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Why Use a High Box?

I’ve never actually used a high box in training. Whats the purpose of training above parallel? Seems you would lose strength in the hole.

[quote]evansmi wrote:
I’ve never actually used a high box in training. Whats the purpose of training above parallel? Seems you would lose strength in the hole.[/quote]

I think it’s rediculous to use a box an inch or two above legal depth, and even then just as a different training stimulus. The football coaches preach BFS, which advocates like 2 foot+ high box squats. It’s rediculous.

In fact I might start a BFS HATE thread tomarow.

[quote]evansmi wrote:
I’ve never actually used a high box in training. Whats the purpose of training above parallel? Seems you would lose strength in the hole.[/quote]

from a powerlifting stand point, i dont know. i would guess change of stimulus, overload your body with more weight, and in the athlete side of things, have seen huge increases in full squats, dont know about the powerlifting carryover.

what i can say from experience, that when used in conjunction with full squats or at least in 4-6 week cycles, the slighly above parallel box squat has resulted in- huge vertical jump incresaes, speed incrases, and yes, full squat increases. a 1-2 inch above parallel squat is still pretty deep in the grand scheme of things, just dont use it all the time.

AC

[quote]zephead4747 wrote:
evansmi wrote:
I’ve never actually used a high box in training. Whats the purpose of training above parallel? Seems you would lose strength in the hole.

I think it’s rediculous to use a box an inch or two above legal depth, and even then just as a different training stimulus. The football coaches preach BFS, which advocates like 2 foot+ high box squats. It’s rediculous.

In fact I might start a BFS HATE thread tomarow.[/quote]

Oh yeah, my coach had a major hardon for 10rep max, for fucking everything. Then BFS on top of that so its not even BFS anymore, its a 10 RM box squat, where you just barely touch, on a 2 foot box. Motherfucker.

[quote]evansmi wrote:
I’ve never actually used a high box in training. Whats the purpose of training above parallel? Seems you would lose strength in the hole.[/quote]

Those who squat above parallel should train above parallel.

Yeah, high box squats are ridiculous, just like board presses are ridiculous, and floor presses are ridiculous, and rack pulls are ridiculous, and any other type of partial is ridiculous. There is absolutely no use, ever, for doing partials in one’s routine.

Some ridiculous people do use them to get used to heavier weight in the stronger part of the movement.

[quote]SquatDr wrote:

what i can say from experience, that when used in conjunction with full squats or at least in 4-6 week cycles, the slightly above parallel box squat has resulted in- huge vertical jump increases, speed increases, and yes, full squat increases. a 1-2 inch above parallel squat is still pretty deep in the grand scheme of things, just dont use it all the time.

AC

[/quote]

When you are using high box squats to supplement speed or vert training do you tend to use them in the same cycle as full squats (eg high box squats on Monday, full squats on Friday). Or do you prefer to focus on a specific squat variation for a given cycle (eg 4-6 weeks focusing on high box squats followed by 4-6 weeks focusing on full squats)?

[quote]evansmi wrote:
I’ve never actually used a high box in training. Whats the purpose of training above parallel? Seems you would lose strength in the hole.[/quote]

There is some carry over in strength from one to position to slightly higher and lower. Meaning, as you 1" above box squat increases, so will above that and below that to some degree. If you need to hit depth in a powerlifitng meet, you should learn depth. If you don’t, an inch or so above parallel wouldn’t really matter much in development.

For me every inch is app. 25 pounds for the first 5-6 inches. A slightly below parallel box ssb might be 515. I did hit 555 on two inches higher a few years ago. I am probably close to that now, or better.

As for BFS, it’s fine for most high school kids, because most high school kids won’t listen and a coach has to watch 10+ people. It’s part of not wanting anyone killed.

When I watch young guys lift, the last thing I want to see is some of them squatting unless I’m teaching someone one on one. It’s just scary to see what they often do.

My 13 year old son had better squat form 3-4 years ago than most young people I see.

[quote]johnnytang24 wrote:
Yeah, high box squats are ridiculous, just like board presses are ridiculous, and floor presses are ridiculous, and rack pulls are ridiculous, and any other type of partial is ridiculous. There is absolutely no use, ever, for doing partials in one’s routine.

