Thoughts on the Second GOP Debate

Off Topic Politics and World Issues
21

Breaking it down into three categories:

The Winners:

Marco Rubio- with his command of foreign policy issues. And also a good handle on why America is losing relative to families and culture. He was sharp and a very good speaker. He needs to smile more I have no doubt that if he is the nominee Hillary will get less of the female vote. The republicans will also win Florida one of two key states that are must win in order to capture the White House.

Carly Fiorina - I personally don’t like her because she has a low likability factor in my view,
but she was read hot relative to Planned Parent Hood drawing vivid images of planned parenthood selling baby parts, it was emotionally disturbing. And also spot on with her other answers. She never flounders very steady, exceptional on her feet last night.

Chris Christie- Another candidate that I do not like but he had a really good night. When he jumped in to tell Fiorina and Trump to stop talking about themselves and start talking about the people he shined. He also put Rand Paul in his place during their exchange. Paul’s constant reference to pot as being the only way that one child could have his pain relieved was ridiculous as Christie agreed relative to medical marijuana. Chirstie also has a very commanding presence, okay at his weight I suppose that is a gimme…both good and bad.

Ted Cruz- The talking heads did not give Cruz enough credit. His answers were crisp and spot on. I made a comment to the people I was watching the debate with “if they had an IQ test Cruz would blow them all away…he’s really a very smart guy”. Unfortunately, he can’t do anything about how he presents which seems phony at times and his look is NOT Presidential. But I really like his positions.

The Middle Of the Pack:

Jeb Bush- His best moment was when he stood up for GW and how he kept America safe while Trump attacked. I thought confessing to marijuana use in High School was pretty funny as he added that his Mom didn’t know up to tonight. He was far more animated than in the first debate. Did anyone else notice the hard slap and the crazy face that he made when he hit Trumps hand? I sure don’t want him to be the nominee but he was far better than during the first debate.

John Kasich- Granted at times he sounds like a democrat but overall he is a likeable sort. I also think women like his soft tones and how he never speaks ill of another candidate. He had some good answers relative to community etc. I think he will be on several people’s short list for VP, as I don’t think he’ll get the nomination for the top spot. They love him in Ohio and as I’ve said (and everyone knows) if the republicans don’t win Ohio they lose the White House.

Mike Huckabee- Here is a man who is very eloquent and has a solid command on the issues. His high point was defending the County Clerk who refused to grant a marriage license to two gays. We cam either agree or disagree with his position. But, his remarks were passionate and will win him some right wing support in the polls.

The Losers:

Rand Paul - Trump was right, Paul should not be on the stage with the others. His libertarian positions made him sound nutty at times. He got his ass kicked when he went up against Christi. Stating that we can arm one certain group (can’t remember the name) to go after Isis, and that’s all we need to do was just stupid. He also looks like a guy who should be standing out on a street corner asking for money. Sorry to those who love him but he has the least Presidential presence of any of them and certainly would lose to Hillary Clinton. Fortunately, he will be gone soon so there is no danger in that happening.

Ben Carson- What’s up with those 3 second eye blinks of his? I thought he was going to sleep, or was on some sort of prescription medication that he wrote for himself. Sure he’s a nice guy but he’s certainly not Presidential. The one time he had a chance to shine when Trump claimed that vaccinations caused autism he allowed Trump a pass and even offered up a compromise “well they do prescribe too much medications sometimes.” He too needs to go away.

Donald Trump- Anyone who thinks that Trump finished in the upper tier last night was watching a different debate. His answers were shallow “I’d get along with Putin” yawn…uh huh. And when he did come up with a fact or two it sounded rehearsed. He was at his best when he spanked Fioria regarding her tenure at HP. He also had a moment or two when he turned to Jeb Bush and said “oh good I see your energy level is higher tonight”. But overall he looked out of his league not giving any detail. Would I vote for him over Hillary Clinton-ABSOLUTELY! But we have far better than him.

Scott Walker- I don’t know what it is about Walker. He has his facts right. He has a good record as Governor, maybe it’s just his goofy looks. He does not seem to project leadership. Not as bad as Ben Carson but pretty bad. He also had a good moment vs Trump when he told Trump “we don’t need an apprentice as President we already have one and he didn’t work out too well.”

