Your Thoughts About 'The Pump'?

Bigger Stronger Leaner Competitive Bodybuilding
21

"With the above being said, I would like to note that I do feel the ability to get ?pumped? during a workout is a good indicator of your body?s muscle-building state. In other words, if you can get a good pump during a workout, there?s a good chance your body is well-hydrated, well-fed and in an anabolic state. In order to get pumped, your body must deliver an adequate amount of blood to your working muscles; This blood delivers a great deal of nutrients which will increase amino acid uptake. These nutrients and amino acids create a good environment in your muscles for potential growth.

On the other hand, have you ever gone to the gym and were unable to get pumped no matter what you did? Whenever I?ve been unable to get a pump at the gym, it was always because of one of the following factors:

I was dieting and not eating enough
I was sick or it was my 1st workout back after having been sick
I had a stressful day at work
I didn?t sleep well the night before
Most of us know to try and avoid the above factors if we?re trying to build muscle and stay healthy. Ironically, these ?catabolic factors? also make it very difficult to get a pump during your workout. That?s why I feel a good pump at the gym can be a good indication of your muscle-building state.

Although a good pump is a good indication that your body is in an anabolic state – getting pumped should not be the main focus of your workout; If you want to build muscle, you have to lift heavy weights! Focus on getting stronger in the main lifts and then pump up with your accessory exercises."

  • Joe D
22

[quote]ViKtoricus wrote:

two years ago, my max front squat (shoulder-width stance and ATG) was 315. I never did the Olympic lifts. Now, after not training for 2 years, I’m back to being a novice and can’t even front squat 225.

I’ll give it four months MAX to get back to my original strength, and then I will continue to progress.[/quote]

Full marks for evasiveness. I didn’t ask about your front squat numbers - I asked how far away you were from the c & j goal that you, for reasons only known to yourself, say you need to reach before you can start bodybuilding.

But, I guess the fact that you can’t give a direct answer to that is as good an indicator as any that this whole scenario of yours is made up. Either that or your goals have changed since you started this thread.

Neither of these bode well. Saves me doing it the long way.

23

[quote]roybot wrote:

[quote]ViKtoricus wrote:

two years ago, my max front squat (shoulder-width stance and ATG) was 315. I never did the Olympic lifts. Now, after not training for 2 years, I’m back to being a novice and can’t even front squat 225.

I’ll give it four months MAX to get back to my original strength, and then I will continue to progress.[/quote]

Full marks for evasiveness. I didn’t ask about your front squat numbers - I asked how far away you were from the c & j goal that you, for reasons only known to yourself, say you need to reach before you can start bodybuilding.

But, I guess the fact that you can’t give a direct answer to that is as good an indicator as any that this whole scenario of yours is made up. Either that or your goals have changed since you started this thread.

Neither of these bode well. Saves me doing it the long way.[/quote]
Let’s guesstimate: I front squat 308 and clean and jerk 198 pounds. Assuming OP is the same (umad?), his clean and jerk is 145 pounds. So he only needs to get 180% stronger.

A 405 pound clean and jerk is advanced as hell. No matter what you weigh. I wish you luck in your pursuit of this goal, but you should be aware of how much work it will take. And that you might not ever get to start bodybuilding with that policy.

24

Is the pump the end-all-be-all of a workout? No.
But if my training, nutrition and recovery are on point then in most muscle groups I find myself naturally achieving a pump.

25

[quote]kakno wrote:

[quote]roybot wrote:

[quote]ViKtoricus wrote:

two years ago, my max front squat (shoulder-width stance and ATG) was 315. I never did the Olympic lifts. Now, after not training for 2 years, I’m back to being a novice and can’t even front squat 225.

I’ll give it four months MAX to get back to my original strength, and then I will continue to progress.[/quote]

Full marks for evasiveness. I didn’t ask about your front squat numbers - I asked how far away you were from the c & j goal that you, for reasons only known to yourself, say you need to reach before you can start bodybuilding.

But, I guess the fact that you can’t give a direct answer to that is as good an indicator as any that this whole scenario of yours is made up. Either that or your goals have changed since you started this thread.

Neither of these bode well. Saves me doing it the long way.[/quote]
Let’s guesstimate: I front squat 308 and clean and jerk 198 pounds. Assuming OP is the same (umad?), his clean and jerk is 145 pounds. So he only needs to get 180% stronger.

A 405 pound clean and jerk is advanced as hell. No matter what you weigh. I wish you luck in your pursuit of this goal, but you should be aware of how much work it will take. And that you might not ever get to start bodybuilding with that policy.[/quote]

It is. And I know how to train for it. Whether or not my genetics will allow me to do it (which I’m sure it will), I will not stop trying to pursue it.

