Yet Another Keto Kicking Article

Is it just me (quite possibly) or is keto bashing becoming a regular item for the powers that be at T Nation Towers?

The latest instalment has to be one of the poorest yet. In summary: lifters who think they’re doing keto eat too much protein and are therefore not in ketosis. Further, any perceived positive results are masking the fact it’s probably gluconeogenesis at work, which is, as everyone knows, inherently evil.

Perhaps it’s no secret folks wanting to lose fat and build muscle (yes, the latter can and does occur while on a ketogenic diet) on a diet designed for epileptic children, or that followed by necessity by Eskimos, modify it to suit their needs. Anyway, I’m off to get by ketone meter out to reassure myself that, despite eating 250g protein last night, I’m at least 0.5mmol!!!

FYI eskimos are NOT adapted to keto: quite the contrary actually.

TC isn’t the best writer but the point remains; a long term keto diet is only a rather outdated therapeutic strategy for epileptics. Not saying it doesn’t have short term advantages tho, which I believe TC mentions in the article

Whether it’s beneficial short v long term is an aside, the main point of his article is that followers are deluding themselves into the belief they’re in ketosis and that their perceived results are similarly delusional.

I rate TC as a writer but this is the second keto article on the trot he has contrived in a bid to downplay its efficacy, and he’s made a poor job of it too.

I personally can’t sustain straight keto diets for long periods of time but a cyclic keto diet has been my go to cutting diet every year for past 20 yrs. I found it preserves the most muscle and burns more fat than any other type of diet I’ve tried. It’s the only way I can get down to mid single digit body fat. And it doesn’t work if I don’t get in ketosis which I make sure I get into every week when doing it. I know many respected trainers poo poo the aspect of actually going into ketosis saying just the lower carbs and calories will work but it doesn’t for me. Just my 2 cents lol.

Something I see a lot with competitors is the widespread thinking that they’re “doing keto” when they’re just doing very low carbs. As was pointed out, unless you limit protein intake, your body is just going to make its own glucose from protein and you won’t enter ketosis anyway.

My own personal pet peeve is how some people honestly believe that you can eat as many calories as you want so long as you’re “doing keto” and you’ll lose weight -lol. I watched a certain questionable powerlifting “coach” eat enough for a small family just for his lunch a few years ago, and he chuckled to me through his out of breath bites about how he was gonna get ripped.

My personal opinion is that Keto is just one tool to have in your toolbag as a physique athlete (competitor or not). It works great for some people, not so great (or as comfortably) for others. Some people can do it long term (entire preps), others can use it to get the ball rolling before adopting a more controlled carb approach, or even just those last few weeks before a show.



but, if you’re keto you won’t get to buy any Surge

Anyway, I do think there is a difference between being in a keto-adapted state where the body is burning mostly ketones for energy, and “straddling” ketosis like Frank Zane (for example) and even Arnold advocate and advocated in the past. Both of them recommended cutting back on carbs just to the point of having low ketones but then sliding back up in carbs. And I have seen higher carb “dieters” wake up with 0.4-0.6 ketones from a night time fast. I have also seen people show up with high ketones in a calorie restricted state after a hard workout.

The reason why 250 grams of protein doesn’t make sense is because there is research that demonstrates that protein requires about half as much insulin as carbs to manage on a gram per gram basis. I’ve mentioned before that a type 1 diabetic who eats only protein at a meal will have a blood sugar rise equal to about half that amount of carbs over roughly twice the time frame (or inject corresponding levels of insulin to match). If protein didn’t get largely turned into glucose then where does it go? 80 grams of amino acids in the body yield approximately 1 pound of hydrated body tissue, and there is no where else to store it. Give me a pathway to show me where it goes. image

No, it’s just you.

Paul Carter explaining benefits of a keto diet: The Anti-Inflammation Toolkit

Chris Alpert explaining how to setup an effective keto plan: Keto: You're Doing It Wrong

Thibaudeau explaining the pros and cons of keto dieting: Should You Go Keto?