In the end I think this was a pivotal debate for a certain few. I would be surprised if the winners in this debate did not gain some ground. I would also be surprised if Trump holds the lead for very much longer. I think what you saw last night was the very beginning of the end for Trump. Sure I could be wrong, it may take a while but there is no way that in such a great GOP field that Trump is going to shine in the end. One way he could do it is If he actually spends some money and hires the best advisors and starts boning up on the issues. If he doesn’t do this as the field narrows he will be shown to be a lightweight. Did you hear that Donald do your homework!

Also, I’d be very surprised if Fiorina’s numbers did not go up dramatically after this debate.

22

One more thing about Trump. As the field gets more narrow he needs to stop making those outlandish faces, it gets old really fast.

23

Carson, Walker, Kaisch and Huckabee need to go.

CNN did a good job. It wasn’t about the moderator (read: Kelley), but rather the candidates. It was controlled but allowed candidates to respond when addressed. Some of Trump’s extra time was due to comments made about/toward him (read: Bush).

I thought the best moment of the night was Bush’s defense of his wife.

25

[quote]ZEB wrote:
Breaking it down into three categories:

The Winners:

Marco Rubio- with his command of foreign policy issues. And also a good handle on why America is losing relative to families and culture. He was sharp and a very good speaker. He needs to smile more I have no doubt that if he is the nominee Hillary will get less of the female vote. The republicans will also win Florida one of two key states that are must win in order to capture the White House.

Carly Fiorina - I personally don’t like her because she has a low likability factor in my view,
but she was read hot relative to Planned Parent Hood drawing vivid images of planned parenthood selling baby parts, it was emotionally disturbing. And also spot on with her other answers. She never flounders very steady, exceptional on her feet last night.

Chris Christie- Another candidate that I do not like but he had a really good night. When he jumped in to tell Fiorina and Trump to stop talking about themselves and start talking about the people he shined. He also put Rand Paul in his place during their exchange. Paul’s constant reference to pot as being the only way that one child could have his pain relieved was ridiculous as Christie agreed relative to medical marijuana. Chirstie also has a very commanding presence, okay at his weight I suppose that is a gimme…both good and bad.

Ted Cruz- The talking heads did not give Cruz enough credit. His answers were crisp and spot on. I made a comment to the people I was watching the debate with “if they had an IQ test Cruz would blow them all away…he’s really a very smart guy”. Unfortunately, he can’t do anything about how he presents which seems phony at times and his look is NOT Presidential. But I really like his positions.

The Middle Of the Pack:

Jeb Bush- His best moment was when he stood up for GW and how he kept America safe while Trump attacked. I thought confessing to marijuana use in High School was pretty funny as he added that his Mom didn’t know up to tonight. He was far more animated than in the first debate. Did anyone else notice the hard slap and the crazy face that he made when he hit Trumps hand? I sure don’t want him to be the nominee but he was far better than during the first debate.

John Kasich- Granted at times he sounds like a democrat but overall he is a likeable sort. I also think women like his soft tones and how he never speaks ill of another candidate. He had some good answers relative to community etc. I think he will be on several people’s short list for VP, as I don’t think he’ll get the nomination for the top spot. They love him in Ohio and as I’ve said (and everyone knows) if the republicans don’t win Ohio they lose the White House.

Mike Huckabee- Here is a man who is very eloquent and has a solid command on the issues. His high point was defending the County Clerk who refused to grant a marriage license to two gays. We cam either agree or disagree with his position. But, his remarks were passionate and will win him some right wing support in the polls.

The Losers:

Rand Paul - Trump was right, Paul should not be on the stage with the others. His libertarian positions made him sound nutty at times. He got his ass kicked when he went up against Christi. Stating that we can arm one certain group (can’t remember the name) to go after Isis, and that’s all we need to do was just stupid. He also looks like a guy who should be standing out on a street corner asking for money. Sorry to those who love him but he has the least Presidential presence of any of them and certainly would lose to Hillary Clinton. Fortunately, he will be gone soon so there is no danger in that happening.

Ben Carson- What’s up with those 3 second eye blinks of his? I thought he was going to sleep, or was on some sort of prescription medication that he wrote for himself. Sure he’s a nice guy but he’s certainly not Presidential. The one time he had a chance to shine when Trump claimed that vaccinations caused autism he allowed Trump a pass and even offered up a compromise “well they do prescribe too much medications sometimes.” He too needs to go away.

