T Nation

WMD in Iraq


#1

From Foxnews.com tonight:

Report: Hundreds of WMDs Found in Iraq
Wednesday, June 21, 2006

WASHINGTON ? The United States has found 500 chemical weapons in Iraq since 2003, and more weapons of mass destruction are likely to be uncovered, two Republican lawmakers said Wednesday.

"We have found weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, chemical weapons," Sen. Rick Santorum, R-Pa., said in a quickly called press conference late Wednesday afternoon.

Reading from a declassified portion of a report by the National Ground Intelligence Center, a Defense Department intelligence unit, Santorum said: "Since 2003, coalition forces have recovered approximately 500 weapons munitions which contain degraded mustard or sarin nerve agent. Despite many efforts to locate and destroy Iraq's pre-Gulf War chemical munitions, filled and unfilled pre-Gulf War chemical munitions are assessed to still exist."

He added that the report warns about the hazards that the chemical weapons could still pose to coalition troops in Iraq.

"The purity of the agents inside the munitions depends on many factors, including the manufacturing process, potential additives and environmental storage conditions. While agents degrade over time, chemical warfare agents remain hazardous and potentially lethal," Santorum read from the document.

"This says weapons have been discovered, more weapons exist and they state that Iraq was not a WMD-free zone, that there are continuing threats from the materials that are or may still be in Iraq," said Rep. Pete Hoekstra, R-Mich., chairman of the House Intelligence Committee.

The weapons are thought to be manufactured before 1991 so they would not be proof of an ongoing WMD program in the 1990s. But they do show that Saddam Hussein was lying when he said all weapons had been destroyed, and it shows that years of on-again, off-again weapons inspections did not uncover these munitions.

Hoekstra said the report, completed in April but only declassified now, shows that "there is still a lot about Iraq that we don't fully understand."

Asked why the Bush administration, if it had known about the information since April or earlier, didn't advertise it, Hoekstra conjectured that the president has been forward-looking and concentrating on the development of a secure government in Iraq.

Offering the official administration response to FOX News, a senior Defense Department official pointed out that the chemical weapons were not in useable conditions.

"This does not reflect a capacity that was built up after 1991," the official said, adding the munitions "are not the WMDs this country and the rest of the world believed Iraq had, and not the WMDs for which this country went to war."

The official said the findings did raise questions about the years of weapons inspections that had not resulted in locating the fairly sizeable stash of chemical weapons. And he noted that it may say something about Hussein's intent and desire. The report does suggest that some of the weapons were likely put on the black market and may have been used outside Iraq.

He also said that the Defense Department statement shortly after the March 2003 invasion saying that "we had all known weapons facilities secured," has proven itself to be untrue.

"It turned out the whole country was an ammo dump," he said, adding that on more than one occasion, a conventional weapons site has been uncovered and chemical weapons have been discovered mixed within them.

Hoekstra and Santorum lamented that Americans were given the impression after a 16-month search conducted by the Iraq Survey Group that the evidence of continuing research and development of weapons of mass destruction was insignificant. But the National Ground Intelligence Center took up where the ISG left off when it completed its report in November 2004, and in the process of collecting intelligence for the purpose of force protection for soldiers and sailors still on the ground in Iraq, has shown that the weapons inspections were incomplete, they and others have said.

"We know it was there, in place, it just wasn't operative when inspectors got there after the war, but we know what the inspectors found from talking with the scientists in Iraq that it could have been cranked up immediately, and that's what Saddam had planned to do if the sanctions against Iraq had halted and they were certainly headed in that direction," said Fred Barnes, editor of The Weekly Standard and a FOX News contributor.

"It is significant. Perhaps, the administration just, they think they weathered the debate over WMD being found there immediately and don't want to return to it again because things are otherwise going better for them, and then, I think, there's mindless resistance to releasing any classified documents from Iraq," Barnes said.

Santorum pointed out that during Wednesday's debate, several Senate Democrats said that no weapons of mass destruction had been found in Iraq, a claim, he said, that the declassified document proves is untrue.

"This is an incredibly ? in my mind ? significant finding. The idea that, as my colleagues have repeatedly said in this debate on the other side of the aisle, that there are no weapons of mass destruction, is in fact false," he said.

As a result of this new information, under the aegis of his chairmanship, Hoekstra said he is going to ask for more reporting by the various intelligence agencies about weapons of mass destruction.