TC with a quick tip, “This certainly isn’t a dietary game changer but it’s worth trying, especially if you’re going low-carb or keto.”: Tip: Use This to Make Zero-Carb Sandwiches

Keto dieting is a popular and highly debated topic currently making the rounds in the fitness world, so of course it’s going to be a recurring article topic. You can disagree with the info presented, but it’s disingenuous to make it seem like it’s a one-sided discussion that the T Nation collective is set against.

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There’s a couple articles hating on the Bulletproof coffee but no mention of the actual diet that you must follow while drinking the bulletproof coffee too…seems a little ignorant to bash one part of a program but not take into account the whole thing

There have been exactly two articles discussing the problems with bulletproof coffee. Fat Loss & High Protein Breakfast and Bulletproof Coffee is Stupid.

Both of them address the idea that “it replaces breakfast”, which is one approach recommended by the guy who created the drink. Following the entire “Bulletproof Diet” isn’t required, or necessarily common, when having bulletproof coffee. Especially since the coffee was created and popularized before the diet existed.

Well we all run around in different circles. I remember there being like a 3 month time period where every once in awhile I would hear about the coffee but not the diet. That was around two or more years ago. Now half the people I talk to regularly have tried or is currently trying the diet. So it’s very common to me, but that’s a bit abstract…I know you guys don’t do article suggestions but it’d be awesome if someone did a review on the DIET and not the just the coffee itself since the creator has since said that you wouldn’t reap the full benefits of the coffee without being on the diet…also…its not just butter, mct oil, and coffee. There’s many coffee’s he claims are filled with fungus but the one he sells isn’t conveniently. But everyone who claims one method is better than the other tends to push their sponsors cause that’s who pays them. I’m not 100% sold on it but I’ve seen some great results in people. Could be just eating right (most didn’t prior)

Sorry OP for hijacking

Sorry Chris but, despite your efforts, the folks that kick keto hardest on here are Shugart and TC. Both are hardly fringe contributors. As other posters have noted, perhaps the keto lifestyle doesn’t quite fit with the goals of Biotest? Regardless, what I will acknowledge is the good old fashioned democracy which allows folks like Paul Carter and others airtime to state a contrary view, not to mention armchair pundits like myself.

Dude, are you actually upset over an article written about your choice of diet?

If so, that pretty much takes the cake for 1st. World problems.


‘Dude’, I don’t know if that was addressed to me but let me assure you I’m upset about many important things, e.g. Scotland not being at this World Cup, but not about a bit of healthy debate on these forums. So do us a favour and lend your worldly wisdom to a more ‘worthy’ thread.

It was for the best :stuck_out_tongue:

Yes, I’m hopeful once they expand the tournament to 64 teams we may indeed qualify!

So you’ve changed your argument from “the powers that be at T Nation regularly bash keto” to “these two popular authors bash keto”. Okay. Still wrong, but okay.

The only article I can find where Shugart remotely mentioned keto is this one, where he says to avoid either extreme carb intake - super-low carb or treating every carb as acceptable.

And, again, TC has had the two or three recent articles/tips discussing keto. Other than that, you’d be hard-pressed to make a case for him hating keto. So I’m not sure where you’re getting this false impression.

Lame. Every single Biotest product, with the possible exceptions of Plazma and SWF, would fit into a keto diet. Bark up another tree.

Wrong again. Shugart is the Chief Content Officer and head editor, and basically has the final say about what gets published and what doesn’t. If he was dead-set against keto like you’re claiming, articles discussing the benefits of keto wouldn’t see the light of day.

how did I not know you were Scottish?

Maybe the three of us can go for a carb-free meal next summer. (Does Atkins make haggis bars?)

Ok, so it’s ‘wrong’ for me to describe the ‘Chief Contents Officer’ and ‘head editor’ as 'powers that be at T Nation Towers? Common, Chris, it may be hyperbole but it certainly ain’t wrong!

Yes, the same article where it’s stated “Lifters need carbs to build muscle, perform well, and feel awesome”. Where it’s then stated this is, in fact, a “common sense statement”. Ergo, those who disagree with said statement are also lacking common sense.

I never said “hate”. It’s probably closer to derision topped with a chunky layer of sarcasm.

Now, you’ve given me a good idea…

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