Donald Trump- Anyone who thinks that Trump finished in the upper tier last night was watching a different debate. His answers were shallow “I’d get along with Putin” yawn…uh huh. And when he did come up with a fact or two it sounded rehearsed. He was at his best when he spanked Fioria regarding her tenure at HP. He also had a moment or two when he turned to Jeb Bush and said “oh good I see your energy level is higher tonight”. But overall he looked out of his league not giving any detail. Would I vote for him over Hillary Clinton-ABSOLUTELY! But we have far better than him.

Scott Walker- I don’t know what it is about Walker. He has his facts right. He has a good record as Governor, maybe it’s just his goofy looks. He does not seem to project leadership. Not as bad as Ben Carson but pretty bad. He also had a good moment vs Trump when he told Trump “we don’t need an apprentice as President we already have one and he didn’t work out too well.”

In the end I think this was a pivotal debate for a certain few. I would be surprised if the winners in this debate did not gain some ground. I would also be surprised if Trump holds the lead for very much longer. I think what you saw last night was the very beginning of the end for Trump. Sure I could be wrong, it may take a while but there is no way that in such a great GOP field that Trump is going to shine in the end. One way he could do it is If he actually spends some money and hires the best advisors and starts boning up on the issues. If he doesn’t do this as the field narrows he will be shown to be a lightweight. Did you hear that Donald do your homework!

Also, I’d be very surprised if Fiorina’s numbers did not go up dramatically after this debate. [/quote]

Only thing I really disagree with about is your Christie assertion. Dude’s an windbag. And the way he scolded Trump and Fiorina made him look like a jealous petulant child and a bully to boot.

26

[quote]Drew1411 wrote:

[quote]Jewbacca wrote:
I didn’t see any winner last night, but I saw two clear losers: Jeb Bush and Kasich.

Bush was exposed as a complete pansy. Kasich is a rambling squish.

[/quote]

What did you see that brought that conclusion? I felt differently, and a lot of the initial reactions I have heard/read spoke well of Bush.

As with any debate, there will be more to come as people can sit back and analyze the talking points and sound bites. [/quote]

Of course a lot of the initial reactions from the talking heads/media spoke well of Bush. Bush is the designated loser from the MSM to be sacrificed at the feet of Hillary.

But regarding your question “what brought me to that conclusion?”

“More energy” is all I have to say.

27

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]Mufasa wrote:
One more thought.

Immigration now “belongs” to the GOP. Like it or not, it’s “their” issue and they will have to “own” it in the General election.

I think Fiorina would carry less of the vitriol with her on the subject (as well as Bush, Rubio, Christie, and Carson)…and how it is going to play with Hispanics in the General Election is yet to be seen.

But it is now a major part of the GOP platform…and the DEMS are surely salivating at the idea of hanging them with their own words.

We’ll see.

Mufasa

[/quote]

Hanging them with their own words?

Do you realize that the topic of immigration is what launched Trump to the top spot?

Almost 70% of the population feels that we have an immigration problem. That topic is not going to hurt the GOP, but it will hurt the democrats who were in power and did nothing.
[/quote]

Try to ease up on the partisanship sometimes, Zeb.

I wasn’t picking “winners” or “losers” on the immigration issue…just stating that the DEMS were going to be in attack mode on the issue.

How it plays out in the General Election is anyone’s guess.

Mufasa

28

[quote]ZEB wrote:
CNN also actively tried to get the candidates to fight. It worked on occasion but over all CNN didn’t look very “fair and balanced” But that is what I expected anyway…
[/quote]

29

[quote]OldOgre wrote:
I think the best way to attack Trump in a debate may be to not attack him at all. Ignore him. Stop addressing him every 37 seconds. Stop saying his name. Stop asking other candidates questions about things Trump has said. Stop high 5-ing him on stage. Leave him alone. Average people went to bed last night thinking about Donald Trump if they watched the debate. [/quote]

30

[quote]ZEB wrote:
One more thing about Trump. As the field gets more narrow he needs to stop making those outlandish faces, it gets old really fast.[/quote]

Do you think Trump really even wants to be president? I still believe it is all a show. His goal is to stay in the lime light as long as possible, but then needs a valid reason to bow out. I think in the end he will not hire advisors, will not accept donations, and probably will campaign very little if at all in the early primary states. He’ll then claim that everyone else was bought out, blah, blah, blah, and quit when his numbers start to suffer.