Some ridiculous people do use them to get used to heavier weight in the stronger part of the movement.[/quote]

I hope this sarcasm because otherwise you made yourself look like a retard.

High box squats are a good lift to train your deadlift with because your hips are in approximately the same position as the would be at the start of a deadlift.

[quote]Pemdas wrote:
johnnytang24 wrote:
Yeah, high box squats are ridiculous, just like board presses are ridiculous, and floor presses are ridiculous, and rack pulls are ridiculous, and any other type of partial is ridiculous. There is absolutely no use, ever, for doing partials in one’s routine.

Some ridiculous people do use them to get used to heavier weight in the stronger part of the movement.

I hope this sarcasm because otherwise you made yourself look like a retard.

High box squats are a good lift to train your deadlift with because your hips are in approximately the same position as the would be at the start of a deadlift. [/quote]

I have a feeling it was. At least I HOPE it was!!

Anyway when I miss squats I miss them about 2 inches above parrallel. I can come out of the hole, but go no further so it would make sense for me to train them up there. But having not done box squats I can’t really comment as to their effeicency just yet. That being said, I think Pemdas’s point about it being a good trainer for your deadlift since the hip position is relatively similar is quite valid.

[quote]Hanley wrote:
Pemdas wrote:
johnnytang24 wrote:
Yeah, high box squats are ridiculous, just like board presses are ridiculous, and floor presses are ridiculous, and rack pulls are ridiculous, and any other type of partial is ridiculous. There is absolutely no use, ever, for doing partials in one’s routine.

Some ridiculous people do use them to get used to heavier weight in the stronger part of the movement.

I hope this sarcasm because otherwise you made yourself look like a retard.

High box squats are a good lift to train your deadlift with because your hips are in approximately the same position as the would be at the start of a deadlift.

I have a feeling it was. At least I HOPE it was!!

Anyway when I miss squats I miss them about 2 inches above parrallel. I can come out of the hole, but go no further so it would make sense for me to train them up there. But having not done box squats I can’t really comment as to their effeicency just yet. That being said, I think Pemdas’s point about it being a good trainer for your deadlift since the hip position is relatively similar is quite valid.[/quote]

I’d agree with both of you.

[quote]Hanley wrote:
Pemdas wrote:
johnnytang24 wrote:
Yeah, high box squats are ridiculous, just like board presses are ridiculous, and floor presses are ridiculous, and rack pulls are ridiculous, and any other type of partial is ridiculous. There is absolutely no use, ever, for doing partials in one’s routine.

Some ridiculous people do use them to get used to heavier weight in the stronger part of the movement.

I hope this sarcasm because otherwise you made yourself look like a retard.

High box squats are a good lift to train your deadlift with because your hips are in approximately the same position as the would be at the start of a deadlift.

I have a feeling it was. At least I HOPE it was!!

Anyway when I miss squats I miss them about 2 inches above parrallel. I can come out of the hole, but go no further so it would make sense for me to train them up there. But having not done box squats I can’t really comment as to their effeicency just yet. That being said, I think Pemdas’s point about it being a good trainer for your deadlift since the hip position is relatively similar is quite valid.[/quote]

Hanely, speed training is going to help you with this. I bet once you get just a little bit faster and more explosive you will blast right through the sticking point. I used to feel the same way. It wasn’t a sticking point so much as I would slow down right about at a height that would be 2in above the box. Learn to stay tighter in the hole and become more explosive and this problem should go away. I want to see of video of this happening. I am willing to bet that your hips your come up a little early when this happens.

[quote]Regular Gonzalez wrote:
SquatDr wrote:

what i can say from experience, that when used in conjunction with full squats or at least in 4-6 week cycles, the slightly above parallel box squat has resulted in- huge vertical jump increases, speed increases, and yes, full squat increases. a 1-2 inch above parallel squat is still pretty deep in the grand scheme of things, just dont use it all the time.

AC

When you are using high box squats to supplement speed or vert training do you tend to use them in the same cycle as full squats (eg high box squats on Monday, full squats on Friday). Or do you prefer to focus on a specific squat variation for a given cycle (eg 4-6 weeks focusing on high box squats followed by 4-6 weeks focusing on full squats)?

[/quote]

not in the same cycle usually.

