T Nation


Why is there so much emphasis on this board about which magic pill to take? I love supplements as much as the rest of you, but if my life depended upon packing on 10lbs of LBM in the next 3 months, I’d take 3 different percentage based powerlifting routines and a solid overfeeding plan alternated with a few days of warrior dieting over supplements any day.

I wonder how many of us randomly pick exercises, weights etc. yet scrutinize to death andro delivery systems. C’mon guys. Priorities!

Thanks Rob!

You’re completely correct…for the most part. I guarantee that 85% of the guys on this board would make some phenomenal progress on a power phase coupled with overfeeding. It frustrates the hell out of me when I get countless questions about the microdetails of supplementation when I know the questioner probably doesnt even do everything else correct.

I read a comment by a university professor that stated that guys waste their time practicing “nutritional micromanagement” when the scope of their plan (the “macro” part of the plan) is faulty in the first place.

BUT…for the other 15% (like myself) that have been training consistently for a LONG time :slight_smile: and have pretty much reached some sort of upper limit on training potential, a discussion of supplements may be necessary and may help add those 10lbs that would have only been water or fat if not taken.

Just my 2 cents, anyway…

Point well taken. This is an experienced board with many members that’ve been training for over a decade. Given that premise, a good ecdysterone product is the best supplement I’ve ever used. I know it isn’t “trendy”, but for me it works wonders when my training, diet and rest habits are in order… my contribution.

It doesn’t happen that an experienced lifter who has been training well for years can just go add 10% to their lifts in 3 months… if it were, every experienced powerlifter who’s benching say 400, 500, or 600, would just go and lift 440, 550, or 660 next time. Doesn’t happen. It is not that easy. That would be superb progress in a year for an advanced lifter.

If you want to get slower results than you otherwise can easily get though, go right ahead! :slight_smile:

I do agree that the beginning trainer can gain so fast with correct training and nutrition that he should not bother with anything besides meal replacement products or protein powder (if he cannot otherwise get at least 6 well balanced meals per day) or fat loss products if he needs to diet. If anything, if his gaining abilities were enhanced, the main effect would be that he’d learn less about training, since poorer training methods might then still give very good results.

Okay, I hate to show my ignorance (since I’m one of those guys who’s been training for over 20 years), but what the heck is ecdysterone? Never heard of this before.

Ecdysterone is a growth or molting hormone for various kinds of insects, and is also important in the lifecycle of various intestinal parasites. It is dubious if it has any other value.

Bill, I respect your opinion. I must be an easy gainer as far as training then. I recently added 40lbs to my 1rm DL in 8 weeks and it was already north of 400lbs.

As far as ecdysterone being nothing special, I really think the industry is missing the boat on this one. Either I have insect receptor sites, or Bill P. did too much damage with his supplement review slamming it. I feel so strongly about this stuff I’m willing to send you a bottle of the 6-keto ECD analog product I’m using now. The stuff has knocked 10 years off of my recovery time. I use straight ECD powder with DMSO because it’s mw is about 480 (similar to 4AD… under 1000), and I thought I could get better absorption for my $$. With FDA puppet Barry McCaffrey’s andro ban looming, you’d think the industry would at least look into ECD.

Thank You all for your opinions. Bill, you sound suspicious but I guess I can’t blame you. I’m sure a lot of people were until they tried, for example, Tribex or Androsol. Let me know on the 6-keto ECD analog. And no, I’m not trying to sell it…in fact, I recently found out this product has been discontinued. I’m already looking for another source…