You read it here first.

31

[quote]ZEB wrote:
Did anyone else notice the hard slap and the crazy face that he made when he hit Trumps hand? [/quote]

Ya, it was pretty funny.

32

[quote]polo77j wrote:

[quote]ZEB wrote:
Breaking it down into three categories:

The Winners:

Marco Rubio- with his command of foreign policy issues. And also a good handle on why America is losing relative to families and culture. He was sharp and a very good speaker. He needs to smile more I have no doubt that if he is the nominee Hillary will get less of the female vote. The republicans will also win Florida one of two key states that are must win in order to capture the White House.

Carly Fiorina - I personally don’t like her because she has a low likability factor in my view,
but she was read hot relative to Planned Parent Hood drawing vivid images of planned parenthood selling baby parts, it was emotionally disturbing. And also spot on with her other answers. She never flounders very steady, exceptional on her feet last night.

Chris Christie- Another candidate that I do not like but he had a really good night. When he jumped in to tell Fiorina and Trump to stop talking about themselves and start talking about the people he shined. He also put Rand Paul in his place during their exchange. Paul’s constant reference to pot as being the only way that one child could have his pain relieved was ridiculous as Christie agreed relative to medical marijuana. Chirstie also has a very commanding presence, okay at his weight I suppose that is a gimme…both good and bad.

Ted Cruz- The talking heads did not give Cruz enough credit. His answers were crisp and spot on. I made a comment to the people I was watching the debate with “if they had an IQ test Cruz would blow them all away…he’s really a very smart guy”. Unfortunately, he can’t do anything about how he presents which seems phony at times and his look is NOT Presidential. But I really like his positions.

The Middle Of the Pack:

Jeb Bush- His best moment was when he stood up for GW and how he kept America safe while Trump attacked. I thought confessing to marijuana use in High School was pretty funny as he added that his Mom didn’t know up to tonight. He was far more animated than in the first debate. Did anyone else notice the hard slap and the crazy face that he made when he hit Trumps hand? I sure don’t want him to be the nominee but he was far better than during the first debate.

John Kasich- Granted at times he sounds like a democrat but overall he is a likeable sort. I also think women like his soft tones and how he never speaks ill of another candidate. He had some good answers relative to community etc. I think he will be on several people’s short list for VP, as I don’t think he’ll get the nomination for the top spot. They love him in Ohio and as I’ve said (and everyone knows) if the republicans don’t win Ohio they lose the White House.

Mike Huckabee- Here is a man who is very eloquent and has a solid command on the issues. His high point was defending the County Clerk who refused to grant a marriage license to two gays. We cam either agree or disagree with his position. But, his remarks were passionate and will win him some right wing support in the polls.

The Losers:

Rand Paul - Trump was right, Paul should not be on the stage with the others. His libertarian positions made him sound nutty at times. He got his ass kicked when he went up against Christi. Stating that we can arm one certain group (can’t remember the name) to go after Isis, and that’s all we need to do was just stupid. He also looks like a guy who should be standing out on a street corner asking for money. Sorry to those who love him but he has the least Presidential presence of any of them and certainly would lose to Hillary Clinton. Fortunately, he will be gone soon so there is no danger in that happening.

Ben Carson- What’s up with those 3 second eye blinks of his? I thought he was going to sleep, or was on some sort of prescription medication that he wrote for himself. Sure he’s a nice guy but he’s certainly not Presidential. The one time he had a chance to shine when Trump claimed that vaccinations caused autism he allowed Trump a pass and even offered up a compromise “well they do prescribe too much medications sometimes.” He too needs to go away.

Donald Trump- Anyone who thinks that Trump finished in the upper tier last night was watching a different debate. His answers were shallow “I’d get along with Putin” yawn…uh huh. And when he did come up with a fact or two it sounded rehearsed. He was at his best when he spanked Fioria regarding her tenure at HP. He also had a moment or two when he turned to Jeb Bush and said “oh good I see your energy level is higher tonight”. But overall he looked out of his league not giving any detail. Would I vote for him over Hillary Clinton-ABSOLUTELY! But we have far better than him.

