Never too smart to learn something new. This link gives a detailed history of Christmas. A few interesting things:
"As an adult, Mithras healed the sick, made the lame walk, gave sight to the blind and raised the dead. Before returning to heaven at the Spring Equinox Mithras had a last supper with 12 disciples (representing the 12 signs of the Zodiac). Mithraism included Zoroastrian beliefs in the struggle between good & evil, symbolized as light & darkness.
This militaristic black-and-white morality (including a final judgment affecting an afterlife of heaven or hell) probably accounted for the popularity of Mithraism among Roman soldiers. Mithraism was like an ancient fraternity: a mystery cult open only to men which had seven degrees of initiation â?? including the ritual of baptism and a sacred meal of bread & wine representing the body & blood of Mithras."
So chrisianities bullshit isn’t even original. Cute.
[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
“As an adult, Mithras healed the sick, made the lame walk, gave sight to the blind and raised the dead. Before returning to heaven at the Spring Equinox Mithras had a last supper with 12 disciples (representing the 12 signs of the Zodiac). Mithraism included Zoroastrian beliefs in the struggle between good & evil, symbolized as light & darkness. This militaristic black-and-white morality (including a final judgment affecting an afterlife of heaven or hell) probably accounted for the popularity of Mithraism among Roman soldiers. Mithraism was like an ancient fraternity: a mystery cult open only to men which had seven degrees of initiation â?? including the ritual of baptism and a sacred meal of bread & wine representing the body & blood of Mithras.”
So chrisianities bullshit isn’t even original. Cute.[/quote]
At least your spelling is original.
I hate xmas carols
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[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
"As an adult, Mithras healed the sick, made the lame walk, gave sight to the blind and raised the dead. Before returning to heaven at the Spring Equinox Mithras had a last supper with 12 disciples (representing the 12 signs of the Zodiac). Mithraism included Zoroastrian beliefs in the struggle between good & evil, symbolized as light & darkness.
This militaristic black-and-white morality (including a final judgment affecting an afterlife of heaven or hell) probably accounted for the popularity of Mithraism among Roman soldiers. Mithraism was like an ancient fraternity: a mystery cult open only to men which had seven degrees of initiation â?? including the ritual of baptism and a sacred meal of bread & wine representing the body & blood of Mithras."
So chrisianities bullshit isn’t even original. Cute.[/quote]
Merry Mithras!
Kidding aside, I thought that maybe Mithras and Jesus were the same person, but Mithras was around 100 BC.
[quote]Sweet Revenge wrote:
[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
"As an adult, Mithras healed the sick, made the lame walk, gave sight to the blind and raised the dead. Before returning to heaven at the Spring Equinox Mithras had a last supper with 12 disciples (representing the 12 signs of the Zodiac). Mithraism included Zoroastrian beliefs in the struggle between good & evil, symbolized as light & darkness.
This militaristic black-and-white morality (including a final judgment affecting an afterlife of heaven or hell) probably accounted for the popularity of Mithraism among Roman soldiers. Mithraism was like an ancient fraternity: a mystery cult open only to men which had seven degrees of initiation �¢?? including the ritual of baptism and a sacred meal of bread & wine representing the body & blood of Mithras."
So chrisianities bullshit isn’t even original. Cute.[/quote]
Merry Mithras!
Kidding aside, I thought that maybe Mithras and Jesus were the same person, but Mithras was around 100 BC.
[/quote]
What’s far more likely is that those who worshipped Mithras were converted to Christianity, and so kept their myths but revised them to now say that Jesus did the impossible things.
I dont see how someone can know that the exact stories attributed to Jesus were attributed to others before Jesus was born, and still pretend they have any validity.
Here’s a shorter summary,
Mithras And Jesus: Is This The Same Old Story Over-And-Over Again?
By Willie Maartens
Quoted in part:
"Even before Mithras there was Krishna in India, circa 1200 BCE. Krishna is one of the most widely revered and most popular of all Indian divinities, worshipped as the eighth incarnation (avatar) of the Hindu god Vishnu and also as a supreme god in his own right.
Krishna was born of the Virgin Mother Devaki after being visited by spirits to announce the impending birth of an immaculately conceived child who is the son of God??. His birth was attended by wise men, as well as shepherds. Krishna was presented at birth with frankincense, myrrh, and gold.