It is fair to say that by the time I even come CLOSE to that, I’ll already look good!

:smiley:

And please stay on topic.

26

[quote]ViKtoricus wrote:

I never did the Olympic lifts. [/quote]

[quote]ViKtoricus wrote:

And I know how to train for it. [/quote]

Lurking and found this funny. Carry on.

27

[quote]ViKtoricus wrote:

[quote]kakno wrote:

[quote]roybot wrote:

[quote]ViKtoricus wrote:

two years ago, my max front squat (shoulder-width stance and ATG) was 315. I never did the Olympic lifts. Now, after not training for 2 years, I’m back to being a novice and can’t even front squat 225.

I’ll give it four months MAX to get back to my original strength, and then I will continue to progress.[/quote]

Full marks for evasiveness. I didn’t ask about your front squat numbers - I asked how far away you were from the c & j goal that you, for reasons only known to yourself, say you need to reach before you can start bodybuilding.

But, I guess the fact that you can’t give a direct answer to that is as good an indicator as any that this whole scenario of yours is made up. Either that or your goals have changed since you started this thread.

Neither of these bode well. Saves me doing it the long way.[/quote]
Let’s guesstimate: I front squat 308 and clean and jerk 198 pounds. Assuming OP is the same (umad?), his clean and jerk is 145 pounds. So he only needs to get 180% stronger.

A 405 pound clean and jerk is advanced as hell. No matter what you weigh. I wish you luck in your pursuit of this goal, but you should be aware of how much work it will take. And that you might not ever get to start bodybuilding with that policy.[/quote]

It is. And I know how to train for it. Whether or not my genetics will allow me to do it (which I’m sure it will), I will not stop trying to pursue it.

It is fair to say that by the time I even come CLOSE to that, I’ll already look good!

:smiley:

And please stay on topic.[/quote]

It was on topic. You were the one who swapped c & j for front squat.

28

[quote]kakno wrote:
Let’s guesstimate: I front squat 308 and clean and jerk 198 pounds. Assuming OP is the same (umad?), his clean and jerk is 145 pounds. So he only needs to get 180% stronger.

A 405 pound clean and jerk is advanced as hell. No matter what you weigh. I wish you luck in your pursuit of this goal, but you should be aware of how much work it will take. And that you might not ever get to start bodybuilding with that policy.[/quote]

Taking into consideration wolves, vampires, head fire, etc…I believe this leave you with an effective c&j of about 250lbs.

29

[quote]wannabebig25 wrote:

[quote]mr popular wrote:
As far as the actual topic goes, people say that the pump doesn’t matter, but the truth is if you’ve just done your heavy set for that exercise and you don’t have a big pump in the target muscle group, then you’re doing something wrong.[/quote]

i cant get a pump in my back, shoulders or chest if my life depended on it. unless i do a rest pause triple drop set.

arms and legs are a different story.[/quote]

Then I would say you are training your back, shoulders, and chest incorrectly. I can see how your deltoids are lagging in your picture, can’t see anything else, but I suggest you figure out how to hit those muscles better.

30

[quote]mr popular wrote:

[quote]wannabebig25 wrote:

[quote]mr popular wrote:
As far as the actual topic goes, people say that the pump doesn’t matter, but the truth is if you’ve just done your heavy set for that exercise and you don’t have a big pump in the target muscle group, then you’re doing something wrong.[/quote]

i cant get a pump in my back, shoulders or chest if my life depended on it. unless i do a rest pause triple drop set.

arms and legs are a different story.[/quote]

Then I would say you are training your back, shoulders, and chest incorrectly. I can see how your deltoids are lagging in your picture, can’t see anything else, but I suggest you figure out how to hit those muscles better.[/quote]

pre exhausting my chest with incline flyes worked like a charm yesterday. really good pump and a soreness today ive never felt. used 20-40lbs less on the compounds that followed but i still fried my chest. chest fixed. now to find out shoulders and back!

31

I think the pump is very important…increased blood flow to the target muscle group is important for growth. I usually am able to get a pump on pretty much any exercise except if I’m training very very low reps (1-3). I think for bodybuilders and powerlfters alike, it’s important for growth.

