[quote]Headhunter wrote:
Part of America died today. A great company, one of the foundation stones of this, the greatest and most moral country in the history of the world, died.
It died because unions and management had to confront each other, instead of pulling together for all their own good. The company was destroyed because the workers and management no longer deserved to have this magnificent company.
It died because politicians interceded in markets. It died because no country can exist as half-slave and half-free. We dressed it up and called it a ‘mixed economy’ and allowed politicians to ‘put a human face on capitalism’. Yeah. That face now stands in long lines at the unemployment office.
Goodbye GM. We didn’t deserve you anymore. This has become the land of Obama, and Santomajor…the land of Nancy Pelosi…the land of marriage for homosexual perverts…the land where voters who live on park benches get to decide the fate of huge industries. We milked you dry and so you’ve left us. We are getting JUST EXACTLY what we deserve. Such is Justice.
[/quote]
Obama had nothing to do with inflated pay rates for union workers, shit sucking under performing brands, and generally shit sucking vehicles except the Corvette. We should have let that fucker die, put it in a history book, and mourned its death for about 5 minutes and move on.
Obama Motors! They could use his little O logo and paste it right on the front of every Obamamobile!
I can say that about 70% of the cars I see on the road all have Obama bumper stickers on them… Now that Commander hope’n’change wants to make cars, the Obama bumper sticker industry is going to need a bailout soon.
Last year when I was car shopping I really tried to buy an American car. I looked at Chrysler products, which had big ergonomic issues for me. I tried the Chevy Cobalt and Malibu, again the interiors were total fail and not laid out for a driver. I liked a couple of the Buicks, but the gas mileage was not there.
I would up with a Nissan product which I truly enjoy driving even after a year of having it. I know people who swear by their Toyota and Honda products. My neighbor is a mechanic that owns a nice shop, so when I was looking, I talked to him. He likes Hondas and Acuras and steered me away from the Subaru and Mitsubishi lines.
It looks like GM might survive, but the new BIG 3 are arguably Honda, Nissan and Toyota. Throw in Lexus and Inifinti if you like things a bit upscale.
[quote]beachguy498 wrote:
Last year when I was car shopping I really tried to buy an American car. I looked at Chrysler products, which had big ergonomic issues for me. I tried the Chevy Cobalt and Malibu, again the interiors were total fail and not laid out for a driver. I liked a couple of the Buicks, but the gas mileage was not there.
I would up with a Nissan product which I truly enjoy driving even after a year of having it. I know people who swear by their Toyota and Honda products. My neighbor is a mechanic that owns a nice shop, so when I was looking, I talked to him. He likes Hondas and Acuras and steered me away from the Subaru and Mitsubishi lines.
It looks like GM might survive, but the new BIG 3 are arguably Honda, Nissan and Toyota. Throw in Lexus and Inifinti if you like things a bit upscale.
BG[/quote]
The quality of American cars and their ergonomics were put on the back burner to maximize profits and pay UAW wages and benes. This was a stupid strategy, very short-term oriented. And that goes a long way toward explaining why America is in trouble – Obama and Congress can spend untold trillions with no reckoning of tomorrow. The same mindset that destroyed GM created Obama and the libs.
We unthinking idiots get exactly what we deserve — collapsing economies and BHO.
[quote]beachguy498 wrote:
Last year when I was car shopping I really tried to buy an American car. I looked at Chrysler products, which had big ergonomic issues for me. I tried the Chevy Cobalt and Malibu, again the interiors were total fail and not laid out for a driver. I liked a couple of the Buicks, but the gas mileage was not there.
I would up with a Nissan product which I truly enjoy driving even after a year of having it. I know people who swear by their Toyota and Honda products. My neighbor is a mechanic that owns a nice shop, so when I was looking, I talked to him. He likes Hondas and Acuras and steered me away from the Subaru and Mitsubishi lines.
It looks like GM might survive, but the new BIG 3 are arguably Honda, Nissan and Toyota. Throw in Lexus and Inifinti if you like things a bit upscale.
I want to see what happens now that the UAW is an owner of the company. Are they still going to try to get over-inflated pay packages that drive the company to fail again or will they realize they are one of the largest reasons the auto companies failed and act more responsible now that their pension and healthcare plans own a big percentage of GM.
I forget where i read it recently but there was an interview with Jack Welch where he asked someone to name one industry that is heavily unionized and successful…
[quote]DB297 wrote:
I want to see what happens now that the UAW is an owner of the company. Are they still going to try to get over-inflated pay packages that drive the company to fail again or will they realize they are one of the largest reasons the auto companies failed and act more responsible now that their pension and healthcare plans own a big percentage of GM.