Scott Walker- I don’t know what it is about Walker. He has his facts right. He has a good record as Governor, maybe it’s just his goofy looks. He does not seem to project leadership. Not as bad as Ben Carson but pretty bad. He also had a good moment vs Trump when he told Trump “we don’t need an apprentice as President we already have one and he didn’t work out too well.”

In the end I think this was a pivotal debate for a certain few. I would be surprised if the winners in this debate did not gain some ground. I would also be surprised if Trump holds the lead for very much longer. I think what you saw last night was the very beginning of the end for Trump. Sure I could be wrong, it may take a while but there is no way that in such a great GOP field that Trump is going to shine in the end. One way he could do it is If he actually spends some money and hires the best advisors and starts boning up on the issues. If he doesn’t do this as the field narrows he will be shown to be a lightweight. Did you hear that Donald do your homework!

Also, I’d be very surprised if Fiorina’s numbers did not go up dramatically after this debate. [/quote]

Only thing I really disagree with about is your Christie assertion. Dude’s an windbag. And the way he scolded Trump and Fiorina made him look like a jealous petulant child and a bully to boot.[/quote]

It was kinda weird when Christie did that.

33

[quote]polo77j wrote:

[quote]ZEB wrote:
Breaking it down into three categories:

The Winners:

Marco Rubio- with his command of foreign policy issues. And also a good handle on why America is losing relative to families and culture. He was sharp and a very good speaker. He needs to smile more I have no doubt that if he is the nominee Hillary will get less of the female vote. The republicans will also win Florida one of two key states that are must win in order to capture the White House.

Carly Fiorina - I personally don’t like her because she has a low likability factor in my view,
but she was read hot relative to Planned Parent Hood drawing vivid images of planned parenthood selling baby parts, it was emotionally disturbing. And also spot on with her other answers. She never flounders very steady, exceptional on her feet last night.

Chris Christie- Another candidate that I do not like but he had a really good night. When he jumped in to tell Fiorina and Trump to stop talking about themselves and start talking about the people he shined. He also put Rand Paul in his place during their exchange. Paul’s constant reference to pot as being the only way that one child could have his pain relieved was ridiculous as Christie agreed relative to medical marijuana. Chirstie also has a very commanding presence, okay at his weight I suppose that is a gimme…both good and bad.

Ted Cruz- The talking heads did not give Cruz enough credit. His answers were crisp and spot on. I made a comment to the people I was watching the debate with “if they had an IQ test Cruz would blow them all away…he’s really a very smart guy”. Unfortunately, he can’t do anything about how he presents which seems phony at times and his look is NOT Presidential. But I really like his positions.

The Middle Of the Pack:

Jeb Bush- His best moment was when he stood up for GW and how he kept America safe while Trump attacked. I thought confessing to marijuana use in High School was pretty funny as he added that his Mom didn’t know up to tonight. He was far more animated than in the first debate. Did anyone else notice the hard slap and the crazy face that he made when he hit Trumps hand? I sure don’t want him to be the nominee but he was far better than during the first debate.

John Kasich- Granted at times he sounds like a democrat but overall he is a likeable sort. I also think women like his soft tones and how he never speaks ill of another candidate. He had some good answers relative to community etc. I think he will be on several people’s short list for VP, as I don’t think he’ll get the nomination for the top spot. They love him in Ohio and as I’ve said (and everyone knows) if the republicans don’t win Ohio they lose the White House.

Mike Huckabee- Here is a man who is very eloquent and has a solid command on the issues. His high point was defending the County Clerk who refused to grant a marriage license to two gays. We cam either agree or disagree with his position. But, his remarks were passionate and will win him some right wing support in the polls.

The Losers:

Rand Paul - Trump was right, Paul should not be on the stage with the others. His libertarian positions made him sound nutty at times. He got his ass kicked when he went up against Christi. Stating that we can arm one certain group (can’t remember the name) to go after Isis, and that’s all we need to do was just stupid. He also looks like a guy who should be standing out on a street corner asking for money. Sorry to those who love him but he has the least Presidential presence of any of them and certainly would lose to Hillary Clinton. Fortunately, he will be gone soon so there is no danger in that happening.