32

[quote]wannabebig25 wrote:

[quote]mr popular wrote:

[quote]wannabebig25 wrote:

[quote]mr popular wrote:
As far as the actual topic goes, people say that the pump doesn’t matter, but the truth is if you’ve just done your heavy set for that exercise and you don’t have a big pump in the target muscle group, then you’re doing something wrong.[/quote]

i cant get a pump in my back, shoulders or chest if my life depended on it. unless i do a rest pause triple drop set.

arms and legs are a different story.[/quote]

Then I would say you are training your back, shoulders, and chest incorrectly. I can see how your deltoids are lagging in your picture, can’t see anything else, but I suggest you figure out how to hit those muscles better.[/quote]

pre exhausting my chest with incline flyes worked like a charm yesterday. really good pump and a soreness today ive never felt. used 20-40lbs less on the compounds that followed but i still fried my chest. chest fixed. now to find out shoulders and back![/quote]

if you find out how to pump up your delts PLEASE let me know!!

33

[quote]MAF14 wrote:

[quote]wannabebig25 wrote:

[quote]mr popular wrote:

[quote]wannabebig25 wrote:

[quote]mr popular wrote:
As far as the actual topic goes, people say that the pump doesn’t matter, but the truth is if you’ve just done your heavy set for that exercise and you don’t have a big pump in the target muscle group, then you’re doing something wrong.[/quote]

i cant get a pump in my back, shoulders or chest if my life depended on it. unless i do a rest pause triple drop set.

arms and legs are a different story.[/quote]

Then I would say you are training your back, shoulders, and chest incorrectly. I can see how your deltoids are lagging in your picture, can’t see anything else, but I suggest you figure out how to hit those muscles better.[/quote]

pre exhausting my chest with incline flyes worked like a charm yesterday. really good pump and a soreness today ive never felt. used 20-40lbs less on the compounds that followed but i still fried my chest. chest fixed. now to find out shoulders and back![/quote]

if you find out how to pump up your delts PLEASE let me know!![/quote]

My shoulder routine is

Seated Dumbbell Press
Behind the back cable Lateral Raises
Hammer Strength Shoulder Press
Dumbbell Lateral Raises
Cable Rear Delt
Delt Triad (Superset seated lateral raises x15, front raises x15, OHP x15 all with the same weight, like 20 lbs)

afterwards my shoulders are so pumped I can barely lift my arms

I agree if you aren’t getting a pump, you aren’t training right. I get a pump in the first 1-2 sets

34

[quote]MAF14 wrote:

[quote]wannabebig25 wrote:

[quote]mr popular wrote:

[quote]wannabebig25 wrote:

[quote]mr popular wrote:
As far as the actual topic goes, people say that the pump doesn’t matter, but the truth is if you’ve just done your heavy set for that exercise and you don’t have a big pump in the target muscle group, then you’re doing something wrong.[/quote]

i cant get a pump in my back, shoulders or chest if my life depended on it. unless i do a rest pause triple drop set.

arms and legs are a different story.[/quote]

Then I would say you are training your back, shoulders, and chest incorrectly. I can see how your deltoids are lagging in your picture, can’t see anything else, but I suggest you figure out how to hit those muscles better.[/quote]

pre exhausting my chest with incline flyes worked like a charm yesterday. really good pump and a soreness today ive never felt. used 20-40lbs less on the compounds that followed but i still fried my chest. chest fixed. now to find out shoulders and back![/quote]

if you find out how to pump up your delts PLEASE let me know!![/quote]

ive tried doing max weight laterals for 8-12 reps and going STRAIGHT into barbell shoulder press. it pumps my shoulders up like crazy, but the weight on shoulder press is reduced by over 50%, so i didnt see it as an effective growth stimulus.

what im going to try is from skips longevity dvd, basically doing laterals and rear flyes to pre-exhaust, and then once those sets are done doing my compound for shoulders. instead of super-setting laterals and press like i tried. i hope it works. im naturally a tricep presser on all my pushing compounds fyi.

35

[quote]wannabebig25 wrote:
what im going to try is from skips longevity dvd, basically doing laterals and rear flyes to pre-exhaust, and then once those sets are done doing my compound for shoulders. instead of super-setting laterals and press like i tried. i hope it works. im naturally a tricep presser on all my pushing compounds fyi.[/quote]

x2 that used to work for me but slowly the pump became less and less apparent now i’m right back where i started… maybe im just trying to move the weight up too fast idk

36

[quote]wannabebig25 wrote:

[quote]mr popular wrote:
As far as the actual topic goes, people say that the pump doesn’t matter, but the truth is if you’ve just done your heavy set for that exercise and you don’t have a big pump in the target muscle group, then you’re doing something wrong.[/quote]

i cant get a pump in my back, shoulders or chest if my life depended on it. unless i do a rest pause triple drop set.

arms and legs are a different story.[/quote]
u dont knw what ur doing then

37

[quote]wannabebig25 wrote:

[quote]MAF14 wrote:

[quote]wannabebig25 wrote:

[quote]mr popular wrote:

[quote]wannabebig25 wrote:

[quote]mr popular wrote:
As far as the actual topic goes, people say that the pump doesn’t matter, but the truth is if you’ve just done your heavy set for that exercise and you don’t have a big pump in the target muscle group, then you’re doing something wrong.[/quote]

i cant get a pump in my back, shoulders or chest if my life depended on it. unless i do a rest pause triple drop set.

arms and legs are a different story.[/quote]

Then I would say you are training your back, shoulders, and chest incorrectly. I can see how your deltoids are lagging in your picture, can’t see anything else, but I suggest you figure out how to hit those muscles better.[/quote]

pre exhausting my chest with incline flyes worked like a charm yesterday. really good pump and a soreness today ive never felt. used 20-40lbs less on the compounds that followed but i still fried my chest. chest fixed. now to find out shoulders and back![/quote]

if you find out how to pump up your delts PLEASE let me know!![/quote]

ive tried doing max weight laterals for 8-12 reps and going STRAIGHT into barbell shoulder press. it pumps my shoulders up like crazy, but the weight on shoulder press is reduced by over 50%, so i didnt see it as an effective growth stimulus.

what im going to try is from skips longevity dvd, basically doing laterals and rear flyes to pre-exhaust, and then once those sets are done doing my compound for shoulders. instead of super-setting laterals and press like i tried. i hope it works. im naturally a tricep presser on all my pushing compounds fyi.[/quote]
so in other words u want a pump instead of getting bigger and stronger? ur an idiot

38

[quote]wannabebig25 wrote:

[quote]MAF14 wrote:

[quote]wannabebig25 wrote:

[quote]mr popular wrote:

[quote]wannabebig25 wrote:

[quote]mr popular wrote:
As far as the actual topic goes, people say that the pump doesn’t matter, but the truth is if you’ve just done your heavy set for that exercise and you don’t have a big pump in the target muscle group, then you’re doing something wrong.[/quote]

i cant get a pump in my back, shoulders or chest if my life depended on it. unless i do a rest pause triple drop set.

arms and legs are a different story.[/quote]

Then I would say you are training your back, shoulders, and chest incorrectly. I can see how your deltoids are lagging in your picture, can’t see anything else, but I suggest you figure out how to hit those muscles better.[/quote]

pre exhausting my chest with incline flyes worked like a charm yesterday. really good pump and a soreness today ive never felt. used 20-40lbs less on the compounds that followed but i still fried my chest. chest fixed. now to find out shoulders and back![/quote]

if you find out how to pump up your delts PLEASE let me know!![/quote]

ive tried doing max weight laterals for 8-12 reps and going STRAIGHT into barbell shoulder press. it pumps my shoulders up like crazy, but the weight on shoulder press is reduced by over 50%, so i didnt see it as an effective growth stimulus.

what im going to try is from skips longevity dvd, basically doing laterals and rear flyes to pre-exhaust, and then once those sets are done doing my compound for shoulders. instead of super-setting laterals and press like i tried. i hope it works. im naturally a tricep presser on all my pushing compounds fyi.[/quote]

Here is my problem with pre-exhaust stuff.

Firstly, it makes progressive overload on the bigger lifts not only slower, but tricky to tell what it’s doing for you. If I did 4 sets of lateral raises before jumping into my overhead presses, and I press 10 more pounds next time than I did this time, I don’t know if I just added muscle mass to my deltoids or my triceps… BECAUSE the shoulders were already pumped, I wouldn’t be able to tell if I was doing it right.

Secondly, I don’t believe in complicated training plans, pre-exhausting this or supersetting these exercises to get some supposed training effect. I believe the best results you will see are going to be from making the basics work for you. If overhead presses aren’t making your front delts pumped during the workout, and your shoulders don’t grow from doing them, the solution is to find out what the hell are you doing so wrong on overhead presses.

Are your hands at least 6 inches wider than your shoulders while holding the bar? Are you bringing the bar all the way down to your neck? Are your elbows flaring out, tucking in, angled forward, are they not even under the bar? These would all be questions to ask yourself if you’re feelings OHPs too much in the triceps. Some people also find they get better shoulder stimulation by sitting on a bench without using any back support (and lowering every rep to the clavicle).

You also mentioned you have trouble with your chest. Are you using a full ROM? Are you getting a stretch in your pecs at the bottom of every rep of bench presses? Are you taking a relatively wide grip on the barbell? Are you lifting continuously throughout your sets, or are you powering up each rep like a 1RM attempt?

