually they carry you off the field on their shoulders. I opened holes for my running back to run through for touchdowns. My running back knew who made him “the boss”.

I guess you put the I in team.[/quote]

Yeah, I’m a central mid-fielder, I run about 10 miles a game, I play defense and offense. I guess I don’t do shit for the team.
[/quote]

Again with the I…

I am just busting your balls.[/quote]

Don’t stop, it’s been far too long since someone touched my balls :cry: