Thyroid Advice with TRT?

“They” can get away with it until “they” need to write an article or a paper that invoke both axes. Then the paper would be kind of hard to follow as “they” would use HPTA for both the Hypo-Pit-Testicular-Axis and Hypo-Pit-Thyroid-Axis. That would be a lot of HPTAs.

No worries I give my Drs. crap about this too. :+1:

But you are technically ok above (I was just having some fun) as you only invoked the abbreviation HPTA once in discussing your testosterone and never mentioned the HPTA in context of the thyroid in that specific post (even though discussing both). I was following.

Have a good rest of your day.

Good example: imagine trying to track if “HPTA” used for both HPG and HP-T (thyroid) axes in this paper…
https://setac.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/pdf/10.1002/etc.3995

Yeah I agree with you that HPG should be used, but HPTA is still used on several papers to indicate the hypothalamus, pituitary and testicles axis, so I keep using it without thinking much about it.

Maybe you’ve read, nice review:

Also touches on peripheral vs serum levels.

It would seem so.

Let me just mention a few things because some folks make this topic way too complicated for no reason. They make it sound like you will end up with an autoimmune disorder or end up in cardiac arrest if you take thyroid meds. Some people are too smart for their own good, they are well read, but they have zero experience / or have actual tested their bullshit with real people. This kind of advice keeps people feeling like shit for eternity and you mentioned this with your last doctor and trt.

RT3 at 13 is high. There is a website out there called stop the thyroid madness. Just go there and see what folks say about high reverse t3. Not some guy pulling bullshit articles and other shit from the web and trying to over complicate your path to health.

You want it below 5 and even closer to 1. I saw someone else suggest its totally fine and i cannot verbally emphasize how horrible that advice is. i don’t understand why some people think they are so smart compared to doctors who do this for a living. Im not a doctor, but my doctor specializes in hormones for men and woman. He knows his shit and his credentials surpass the keyboard warrior credentials above. He has actual decade of experience with men and woman and thyroid therapy. Ive learned everything from him and im sure he’d back this up.

When you have high rt3 like my wife did you want to hit it head on by lowering that rt3 if its due to diet or whatever else that causes it. Don’t wait for this to resolve and start a t3 only protocol If symptoms are bad enough. Like fatigue… bad fatigue. Hair thinning. Metabolism.

If rt3 is high and the rest of your thyroid labs look excellent, i would just work on lowering rt3 through whatever means necessary. No need to get on thyroid meds for life. They are expensive.

My wife was eating low carb diet and she started to eat carbs and went on a normal diet. She went from the exact same rt3 of 13 down to 6 and since then she has been on armour thyroid. This took 3 months.

She was on t3 at the start but it didn’t make a damn difference for her because the doctor was giving her 5mcg 1 a day. I convineced him t give it to her 3 times a day. still didnt do shit. She took her first armour thyroid 2 grain tablet and it was a night and day difference.

Synethic thyroid meds suck ass. Get dessicated and enjoy.I tried it and many others have as well. Dont waste your time.

End of day if a man is on trt and he still has fatigue, metabolism and other symptoms, that man should test thyroid. If thyroid labs do not show ft3 top of range, t4 mid range, that man should run a trial of thyroid. Slowly increase until symptoms resolve. If symptoms do not resolve, thyroid is not the answer.

If ft3 is well below 50% of the range start with 2 grains like i did. If its neither great nor horrible start with 1 grain. The worst that can happen is you feel like you drank a few cups of coffee for a few hours and you can lower your dose. If you decide to start with a smaller dose i would just cut the pill in half and see if that works. After a few days you will stabilize and realize if that dose works for you.

One last thing. Due to the half life of t3 and dessicated thyroid meds, you will want to take it twice a day or 8 hours apart. 6 am and 2pm.

This is how I was taught thyroid therapy from my doctor and the exact same steps my wife, my friends and I have followed.

Get as big a dose as you can from the doctor. Otherwise you might end up waiting 3 months to feel better. You want control over your dosing and need to increase without having to call the doctor and ask for more. If you can.

Goood luck. dont waste your time with fear mongering and guys who want to make it harder than it is. hormone therapy is very simple. supplement until symptoms resolve.