Krishna worked miracles, restored sight, cast out devils, and raised the dead.
Many hundreds of years before both Mithras and Jesus, Krishna was baptised in the River Ganges, crucified between two thieves, died, buried, and resurrected in three days and worshipped as the saviour of men. He proclaimed himself the Resurrection and the Only way to the Father.
He was said to be without sin, of royal descent, and raised by a human father that was . . . a carpenter. He preached of a great and final day of judgment and used parables to teach the people about charity and love. In death he stood transfigured in front of his disciples. Krishna was called the Shepherd God, Lord of lords, the Redeemer, and the Universal Word. He was considered, the Alpha and Omega as well as being omniscient, omnipresent, and omnipotent.
He was prophesised to return to battle evil forces in a second coming. His disciples bestowed on him the word Jezeus that means Pure Essence.
However, thousands of years before Krishna, Mithras, and Jesus is the Egyptian sun god Horus.
Horus dates back to circa 3000 BCE. Horus was born of the virgin Isis-Meri on December 25 in a cave/manger with his birth being announced by a star in the East and attended by three wise men.
In the catacombs at Rome are pictures of the baby Horus being held by the virgin mother Isis. Horus taught in the temple when he was a child. He was baptised when he was 30 years old by â??Anup the Baptiserâ??. Horus performed miracles and raised a man named El-Azar-us, from the dead. Not only did Horus walk on water, he was also crucified, buried in a tomb, and then resurrected.
Horus was known as the Way, the Fisher, the Truth, the Light, Gods Anointed Son, the Son of Man, the Good Shepherd, the Lamb of God, and the Word.
He was also called the KRST, or Anointed One. There was an Egyptian trinity with Horus the Son, Atum the Father, and Ra the Holy Spirit. In the later years of Horus he had 12 disciples known as Har-Khuttie. Horus had an enemy (originally this was also the dark side of Horus, or his other face). This evil enemy was Sete or Sata. Horus struggled with Sata for 40 days in the wilderness. Some claim that this myth represents the triumph of light over dark. This triumph is most noted on December 25.
The Greek god Attis, born of the Virgin Nana, (or sometimes Cybelem) on December 25 and was reborn and rose from the dead on the third day. Attis was both the Father and the Divine Son. His crucifixion and subsequent resurrection were celebrated annually, with ritual communions of bread and wine. The wine represented the Gods blood; the bread became the body of the saviour.
The Greek god Adonis was born on December 25 and was the son of the virgin Myrha.
Another Greek god Hermes was born on December 25 was the son of the virgin Maia, as well as a member of a holy trinity Hermes Trismegistus.
The god Dionysus was born on December 25 and turned water into wine.
Bacchus was born on December 25 and was crucified in 200 BCE.
Prometheus was born on December 25 and descended from heaven as God incarnate as man, to save mankind, and was crucified, suffered, and rose from the dead.
Nimrod was represented in a dual role of God the Father and Ninus, the son of Semiramis. The olive branch of Semiramis was symbolic of this offspring produced through a virgin birth. Ninus was also known as Tammuz who was said to have been crucified with a lamb at his feet and placed in a cave. When a rock was rolled away from tile caveâ??s entrance three days later, his body had disappeared. Nimrod was symbolised by a fish and the origins of the Popeâ??s mitre shaped like a fish head. Nimrod was the son of Cush. Nimrod was a Mason. The Tower of Babel was one of the most ancient traditions of Masonry.
The original Christmas festival originated in Babylon founded by Nimrod, the grandson of Ham, the son of Noah. Nimrod originated the Babylonian system of organised competition, man-ruled governments and empires based upon the competitive and profit-making economic system. Nimrod who built the original tower of Babel, the first city of Babylon, Nineveh (the capital of Assyria) and many other commercial and pagan-religious centres.
Nimrod married his own mother, Semiramis. Legend has it, after his untimely death, she claimed that a full-grown evergreen tree sprang overnight from a dead tree stump, which symbolised the springing forth unto new life of the dead Nimrod.