Things to think about.

39

[quote]mr popular wrote:

[quote]wannabebig25 wrote:

[quote]MAF14 wrote:

[quote]wannabebig25 wrote:

[quote]mr popular wrote:

[quote]wannabebig25 wrote:

[quote]mr popular wrote:
As far as the actual topic goes, people say that the pump doesn’t matter, but the truth is if you’ve just done your heavy set for that exercise and you don’t have a big pump in the target muscle group, then you’re doing something wrong.[/quote]

i cant get a pump in my back, shoulders or chest if my life depended on it. unless i do a rest pause triple drop set.

arms and legs are a different story.[/quote]

Then I would say you are training your back, shoulders, and chest incorrectly. I can see how your deltoids are lagging in your picture, can’t see anything else, but I suggest you figure out how to hit those muscles better.[/quote]

pre exhausting my chest with incline flyes worked like a charm yesterday. really good pump and a soreness today ive never felt. used 20-40lbs less on the compounds that followed but i still fried my chest. chest fixed. now to find out shoulders and back![/quote]

if you find out how to pump up your delts PLEASE let me know!![/quote]

ive tried doing max weight laterals for 8-12 reps and going STRAIGHT into barbell shoulder press. it pumps my shoulders up like crazy, but the weight on shoulder press is reduced by over 50%, so i didnt see it as an effective growth stimulus.

what im going to try is from skips longevity dvd, basically doing laterals and rear flyes to pre-exhaust, and then once those sets are done doing my compound for shoulders. instead of super-setting laterals and press like i tried. i hope it works. im naturally a tricep presser on all my pushing compounds fyi.[/quote]

Here is my problem with pre-exhaust stuff.

Firstly, it makes progressive overload on the bigger lifts not only slower, but tricky to tell what it’s doing for you. If I did 4 sets of lateral raises before jumping into my overhead presses, and I press 10 more pounds next time than I did this time, I don’t know if I just added muscle mass to my deltoids or my triceps… BECAUSE the shoulders were already pumped, I wouldn’t be able to tell if I was doing it right.

Secondly, I don’t believe in complicated training plans, pre-exhausting this or supersetting these exercises to get some supposed training effect. I believe the best results you will see are going to be from making the basics work for you. If overhead presses aren’t making your front delts pumped during the workout, and your shoulders don’t grow from doing them, the solution is to find out what the hell are you doing so wrong on overhead presses.

Are your hands at least 6 inches wider than your shoulders while holding the bar? Are you bringing the bar all the way down to your neck? Are your elbows flaring out, tucking in, angled forward, are they not even under the bar? These would all be questions to ask yourself if you’re feelings OHPs too much in the triceps. Some people also find they get better shoulder stimulation by sitting on a bench without using any back support (and lowering every rep to the clavicle).

You also mentioned you have trouble with your chest. Are you using a full ROM? Are you getting a stretch in your pecs at the bottom of every rep of bench presses? Are you taking a relatively wide grip on the barbell? Are you lifting continuously throughout your sets, or are you powering up each rep like a 1RM attempt?

Things to think about.[/quote]

i found several things wrong with my form that ive since corrected. taking too WIDE of a grip. the perfect grip for me for shoulders and chest barbell exercises is my hands 2-3" from my shoulders. i now feel it in my muscles and not pain in my joints.

i was notorious for using too much weight and locking out every rep and taking 2-3 seconds in between reps. ive since corrected this, use less weight, and go with a more fluid motion, never locking out.

i also found that holding the stretched position in the bottom of chest presses for 1-2 seconds just sends more blood into the muscle and gives me a better mind to muscle connection.

with shoulder presses i find bringing the bar down to my clavicle and keeping my elbows pointed forward gives me a better MMC in my shoulders.

its little stuff i never realized i was doing wrong, i just went in, moved the weight from point A to B and tried to add 5lbs every couple of workouts. i grew no doubt, but still had lagging muscles due to poor mind to muscle connection. thats why i feel pre-exhausting for a couple months will help get that MMC in my back, chest and shoulders.

40

[quote]wannabebig25 wrote:
with shoulder presses i find bringing the bar down to my clavicle and keeping my elbows pointed forward gives me a better MMC in my shoulders.[/quote]

def gonna try this…

any way in regards to feeling your back a couple of things that have helped me…

keeping elbows close to the body (lats)
not letting arms fully straighten at end of movement (lats and upper back)
putting an emphasis on pulling with the pinky - pulldowns (lats)
with a neutral v-grip pulling the bar apart (upper back)
dropping the weight and squeezing the contraction for 1-2 seconds (lats and upper back)