"We are working on the declassification of the report. We are going to do a thorough search of what additional reports exist in the intelligence community. And we are going to put additional pressure on the Department of Defense and the folks in Iraq to more fully pursue a complete investigation of what existed in Iraq before the war," Hoekstra said

Ok, I'm officially angry. First, the saddam tapes now the WMD.

Why in the name of God doesn't the Administration ram this information into every freakin' debate before the mid-term elections.

Bush lied, blah de fu..in' blah.

If these two issues aren't put front and center in the middle of the debate, the Administration deserves the heat it gets.

WMD, links to al qaeda and other terrorists, saddams brutality, Bush wasn't so far off after all.

Oh, for the dinks who are going to castigate foxnews (and not the report), save your breath. It will be reported elsewhere. If you doubt this source, you can pull up the link to NGIC declassified material and read it yourself.

Finally, for anyone who makes commentary about "Oh, these are pre-1991 weapons" I may go back and reference your "No WMD in Iraq" accusations.

Remember just how "sure" you clowns (including scott ritter) where that there were no WMD's.

I'd like to see some of you ABBers have the sack to apologize for some of your vitriole.

JeffR


#2

Why would you leave out the following from the same article?


#3

pox wrote:

I didn't leave it out.

If you read, and didn't rely on purely visceral responses, you would be a better citizen and person.

Oh, and no surprise that you don't have the ability to amend your party's talking points.

Thanks for the usual lack of effort.

JeffR


#4

[b]President Bush said in October of 2004:

"While a small number of old, abandoned chemical munitions have been discovered, ISG judges that Iraq unilaterally destroyed its undeclared chemical weapons stockpile in 1991," the Iraq Survey Group reported in 2004. "There are no credible Indications that Baghdad resumed production of chemical munitions thereafter, a policy ISG attributes to Baghdad's desire to see sanctions lifted, or rendered ineffectual, or its fear of force against it should WMD be discovered."

"The chief weapons inspector, Charles Duelfer, has now issued a comprehensive report that confirms the earlier conclusion of David Kay that Iraq did not have the weapons that our intelligence believed were there."[/b]

Next...


#5

Transcript: Bush Responds to WMD Report

*Forgot to post the link to this text.

If you like that check this out:

Chemical weapons: Buried in the backyard

"In the northwest corner of the District of Columbia, sandwiched between the Potomac River and the Maryland state line, is an affluent enclave of elegant homes and tree-lined streets known as Spring Valley. This neighborhood is home to some 13,000 people, including members of Washington's political and financial elite. The 660-acre community includes approximately 1,200 houses valued at between $600,000 and $1 million, along with the campus of American University, schools, churches, a hospital, foreign embassies, and a theological seminary. Beyond its reputation as a quiet, upscale neighborhood, Spring Valley has a less desirable attribute: It is the only residential area in the United States where a major chemical weapons cleanup operation is under way."

http://www.thebulletin.org/article.php?art_ofn=so01tucker

ROTFLMFAO!


#6

What are you talking about? Visceral responses? What party am I a part of? I have never claimed any party on these boards...EVER.

An officer in the Defense Department said, "

" . Therefore, what WMD's? You just wrote a whole rant as if we finally found some WMD's that proved to everyone that Bush was right on the issue. That isn't true at all. This article isn't doing anything but repeating the same info we've heard over and over.


#7

LOL...and the article was not started from GOP talking points?

Pathetic.

Both parties are a bunch of losers!

A conservative Republican is a Libertarian without conviction.

A liberal Democrat just needs to grow up.


#8

So it's just coincidence that you vote democratic? Or, that you are Anti-Most-Things-Republican?

Got it. You are an "independent."

First of all, thanks for admitting your error. You accused me of cherry-picking information. When I pointed out that that was a false charge, you changed the subject.

Typical pox.

Call things as they are. If you want to be considered an "independent thinker" you might want to take a Conservative stand on an issue more than 0-1% of the time.

Is it now? That's funny. I listened to the debate in Congress and I heard your pals (liberal democrats) trumpeting, slathering, and drooling over the "fact" that no WMD had been found in Iraq.

Wrong.

George Bush clearly stated that hussein had not revealed all of his WMD program--fact. This proves that without any doubt. Here are some hard numbers. If you cannot understand that, I'm not surprised.

He stated that his weapons programs were a threat to the region and the world. The saddam tapes prove support for the worst terrorists on the planet.

You can also read the transcripts and show that saddam questioned his ministers to find out how long it would take to get the weapons up and runnning once sanctions had been lifted.

