that’s right, whole grain FTW… no need to blame obesity or disease on this stuff right? it’s whole grain and reduced sugar, lol
like I said. You have good people, with good intentions falling for this marketing crap.
funny…i just saw a commercial for chex promoting that its gluten free and comes in 5 great flavours including extra sugar.
i bet all the mothers will buy it and let their kids have bowls of sugary cereal because its “gluten free”
…just sayin’
[quote]anonym wrote:
OK, then can someone explain why, in the graphs I posted, the United States eats about as much wheat as France does yet sees a significantly greater degree of obesity (approximately the same caloric intake)?
Same for Canada.
Same for Germany.
Italy eats MORE wheat, yet has LESS obese people.
Iran eats about double the wheat and has SIGNIFICANTLY less obese people (again, kcals are about equal).
Romania eats MORE wheat and calories yet has MUCH less obesity.
Etc, etc.
If there’s some sort of “magical” obesity-inducing effect from wheat, then Pakistan must be full of mutants… unless it’s about calories and exercise.
What gives???[/quote]
So what do you think about the US eating the “Mutant Wheat” described in Wheat Belly versus Iran, Italy, Romania etc eating a more “natural” wheat product i.e. less gluten?
Or is it safe to assume due to the economic benefits of our (mutant) high yield wheat, that it has been planted in most industrial nations?
Serious questions.
[quote]MAF14 wrote:
So what do you think about the US eating the “Mutant Wheat” described in Wheat Belly versus Iran, Italy, Romania etc eating a more “natural” wheat product i.e. less gluten?
Or is it safe to assume due to the economic benefits of our (mutant) high yield wheat, that it has been planted in most industrial nations?
Serious questions.[/quote]
Good question. I actually don’t own Wheat Belly, so I honestly don’t know the minutiae of the argument… if someone can post the SparkNotes version of the doc’s problem with our wheat (bullet points are fine), I’d certainly appreciate it. I don’t want to post a response and then have several people chime in to inform me that I missed “this or that” about some aspect of the mutant wheat that is allegedly a significant factor in our obesity epidemic.
I have to give a presentation tomorrow (a gasp nutrition one!) that will likely take up most of my day since I haven’t started it yet. So, I’m not dodging… but I might have to get back to ya on Tuesday.
anonym- figured you were in this field somehow, what is it you do?
eseentially Dr. Davis claims that the wheat we eat contains IIRC 46 chromosomes, essentially double of what our grandparents ate.
I have no clue nor claim that this is bad or worse for us, but it is a contention of his. I wasn’t aware that other countries were still using Einkorn wheat, though I did see an organic market that sells it so I bought some (pasta). I’m not a pasta fan, figured it would be nice to try.
BTW- I would suggest making that your next book to read. Again, I don’t agree with all his points, and even in interviews he says that some of his points could be a stretch, but if anything should create discussion and further investigation.
The book is filled with other good info too, a short page or two about cholesterol that would be important for the avg Amercian to read. He does mention how through testing he sees an increase in LDLb even after just one meal of wheat, and it can last for a few days. Guess I can let you know when I get my NMR back since I had a large pizza about 4 days prior.
I’m waiting for jehovasfitness to post the 10 commandments of eating for the dogmatic zealots… Let me help him start off…
- Thou shalt not partake of gluten containing foods.
While it’s good to be open minded about the potentially adverse effects extremely processed foods can have on you, there’s no need to get worked up over the occasional doughnut or some margarine on your bread or the fact that your meat isn’t free-range organic grass fed…
[quote]ds1973 wrote:
I’m waiting for jehovasfitness to post the 10 commandments of eating for the dogmatic zealots… Let me help him start off…
- Thou shalt not partake of gluten containing foods.
While it’s good to be open minded about the potentially adverse effects extremely processed foods can have on you, there’s no need to get worked up over the occasional doughnut or some margarine on your bread or the fact that your meat isn’t free-range organic grass fed…
[/quote]
that’s the point, I dno’t get worked up, nor do I try to trick myself into thinking moderation of something that does damage isn’t a bad thing. But, that’s ok. I had a large gluten pizza and some ben n jerry’s yesterday, good shit. But, just because I only did that on one day (in moderation maybe, maybe not) was that really “healthy” for my body.
btw- any thoughts on this sign, LOL
[quote]ds1973 wrote:
I’m waiting for jehovasfitness to post the 10 commandments of eating for the dogmatic zealots… Let me help him start off…
- Thou shalt not partake of gluten containing foods.
While it’s good to be open minded about the potentially adverse effects extremely processed foods can have on you, there’s no need to get worked up over the occasional doughnut or some margarine on your bread or the fact that your meat isn’t free-range organic grass fed…
[/quote]
But are YOU being open minded?
[quote]jehovasfitness wrote:
anonym- figured you were in this field somehow, what is it you do?[/quote]
I’m actually just a (mediocre) graduate student. I work in a microbiology lab and as a tutor for undergrads needing help with their nutrition hw.
[quote]jehovasfitness wrote:
eseentially Dr. Davis claims that the wheat we eat contains IIRC 46 chromosomes, essentially double of what our grandparents ate.[/quote]
OK… but so what?
Turkeys have 80 chromosomes. Rice has 24. Pigs have 38 and pineapples have 50.
Do you know what happens when I eat turkey, rice, pig and pineapple?
I feel fine and shit them out the next day. DNA, itself, is not a toxic substance – though it can (and often does) code for proteins that have nasty effects.