On each anniversary of his birth, she claimed, Nimrod would visit the evergreen tree and leave gifts under it. December 25 was the birthday of Nimrod. It is from this myth, created by a woman living in an incestual relationship, that we get the original Christmas tree.
How could this be? Why are all these mythological ancient predecessors to Jesus Christ born on December 25? And why do all the other similarities transpire?
Well, nothing is new under the sun and the answer is found in the Son . . . or, rather, the SUN more correctly the ancient veneration of the Sun.
I wish you all a very, very happy day under the Sun."
[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
So chrisianities bullshit isn’t even original. Cute.[/quote]
I wouldn’t call it bullshit. There is no question that the Bible stories are not original. But similar stories from different peoples through the ages only reinforce what I would call TRUTH, IMHO. One aspect being the promise of victory of light over darkness. I don’t believe it really matters what the vernacular (religion) is.
I believe the trouble lies in any particular group laying sole claim to Truth. Clearly ridiculous and the cause much needless fighting.
[quote]Sweet Revenge wrote:
[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
So chrisianities bullshit isn’t even original. Cute.[/quote]
I wouldn’t call it bullshit. There is no question that the Bible stories are not original. But similar stories from different peoples through the ages only reinforce what I would call TRUTH, IMHO. One aspect being the promise of victory of light over darkness. I don’t believe it really matters what the vernacular (religion) is.
I believe the trouble lies in any particular group laying sole claim to Truth. Clearly ridiculous and the cause much needless fighting.
[/quote]
The miracle stories are bullshit. Even if the moral of a story is “good” or “true”, believing the story to be literally true is bullshit.
Christians refuse to even get into this topic because it is a historic, factual basis for disproving their Jesus myths. If all the stories attached to Jesus were attached to other figures before Jesus, we have proof that the stories existed before Jesus did. Those who believe the Jesus-myths have to accept that either:
(a) the mythological stories never happened in any of the cases (disproves their belief)
(b) the mythological stories happened in both cases (disproves the idea that Jesus was the only one to do those things)
(c) the stories happened but the earlier figures, not Jesus, did them and they were falsely credited to Jesus (disproves their belief)
(d) the stories somehow existed before Jesus, but were untrue untill Jesus was born and performed them (nonsense) or
(e) the stories are true, Jesus did them, and all of the other histories we have are lies (dishonesty)
[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
"As an adult, Mithras healed the sick, made the lame walk, gave sight to the blind and raised the dead. Before returning to heaven at the Spring Equinox Mithras had a last supper with 12 disciples (representing the 12 signs of the Zodiac). Mithraism included Zoroastrian beliefs in the struggle between good & evil, symbolized as light & darkness.
This militaristic black-and-white morality (including a final judgment affecting an afterlife of heaven or hell) probably accounted for the popularity of Mithraism among Roman soldiers. Mithraism was like an ancient fraternity: a mystery cult open only to men which had seven degrees of initiation â?? including the ritual of baptism and a sacred meal of bread & wine representing the body & blood of Mithras."
So chrisianities bullshit isn’t even original. Cute.[/quote]
Actually, if you read Justin the Martyr (a second century apologist) this is precisely what he was arguing, that Christianity was really no different then the Helenistic religions.
Perseus was a son of a god and so was jesus. That sort of thing. One of the reasons the Romans were leery of Christianity was because of how ‘new’ it was. It wasn’t looked at as authentic because it just came on the scene.
You have that and the christian traditions that are just blatant rip offs (such as the Eucharist) and it seems evident where Christianity came from.
I want to wish everyone a Merry Christmas - And remind them that this is the day we celebrate the savior of the world, Jesus Christ, being born. For those who do not fully understand Jesus Christ is the son of God and came into the world to die a horrible death on the cross so that through your faith in him you can be forgiven of your sins (and even the best of us sin and fall short of the glory of God) and spend eternity in heaven.
Please take time out from your busy day to contemplate Christs great sacrifice. And know that there will always be nay sayers. But that is to be expected in the times that we live in, the Bible calls these the “end times”. And there is a great amount of scripture predicting the very things that are happening today, right down to those that even deny Christs existence. I urge all who are Christians to keep the faith. And for those who are not yet sure, seek out Jesus Christ in a Bible believing church in your area. It will be the best decision that you ever made!
Once again Merry Christmas.