Im taking 2 grains twice a day. Its been almost 2 years. I feel fine. I race bikes, do intervals, life weights and sleep. I dont and never have had any of the symptoms of high thyroid levels. Although my levels are just a tad bit over the lab range. Some folks on here would tell me i am going to ruin my health or have a CV event. Guess what. … it hasn’t happened.

That summaries what I’m trying to do. Thanks.

I’ve ordered pharma grade compounded NDT, each tablet is the equivalent of 1 grain. I will do thyroid labs on Thursday and post it here.
What was your wife starting dose? 2 grains together in the AM? Or 1 in the AM and one in the early PM?
Would you start a man on 2 grains as well and tirate up if necessary?

You mentioned also you wouldn’t want to be on thyroid meds forever, but I consider NDT almost like a supplement. What’s your thyroid protocol now?

I’m eating my carbs (rice, potatoes, fruit, vegetables and whole grain bread). I love carbs and I’ve learned it the hard way when I tried a keto diet years ago. My thyroid didn’t like it all. What would you do if fT3 goes top of the range, fT4 mid range but rT3 still above 10?

Last thing. Are you followed by Dr. Nichols?

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Sorry I saw you responded to some of the questions already in the previous post.

Glad to hear it brother and yes doctor Nichols is my guy.

My wife takes it twice a day so a total of 4 like me. She needs it and her labs are perfect. Without it she feels horrible. Even on 1 grain twice a day she feels blah.

Start at 1 and take that for several days. You should notice a benefit quickly . If not go to 1.5 then 2 twice a day. It’s hard to explain the feeli when it works. I would say it felt like the clouds lifted and the sun started to shine. My brain was awake and the fatigue from hell dissipated within hours. Symptoms just vanish.

Don’t take thyroid just to take it if you don’t have the symptoms though. Otherwise take it as needed and find the fastest route to finding a dose that works for you without wasting your time.

The reason I’m trying it is because my cognitive function has been declining in the past months rapidly and you described it perfectly. I feel tired upon waking, then I have breakfast and go workout with heavy weights and I resurrect. Then I crash again after lunch and wake up again around 5-6 in the evening.
I’ve lost the enthusiasm on doing things too. I just feel ok with working out and working for my own business. I find all the rest boring.
Now, it could be thyroid or not, but my thyroid numbers went worse and worse and I started feeling like that.

I’ll keep you posted.

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Wow. So the range is 9-27 and you want it closer to 1! This may be the most insane thing I have ever read on here I think. I guess mine was high at this level:

Going to the website you tout:

What are symptoms that I have an RT3 problem?

Since Reverse T3 is an inactive hormone, and since this hormone in excess acts like an inhibitor of T3 in the cells (see this research–one of several), the symptoms are “increased hypothyroidism”! And we also see proof of this increased hypothyroidism, because our rising RT3 seems to accompany a lowering of FT3 in our labs. This could include more fatigue, for example, or an increase in adrenaline creating anxiety, or increased depression, or an increased need to nap…on and on. Or a rising RT3 can mean that no matter what you have done, you still have irritating hypothyroid symptoms!

Can lab work help me discover this? What do I look for?

1) The best way is to do the RT3 lab test.

A healthy level of RT3 will be the bottom two numbers of any provided range, we have noticed. So if your range starts at 8, then 8 or 9 are pretty common for a healthy level of RT3. Third from the bottom (10 if the range starts at 8, for example) may be fine, too, we have noticed. Any higher and we’ve got rising RT3, we’ve seen before. There are even some whose RT3 is slightly below range and not a problem.

What the holy hell? The website you told the OP to go to doesn’t even agree with your argument (and you are using that website as support of your advice).

Good luck guys. You were correct @enackers, we have a very different philosophy on life. I actually try to make sense. You don’t appear to not have that constraint. Just because you’ve gotten lucky (or fortunately have the genetics to not have a problem yet), why would you tout this stuff to another human being?

Really?

Yes really … really

I literally said nothing out of the ordinary. Tell me what exactly did you not understand.

If you are talking about the rt3 comment. I removed that. He knows what I’m saying although I made an error.

I had the fatigue where I slept 10-12 hours, and I could sleep more. I just couldn’t focus and nothing worked to wake me up.

Keep us posted. You are being Smart and stick to the basics as you have.