What do these extra chromosomes give the wheat that is so awful for our health? At least, more than any other ‘flavor of the week’ food product responsible for all our ills?
MAF,
Will post my response tomorrow. It’s pretty long and I have a headache that makes staring at a monitor difficult so I can’t tell if what I wrote makes as much sense as I want it to.
So this damage that is done when the very small amounts that anonym or JF are talking about when they consume a couple doughnuts or a pizza once a week is really going to ruin your health? I think not. I would wager the body is much more resilant than that. That damage may affect you for a very short time frame until the body can fix said damage. Obviously if the dougnuts or pizza become a frequent feeding the damage will start to compound and will lead the body into deeper and deeper whole that it will have trouble getting out of. So in moderation i think the body will hold its own. Yes
[quote]ryanbCXG wrote:
So this damage that is done when the very small amounts that anonym or JF are talking about when they consume a couple doughnuts or a pizza once a week is really going to ruin your health? I think not. I would wager the body is much more resilant than that. That damage may affect you for a very short time frame until the body can fix said damage. Obviously if the dougnuts or pizza become a frequent feeding the damage will start to compound and will lead the body into deeper and deeper whole that it will have trouble getting out of. So in moderation i think the body will hold its own. Yes[/quote]
That’s all Jehovas is arguing. That it has a negative affect not that it ruins your health and I agree. It’s especially more noticeable if you’re trying to lose weight but I bet it’s less noticeable if you’re trying to put on weight.
The problem with “moderation” is everyone’s definition is going to be different and subjective and until we know more about the negative affects of these foods we won’t have an accurate understanding of what is actually moderation and how much bad food negatively impacts us. But we can definitely see there is a problem considering the increase of obesity in the past 50 years.
[quote]ryanbCXG wrote:
So this damage that is done when the very small amounts that anonym or JF are talking about when they consume a couple doughnuts or a pizza once a week is really going to ruin your health? I think not. I would wager the body is much more resilant than that. That damage may affect you for a very short time frame until the body can fix said damage. Obviously if the dougnuts or pizza become a frequent feeding the damage will start to compound and will lead the body into deeper and deeper whole that it will have trouble getting out of. So in moderation i think the body will hold its own. Yes[/quote]
Sure, of course.
But was somebody on this site insisting we must be perfect all the time? What was TC’s point? If his point was what you just said, that’s uncontroversially true. Then why write that article? Straw man, down.
Maybe he got drunk and decided to be a shit-stirrer…
[quote]jehovasfitness wrote:
btw- any thoughts on this sign, LOL[/quote]
6000 thumbs up for Green Grocer.
[quote]ryanbCXG wrote:
So this damage that is done when the very small amounts that anonym or JF are talking about when they consume a couple doughnuts or a pizza once a week is really going to ruin your health? I think not. I would wager the body is much more resilant than that. That damage may affect you for a very short time frame until the body can fix said damage. Obviously if the dougnuts or pizza become a frequent feeding the damage will start to compound and will lead the body into deeper and deeper whole that it will have trouble getting out of. So in moderation i think the body will hold its own. Yes[/quote]
so, what’s the line of moderation that won’t cause long-term issues?
[quote]Grimlorn wrote:
[quote]ryanbCXG wrote:
So this damage that is done when the very small amounts that anonym or JF are talking about when they consume a couple doughnuts or a pizza once a week is really going to ruin your health? I think not. I would wager the body is much more resilant than that. That damage may affect you for a very short time frame until the body can fix said damage. Obviously if the dougnuts or pizza become a frequent feeding the damage will start to compound and will lead the body into deeper and deeper whole that it will have trouble getting out of. So in moderation i think the body will hold its own. Yes[/quote]
That’s all Jehovas is arguing. That it has a negative affect not that it ruins your health and I agree. It’s especially more noticeable if you’re trying to lose weight but I bet it’s less noticeable if you’re trying to put on weight.
The problem with “moderation” is everyone’s definition is going to be different and subjective and until we know more about the negative affects of these foods we won’t have an accurate understanding of what is actually moderation and how much bad food negatively impacts us. But we can definitely see there is a problem considering the increase of obesity in the past 50 years.[/quote]
Agreed on all counts, and thanks for the clarification. I don’t purpose that eating 2 doughnuts a week, that may cause very little harm, over the years will suddenly knock 3 yrs off your life. But, to rely on “moderation” to feel all warm and fuzzy is misguided IMO.
I’ve talked to one very obese lady attempting to lose weight and she said that people telling her to use moderation is like telling a drug addict to use moderation.
moderation = long term chronic ailments?
[quote]phishfood1128 wrote:
moderation = long term chronic ailments?[/quote]
I guess so. Sounds like peoples idea of moderation is scewed and they cant seem undertand that vocab word. Had that problem in the sugar is toxic thread as well.
[quote]jehovasfitness wrote:
As I mentioned int he spill…
Pink Slime- not a health hazard, just gross sounding, most people that are in an uproar eat way worse shit.
[/quote]
Pink slime is protein in a lot of dog foods.
Will the dog food kill you? No.
Do I want unsuspecting children eating it simply because it’s cheap? No.
I pay a sh*t ton of taxes every year and I would like to think that at least some of that money goes to schools so that kids can eat something better than dog food protein. (Public schools were the largest buyers of pink slime)
I have lived in many cities (DC, Detroit, Atlanta, and Miami) and know first hand that the best meal some kids get every day is the free or reduced lunch at school. At least give these kids a chance at a decent meal that doesn’t include the scraps that we feed to animals.