Zeb
Here here to Zeb. Very good and seconded.
[quote]ZEB wrote:
I want to wish everyone a Merry Christmas - And remind them that this is the day we celebrate the savior of the world, Jesus Christ, being born. For those who do not fully understand Jesus Christ is the son of God and came into the world to die a horrible death on the cross so that through your faith in him you can be forgiven of your sins (and even the best of us sin and fall short of the glory of God) and spend eternity in heaven.
Please take time out from your busy day to contemplate Christs great sacrifice. And know that there will always be nay sayers. But that is to be expected in the times that we live in, the Bible calls these the “end times”. And there is a great amount of scripture predicting the very things that are happening today, right down to those that even deny Christs existence. I urge all who are Christians to keep the faith. And for those who are not yet sure, seek out Jesus Christ in a Bible believing church in your area. It will be the best decision that you ever made!
Once again Merry Christmas.
Zeb[/quote]
Merry Christmas to you too, man!
[quote]Sweet Revenge wrote:
Krishna was born of the Virgin Mother Devaki…[/quote]
Nope. Devaki wasn’t a virgin.
[quote]Pangloss wrote:
[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
"As an adult, Mithras healed the sick, made the lame walk, gave sight to the blind and raised the dead. Before returning to heaven at the Spring Equinox Mithras had a last supper with 12 disciples (representing the 12 signs of the Zodiac). Mithraism included Zoroastrian beliefs in the struggle between good & evil, symbolized as light & darkness.
This militaristic black-and-white morality (including a final judgment affecting an afterlife of heaven or hell) probably accounted for the popularity of Mithraism among Roman soldiers. Mithraism was like an ancient fraternity: a mystery cult open only to men which had seven degrees of initiation �?�¢?? including the ritual of baptism and a sacred meal of bread & wine representing the body & blood of Mithras."
So chrisianities bullshit isn’t even original. Cute.[/quote]
Actually, if you read Justin the Martyr (a second century apologist) this is precisely what he was arguing, that Christianity was really no different then the Helenistic religions.
[/quote]
I’d love to read where Justin the Martyr argued that Christianity was no different then the Hellenistic Religions.
[quote]
Perseus was a son of a god and so was jesus. That sort of thing. One of the reasons the Romans were leery of Christianity was because of how ‘new’ it was. It wasn’t looked at as authentic because it just came on the scene.
You have that and the christian traditions that are just blatant rip offs (such as the Eucharist) and it seems evident where Christianity came from.[/quote]
Eucharist = Passover Meal/Sacrifice of Christ.
In 1350 B.C., around the time Moses was born in Egypt, the Egyptian pharaoh Akhenaton got rid of multiple gods and promoted belief in only one god. Moses is responsible for the Bible’s first five books, which also teach there is only one God. Does this mean the Jewish (and Christian and Muslim) belief in one God comes from the pagan Akhenaton?
And, Merry Christmastide.
Many of the “traditional” Christmas things: tree, red, green, etc., were originally Pagan, mostly Wiccan. Jesus was NOT born in December, there’s even debate about the actual date of his birth.
Blessed Yuletide (that’s December 21, the Winter Solstice, the Wiccan holiday of celebrating The God’s rebirth and renewal as the sun).
[quote]Grneyes wrote:
Many of the “traditional” Christmas things: tree, red, green, etc., were originally Pagan, mostly Wiccan. Jesus was NOT born in December, there’s even debate about the actual date of his birth.
Blessed Yuletide (that’s December 21, the Winter Solstice, the Wiccan holiday of celebrating The God’s rebirth and renewal as the sun).[/quote]
Incorrect. I’ll post a link about why it’s December 25th, but it is a commonly held myth, that has been debunked, that Christmas comes from a pagan holiday. I guess if enough people say it, it’ll eventually believed to be true.
[quote]Brother Chris wrote:
And, Merry Christmastide. [/quote]Indeed and to all as well.
[quote]Sloth wrote:
[quote]Sweet Revenge wrote:
Krishna was born of the Virgin Mother Devaki…[/quote]
Nope. Devaki wasn’t a virgin. [/quote]
None of her children were fathered, they were all minor Gods being killed to resolve some bad Karma or some bullshit. She was a virgin.