[quote]Pemdas wrote:
johnnytang24 wrote:
Yeah, high box squats are ridiculous, just like board presses are ridiculous, and floor presses are ridiculous, and rack pulls are ridiculous, and any other type of partial is ridiculous. There is absolutely no use, ever, for doing partials in one’s routine.

Some ridiculous people do use them to get used to heavier weight in the stronger part of the movement.

I hope this sarcasm because otherwise you made yourself look like a retard.

High box squats are a good lift to train your deadlift with because your hips are in approximately the same position as the would be at the start of a deadlift. [/quote]

This is a response to those that think high box squats are ‘rediculous’ and only people that squat high use a high box.

For a while, my squatting consisted only of high box squats and zerchers. My box was 18 inches, so it was pretty high. Keep in mind that I’m not a powerlifter and have never done a competitive squat, but high box squats got me used to holding heavy-ass weights on my back and standing up with them.

I would do reps with weight up to 200 pounds over my parallel squat max. Looking back, I wish I would have tested my max immediately before and after for comparison’s sake, but this “squatting cycle” wasn’t intentional. I probably should have included a little bit of full squatting, but whatever. Anyway I think that it helped in my farmers walk and yoke pick-up speeds. Also, psychologically, I think it helped. 400 pounds doesn’t really feel like much after you’ve had over 600 pounds on your back.

Alright my bad, I probably should have made it clear that I was interested in their effect for powerlifting.

Interesting point about the deadlift, I take it that would be especially true for sumo, since the stance is so similar.

I guess I just wondered if the reasoning was to get used to heavier loads. Because it seems like accommodating resistance already gets one used to supporting heavier loads. Of course sometimes you see people training on a high box plus accommodating resistance, and I suppose thats to get used to heavy heavy ass loads.

I’ll have to cycle these in a few times and see how they effect my lifts.

  1. Psychologically there’s some benefit as malonetd stated. I do think you can get this just by walking out heavy weights though.

  2. It’s very specific to a geared squat, particularly in multiple-ply gear. You need to be able to the heavier weight on your back withough shaking like a leaf. A high box probably helps with that.

  3. My opinion is that they are of very limited value to a raw squatter. The most important elements of a raw squat are stopping power and reversal strength. Starting strength is MUCH less important. But starting strength is by far the most important element of a geared squat, moreso in more aggressive material. The suit will stop you and support you out of the hole. It’s a lot like squatting to a box.

  4. Any box squat will be easier on your knees. This is an important benefit. Even if you are a raw squatter, if you have bad knees, box squats of different heights (but mostly below parallel), lots of good mornings, and lots of single leg work is probably the place to start w/r/t building your squat.

  5. Bottom line, if you’re a raw squatter, just squat. Squat a lot, for high volume with high frequency. Much moreso than the other powerlifts, if you just dramatically increase your workload in this lift, you will be rewarded.

I used to like a higher box. The logic was that I never had depth issues at meets so I might as well put some real weight on the bar and squat high. I was also doing these to train my sumo pull (I have since switched back to conventional) and the higher hip postiiton mimicked my sumo starting position.

[quote]Pemdas wrote:
Hanely, speed training is going to help you with this. I bet once you get just a little bit faster and more explosive you will blast right through the sticking point. I used to feel the same way. It wasn’t a sticking point so much as I would slow down right about at a height that would be 2in above the box. Learn to stay tighter in the hole and become more explosive and this problem should go away. I want to see of video of this happening. I am willing to bet that your hips your come up a little early when this happens.
[/quote]

My hips are good til just about two inches above //, then they shoot back so I can be in a better position to finish the rep out http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=f4mETY099ks

I think training on a higher box certainly makes sense for equipped lifters like myself, I also think it’s a great way of training your deadlift. So there’s at least two points as to why one should use one.

As for losing strength in the hole, unless you’re away from below // squatting completely for an extended period of time I can’t see you “losing” strength. You might not increase it, but once you’re not squatting off a skyscraper I’d imagine you would at least maintain it.

[quote]Pinto wrote:
I used to like a higher box. The logic was that I never had depth issues at meets so I might as well put some real weight on the bar and squat high. I was also doing these to train my sumo pull (I have since switched back to conventional) and the higher hip postiiton mimicked my sumo starting position.

[/quote]

So do you not believe in using a higher box anymore? Why not?

Thanks.