Ben Carson- What’s up with those 3 second eye blinks of his? I thought he was going to sleep, or was on some sort of prescription medication that he wrote for himself. Sure he’s a nice guy but he’s certainly not Presidential. The one time he had a chance to shine when Trump claimed that vaccinations caused autism he allowed Trump a pass and even offered up a compromise “well they do prescribe too much medications sometimes.” He too needs to go away.

Donald Trump- Anyone who thinks that Trump finished in the upper tier last night was watching a different debate. His answers were shallow “I’d get along with Putin” yawn…uh huh. And when he did come up with a fact or two it sounded rehearsed. He was at his best when he spanked Fioria regarding her tenure at HP. He also had a moment or two when he turned to Jeb Bush and said “oh good I see your energy level is higher tonight”. But overall he looked out of his league not giving any detail. Would I vote for him over Hillary Clinton-ABSOLUTELY! But we have far better than him.

Scott Walker- I don’t know what it is about Walker. He has his facts right. He has a good record as Governor, maybe it’s just his goofy looks. He does not seem to project leadership. Not as bad as Ben Carson but pretty bad. He also had a good moment vs Trump when he told Trump “we don’t need an apprentice as President we already have one and he didn’t work out too well.”

In the end I think this was a pivotal debate for a certain few. I would be surprised if the winners in this debate did not gain some ground. I would also be surprised if Trump holds the lead for very much longer. I think what you saw last night was the very beginning of the end for Trump. Sure I could be wrong, it may take a while but there is no way that in such a great GOP field that Trump is going to shine in the end. One way he could do it is If he actually spends some money and hires the best advisors and starts boning up on the issues. If he doesn’t do this as the field narrows he will be shown to be a lightweight. Did you hear that Donald do your homework!

Also, I’d be very surprised if Fiorina’s numbers did not go up dramatically after this debate. [/quote]

Only thing I really disagree with about is your Christie assertion. Dude’s an windbag. And the way he scolded Trump and Fiorina made him look like a jealous petulant child and a bully to boot.[/quote]

I wonder do you not like Christie because of how he spoke about Trump and Fiorina, or did you not like Christie before the debate?

There are people who just started paying attention and I do believe that Christie sounded very in charge when he chastised them for talking about how successful they are. He turned it around in a masterful way to talk about how he wants to help the 55 year old guy who is unemployed.

I am not a fan of Christie at all, but objectively that was a very good moment for him.

34

I don’t understand the hate for Fiorina.

[quote]tedro wrote:
She handled her rehearsed answers well, [/quote]

Her rebuttals were mostly off the cuff.

[quote]
but is no more a conservative than McCain or Romney - [/quote]

Based on what?

[quote]
and I’m really tired about hearing her cherry-picked numbers from her HP days. It’s pretty easy to double your business when the company has the ability to acquire another of the same size! How about organic growth, Carly? How do those numbers shake out?[/quote]

HP didn’t acquire Compaq. The two companies merged and there was a lot of internal opposition to the move from what I’ve read. Organic growth, in the tech industry right after the bubble burst (less than a year after she became CEO), okay…

“You look back now, and Carly [Fiorina, former HP CEO] was right â?? there was a lot of synergy between the two companies,” Tommy Wald, CEO of White Glove Technologies in Austin, Texas, said. “The merger worked out well in retrospect. I think they turned the combined company into a strong channel company, which is what we were all concerned about as partners.”

"HP said the merger paved the way for it to become the No. 1 IT company in the world.

‘The combination of HP and Compaq built a business that achieved more together much faster than either company could on its own and built the foundation for the worldâ??s largest technology company,’ HP said in a statement to CRN."

35

Some of these guys need to drop out so we can have actual debate.

You can tell the media want Jeb. He is polling anywhere from 3%-7% but is front and center and has the second most airtime.

Rand Paul and Ted Cruz are the smartest guys on the stage. I thought it was funny when Trump and Carly were talking birthright citizenship and they went to Rand for clarification and a history lesson.

Thought CNN did a shitty job, but what should we expect? BTW, who the fuck was the Salem radio guy? Is that a thing?