Finally, the Duefler report shows quite clearly that he maintained his ability to fully reconstitute and expand his arsenal on short notice. It also shows the measures he took to keep this secret.

Therefore, this recent information gives us hard numbers. It shows how easily these and other weapons could be hidden (aka... the UN couldn't find them. aka... Inspections weren't working as a reliable means to deny WMD to saddam.)

It shows clearly that THINGS ARE NOT WRITTEN IN STONE IN IRAQ. Expect more of this information/weapons to show up.

Finally, I don't want to hear anyone make the statement "we found no WMD" in Iraq.

JeffR


#9

Bingo. Bush deserves shit for not pushing this information out there faster.

His admin does a horribel job communicating. He basically deserves shit for not getting the info out.

However our soldiers and our country as a whole do not deserve the bullshit.

I am sick of the anti-American assholes that use the lack of info as a reason to attack the US.

Do you think this will be front page news on the NYT?

Will they report it at all?

This is a good test of their objectivity.


#10

What does this have to do with anything? Where is the humor value?

The US has nukes also. Are you implying that it would have been acceptable for Iraq to have them because we have them?


#11

First, learn how to use the freaking quote function. It has been YEARS and you still haven't figured it out. Second, I am anti-dumbassery. I vote for whoever is the least dumb.

What?

Why? To please you? I take whatever stand I actually support. I could care less about your opinion of it.

Who are my pals?

"This does not reflect a capacity that was built up after 1991," the official said, adding the munitions "are not the WMDs this country and the rest of the world believed Iraq had, and not the WMDs for which this country went to war."

Wait a second,did he just write that these are NOT the WMDs this country and the rest of the world believed Iraq had? I could have sworn he said "are not the WMDs this country and the rest of the world believed Iraq had, and not the WMDs for which this country went to war." Maybe that's just me.


#12

pox,

I fixed the original. Sorry, it was sloppy.

Now, thanks for not understanding that A. I caught you not reading (accusing me of cherrypicking) B. Not understanding that your party (democrats) have been saying no WMD have been found as a tag-line (aka...understanding this destroys that.)

I cannot be any more clear.

JeffR


#13

Good post, Zap.

So far nothing on A.P or Reuters. Listened this morning and nothing that I heard on npr.

Let's watch the liberals...cnn, nytimes, abc, nbc.

Makes me angry that Bush isn't all over this.

You would think his political advisor, Rove, would understand that this information helps bolster support.

Is he being lazy again?

Who is the "official" that made those comments? Is that going to be the Administration line?

If yes, why not say, "This proves that there were WMD and saddam hid them."

JeffR


#14

Concerning A, I accused you of glossing over that statement, which I feel to be VERY significant. I still accuse you of this. Concerning B, I claim no party. I also know that sarin gas or old containers that are unusable today isn't what we went into Iraq for.


#15

I came across this story while searching for the facts on this irrelevant topic.

It points out that buried and long forgotten weapons are everywhere.

That assertion is beyond pathetic.

If and when we 'dig up' nuclear tipped missles in Iraq I will kiss your ass...until the you should save the grade school logic for myspace.com.


#16

The problem is these weapons are so old that the chemicals and/or biological agents are useless and it would only make the current administration look pathetic for finding them this late.

Rick threw this out there for Rove to test the waters.

Didn't work but it was worth a try.

I would have done the same thing if I was them.


#17

The bottom line is that there were WMDs and they had programs in place to produce more.

This undercuts much of the shit said by some of the Dems.

Saddam's programs were not as advanced as we believed but they existed.

Saddam's stockpile of WMDs were not nearly as big as we believed and were not in immediately useable condition.

Anyone that tries to claim there were no WMD's in Iraq is a bigger liar than Bush.


#18

LOL. This is what I believe, "

". Therefore, I do not consider unuseable containers or ancient sarin gas to be WMD's. That means we have not found WMD's because those things are not what we were told we needed to go to war for. Let's quit the word games.


#19

So, we're changing the definition of WMD's to "unusable semi-dangerous toys buried and forgotten about 15 years ago?"


#20

This is false spin.

The weapons and agents are degraded and not immediately useable. They are still quite dangerous. The mustard gas and sarin can be recovered and used.

Saddam hid them and did not destroy them as he was supposed to.

A few years ago I was involved in a project to destroy old mustard gas shells at Aberdeen Proving Grounds.

The stuff was still quite lethal.