I forget where i read it recently but there was an interview with Jack Welch where he asked someone to name one industry that is heavily unionized and successful…[/quote]
Like I mentioned earlier, the scary part is that they control a competitorâ??s labor (Ford). The UAW can now institute slow downs/walk outs/poor quality at Ford plants and monetarily benefit from their stake in GM/Chrysler.
Itâ??s like having a part owner of the Yankees in charge of all trades for the red socks.
There are clear conflicts of interest. At least when they fail again there will be no one to blame but themselves. And after the way Chrysler (and to a lesser but still egregious extent GM) bondholders were treated no one will be willing to lend to them again, just what you want in a capital intensive business. Given the ownership structure and the fact they will never find financing again GM/Chrysler will be nationalized again a few years after they emerge from Ch11. Oh well who is John Galt?
[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:
DB297 wrote:
I want to see what happens now that the UAW is an owner of the company. Are they still going to try to get over-inflated pay packages that drive the company to fail again or will they realize they are one of the largest reasons the auto companies failed and act more responsible now that their pension and healthcare plans own a big percentage of GM.
I forget where i read it recently but there was an interview with Jack Welch where he asked someone to name one industry that is heavily unionized and successful…
Like I mentioned earlier, the scary part is that they control a competitorâ??s labor (Ford). The UAW can now institute slow downs/walk outs/poor quality at Ford plants and monetarily benefit from their stake in GM/Chrysler.
Itâ??s like having a part owner of the Yankees in charge of all trades for the red socks.
[/quote]
yep. as I said, ford is fucked. If I were them I would be laying plans to open plants down south.
This is one of the most disgusting things our gov’t has done in my lifetime. It is an absolute assault on the free market and capitalism. The fact that our gov’t can be bought for whatever the UAW has been paying, is absolutly absurd. Don’t like the CEO of a private company, fire him and put in your guy. Legal backruptcy procedures, out the window. Approval from the legislative branch or anyone else to take over private companies, out the window. Fuck share holders and bond holders to give payola to the UAW, no problem. I honestly cannot believe what I am seeing.
Say what you will about GWB. This guys is taking it to a whole new level. You think we are done bailing out GM and Chrysler? think again. They are going to build the little shit boxes Obama wants them to build, not what people actually want to buy. The tax payer is going to end up subsidizing everyone of them that moves off the lot.
The next move to watch is card check and unionization of southern plants. Anyone want to guess how long that takes?
They will subsidizing them until China stops lending us money. I realize the treasury auctions show China is still buying treasuries but that is b/c there is no viable alternative. Japna is buying thm too but that is only b/c once again no alternative and there is a crazy dictator test firing missles next door and they need our protection.
Eventually the IMF is going to start issuing their own bonds in a big way, treasury yeilds will skyrockt and inflation will run very high. We will prob have a new reserve currency as well but that is another thread.
Then again as I type this I realize that if this happens gas will be up to $10 and we will only be able to afford to drive the smaller cars GM will be making. Maybe it’s our governmnets plan to destroy the US dollar, let inflation run up and force us all to buy GM cars that weigh 50lbs.
[quote]DB297 wrote:
They will subsidizing them until China stops lending us money. I realize the treasury auctions show China is still buying treasuries but that is b/c there is no viable alternative. Japna is buying thm too but that is only b/c once again no alternative and there is a crazy dictator test firing missles next door and they need our protection.
Eventually the IMF is going to start issuing their own bonds in a big way, treasury yeilds will skyrockt and inflation will run very high. We will prob have a new reserve currency as well but that is another thread.
Then again as I type this I realize that if this happens gas will be up to $10 and we will only be able to afford to drive the smaller cars GM will be making. Maybe it’s our governmnets plan to destroy the US dollar, let inflation run up and force us all to buy GM cars that weigh 50lbs. [/quote]
If that happens, people won’t be able to afford a new car. What’s funny is that even at $10 a gallon, you would have to use roughly 3500 gallons of gas in a full size pick-up truck before you would break even on buying a new car vs. driving what you have. This assumes a hybrid is $20k, gets 40mpg and your truck is getting 15mpg.
That’s roughly 50k miles before break even. With inflation, wages will eventually catch up. I think I will wait it out with my pick-em-up truck.
[quote]Growing_Boy wrote:
The Chinese will take over Hummer. LMAO! [/quote]
I thought the Russians would want the Hummer brand. I read somewhere that Hummers are selling like hot cakes in Russia because of a number of factors; they do better on the roads out there, Russian crime organizations use them for all types of crazy shit, they are popular among all those Russians that got rich from oil and see them as a status symbol.
[quote]Growing_Boy wrote:
The Chinese will take over Hummer. LMAO! [/quote]
I thought that was a bit strange as well. Are there certain plants that only make Hummers? Are they just after the plants? I can’t imagine wanting that piece of shit. I apologize to any Hummer owners but they never seemed very functional to me.