36

I would like to see the field cut in half with the new polls after this and each successive debate.

Then create a message and have the also runs (some of whom should be in the Cabinet) begin attacking the Dems positions and performance. All the while the candidate stays positive and on point.

Damn they pay those Ivy League jerkoffs millions to run political parties…

37

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]polo77j wrote:

[quote]ZEB wrote:
Breaking it down into three categories:

The Winners:

Marco Rubio- with his command of foreign policy issues. And also a good handle on why America is losing relative to families and culture. He was sharp and a very good speaker. He needs to smile more I have no doubt that if he is the nominee Hillary will get less of the female vote. The republicans will also win Florida one of two key states that are must win in order to capture the White House.

Carly Fiorina - I personally don’t like her because she has a low likability factor in my view,
but she was read hot relative to Planned Parent Hood drawing vivid images of planned parenthood selling baby parts, it was emotionally disturbing. And also spot on with her other answers. She never flounders very steady, exceptional on her feet last night.

Chris Christie- Another candidate that I do not like but he had a really good night. When he jumped in to tell Fiorina and Trump to stop talking about themselves and start talking about the people he shined. He also put Rand Paul in his place during their exchange. Paul’s constant reference to pot as being the only way that one child could have his pain relieved was ridiculous as Christie agreed relative to medical marijuana. Chirstie also has a very commanding presence, okay at his weight I suppose that is a gimme…both good and bad.

Ted Cruz- The talking heads did not give Cruz enough credit. His answers were crisp and spot on. I made a comment to the people I was watching the debate with “if they had an IQ test Cruz would blow them all away…he’s really a very smart guy”. Unfortunately, he can’t do anything about how he presents which seems phony at times and his look is NOT Presidential. But I really like his positions.

The Middle Of the Pack:

Jeb Bush- His best moment was when he stood up for GW and how he kept America safe while Trump attacked. I thought confessing to marijuana use in High School was pretty funny as he added that his Mom didn’t know up to tonight. He was far more animated than in the first debate. Did anyone else notice the hard slap and the crazy face that he made when he hit Trumps hand? I sure don’t want him to be the nominee but he was far better than during the first debate.

John Kasich- Granted at times he sounds like a democrat but overall he is a likeable sort. I also think women like his soft tones and how he never speaks ill of another candidate. He had some good answers relative to community etc. I think he will be on several people’s short list for VP, as I don’t think he’ll get the nomination for the top spot. They love him in Ohio and as I’ve said (and everyone knows) if the republicans don’t win Ohio they lose the White House.

Mike Huckabee- Here is a man who is very eloquent and has a solid command on the issues. His high point was defending the County Clerk who refused to grant a marriage license to two gays. We cam either agree or disagree with his position. But, his remarks were passionate and will win him some right wing support in the polls.

The Losers:

Rand Paul - Trump was right, Paul should not be on the stage with the others. His libertarian positions made him sound nutty at times. He got his ass kicked when he went up against Christi. Stating that we can arm one certain group (can’t remember the name) to go after Isis, and that’s all we need to do was just stupid. He also looks like a guy who should be standing out on a street corner asking for money. Sorry to those who love him but he has the least Presidential presence of any of them and certainly would lose to Hillary Clinton. Fortunately, he will be gone soon so there is no danger in that happening.

Ben Carson- What’s up with those 3 second eye blinks of his? I thought he was going to sleep, or was on some sort of prescription medication that he wrote for himself. Sure he’s a nice guy but he’s certainly not Presidential. The one time he had a chance to shine when Trump claimed that vaccinations caused autism he allowed Trump a pass and even offered up a compromise “well they do prescribe too much medications sometimes.” He too needs to go away.

Donald Trump- Anyone who thinks that Trump finished in the upper tier last night was watching a different debate. His answers were shallow “I’d get along with Putin” yawn…uh huh. And when he did come up with a fact or two it sounded rehearsed. He was at his best when he spanked Fioria regarding her tenure at HP. He also had a moment or two when he turned to Jeb Bush and said “oh good I see your energy level is higher tonight”. But overall he looked out of his league not giving any detail. Would I vote for him over Hillary Clinton-ABSOLUTELY! But we have far better than him.

Scott Walker- I don’t know what it is about Walker. He has his facts right. He has a good record as Governor, maybe it’s just his goofy looks. He does not seem to project leadership. Not as bad as Ben Carson but pretty bad. He also had a good moment vs Trump when he told Trump “we don’t need an apprentice as President we already have one and he didn’t work out too well.”

In the end I think this was a pivotal debate for a certain few. I would be surprised if the winners in this debate did not gain some ground. I would also be surprised if Trump holds the lead for very much longer. I think what you saw last night was the very beginning of the end for Trump. Sure I could be wrong, it may take a while but there is no way that in such a great GOP field that Trump is going to shine in the end. One way he could do it is If he actually spends some money and hires the best advisors and starts boning up on the issues. If he doesn’t do this as the field narrows he will be shown to be a lightweight. Did you hear that Donald do your homework!

Also, I’d be very surprised if Fiorina’s numbers did not go up dramatically after this debate. [/quote]

Only thing I really disagree with about is your Christie assertion. Dude’s an windbag. And the way he scolded Trump and Fiorina made him look like a jealous petulant child and a bully to boot.[/quote]

I wonder do you not like Christie because of how he spoke about Trump and Fiorina, or did you not like Christie before the debate?

There are people who just started paying attention and I do believe that Christie sounded very in charge when he chastised them for talking about how successful they are. He turned it around in a masterful way to talk about how he wants to help the 55 year old guy who is unemployed.

I am not a fan of Christie at all, but objectively that was a very good moment for him.
[/quote]

I’ve been aware of Christie for some time - I think since he right after he got elected Gov of NJ (I live in the Northeast and he makes the news in my state from time to time). I started out liking him but the more I listen to him and his bullshit the more I think he’s a piece of shit tyrant who doesn’t give a shit about facts or truth and only wants things his way.

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[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
Based on what?
[/quote]
How about her support for TARP, NCLB, and further federal involvement in education? From her disertation:

I have ended by believing that we will never meet our own expectations of public education unless the federal government is willing to play a consistent, long term role.

Or should we talk about her support of McCain’s cap-and-trade proposal instead? Or her flip-flop on abortion? How about her support of Sonia Sotomayor?

[quote]
HP didn’t acquire Compaq. The two companies merged and there was a lot of internal opposition to the move from what I’ve read. Organic growth, in the tech industry right after the bubble burst (less than a year after she became CEO), okay…

“You look back now, and Carly [Fiorina, former HP CEO] was right Ã?¢?? there was a lot of synergy between the two companies,” Tommy Wald, CEO of White Glove Technologies in Austin, Texas, said. “The merger worked out well in retrospect. I think they turned the combined company into a strong channel company, which is what we were all concerned about as partners.”

"HP said the merger paved the way for it to become the No. 1 IT company in the world.

‘The combination of HP and Compaq built a business that achieved more together much faster than either company could on its own and built the foundation for the worldÃ?¢??s largest technology company,’ HP said in a statement to CRN."[/quote]

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“I started out liking him but the more I listen to him and his bullshit the more I think he’s a piece of shit tyrant who doesn’t give a shit about facts or truth and only wants things his way”

^^^^^^^^^^^^^You just described every politician in office, and every candidate trying to win an office. Remember if ANY politician: Republican, Democrat, or Independent is moving their lips, they are lying for their own self interest. Overall, last night, they all looked like the idiots they are. Lets see: We have HRC and BS on one side, and the field of idiots on the other, WOW, what a selection of “leaders” for our country.

40

[quote]idaho wrote:
“I started out liking him but the more I listen to him and his bullshit the more I think he’s a piece of shit tyrant who doesn’t give a shit about facts or truth and only wants things his way”

^^^^^^^^^^^^^You just described every politician in office, and every candidate trying to win an office. Remember if ANY politician: Republican, Democrat, or Independent is moving their lips, they are lying for their own self interest. Overall, last night, they all looked like the idiots they are. Lets see: We have HRC and BS on one side, and the field of idiots on the other, WOW, what a selection of “leaders” for our country. [/quote]

There exists an ineluctable tension between the moral command and the requirements of successful political action. Consequentialism is the ultimate political morality. A liar who gets the job done is superior to the upright policymaker who falls short of the national interest. Political realism aside, who would you like to see as a presendential candidate?