Why I Don't Want to Bench 405

Bigger Stronger Leaner
161

[quote]Mr.Purple wrote:
Everyone makes such a huge deal about this on forums, I don’t get it. The very first place I ever worked, there was a bodybuilder working also. This guy was 280+, and pretty lean-used weights at the gym that had my eyes popping out. There were a lot of late nights, and a lot of heavy work, but this guy would go to the gym after a 18-hour shift to get his workout done, 6 hours of sleep if he was lucky, and back to work the next day. He never even mentioned it during the days, or even looked tired. Now a few years later I saw him in contest condition, greatest physique I ever saw in person.

Nowadays I never see guys like that at the gym, who are all buisness and taking no prisoners. That’s why I come to a bodybuilding forum, to talk to guys like that.

Why would anyone logging on to a bodybuilding forum want to read about a guy who doesn’t want to bench 405?
[/quote]

I’d agree with this thread if the reasoning behind the title was this:
I don’t want to bench 405 because all I care about is the progress I make with my physique. The weight I use is inconsequential, and numbers are nothing more than bragging statistics.

162

[quote]dwall33 wrote:
I’d agree with this thread if the reasoning behind the title was this:
I don’t want to bench 405 because all I care about is the progress I make with my physique. The weight I use is inconsequential, and numbers are nothing more than bragging statistics.[/quote]

You don’t really believe that [quote]numbers are nothing more than bragging statistics,[/quote] do you?

If so… wow.

163

[quote]LankyMofo wrote:
jbird643 wrote:
Lets face it: Professor X sucks at life. 27,000 posts in a forum? wtf?

I HATE sticking up for X because he’s better at it than I am, but some of you morons have to realize that some of us have jobs where we have the ability to post all damn day. It’s not like we’re so hardcore we quit our jobs and spend all day working out and spending time on bodybuilding websites. Get a clue.[/quote]

Agreed. I can post throughout the day at work. I am still not sure how this is a problem for some people. Maybe they think this is impossible. If they do, they must either be complete morons who can’t do two things at once or they are pissed because they can’t do the same. This beats doing crossword puzzles all day long and some of us have minds a little more active than the ones who think harping on post count is an effective original comeback.

164

[quote]Professor X wrote:
LankyMofo wrote:
jbird643 wrote:
Lets face it: Professor X sucks at life. 27,000 posts in a forum? wtf?

I HATE sticking up for X because he’s better at it than I am, but some of you morons have to realize that some of us have jobs where we have the ability to post all damn day. It’s not like we’re so hardcore we quit our jobs and spend all day working out and spending time on bodybuilding websites. Get a clue.

Agreed. I can post throughout the day at work. I am still not sure how this is a problem for some people. Maybe they think this is impossible. If they do, they must either be complete morons who can’t do two things at once or they are pissed because they can’t do the same. This beats doing crossword puzzles all day long and some of us have minds a little more active than the ones who think harping on post count is an effective original comeback. [/quote]

Going for post 1000, just other 26000 to go, come on, hardcoreness is achievable.

165

[quote]SSC wrote:
dwall33 wrote:
I’d agree with this thread if the reasoning behind the title was this:
I don’t want to bench 405 because all I care about is the progress I make with my physique. The weight I use is inconsequential, and numbers are nothing more than bragging statistics.

You don’t really believe that numbers are nothing more than bragging statistics, do you?

If so… wow.[/quote]

I don’t actually think that, but really if you think about it, what does it matter how much you lift if you are a bodybuilder? Its not a competition of strength.

166

[quote]Professor X wrote:
LankyMofo wrote:
jbird643 wrote:
Lets face it: Professor X sucks at life. 27,000 posts in a forum? wtf?

I HATE sticking up for X because he’s better at it than I am, but some of you morons have to realize that some of us have jobs where we have the ability to post all damn day. It’s not like we’re so hardcore we quit our jobs and spend all day working out and spending time on bodybuilding websites. Get a clue.

Agreed. I can post throughout the day at work. I am still not sure how this is a problem for some people. Maybe they think this is impossible. If they do, they must either be complete morons who can’t do two things at once or they are pissed because they can’t do the same. This beats doing crossword puzzles all day long and some of us have minds a little more active than the ones who think harping on post count is an effective original comeback. [/quote]

Truth is, these “suck at life people” are either grasping at straws in a last ditch effort to salvage some dignity or are too dense to realize the fallacy in this line of thinking. Someone’s career (online everyone is a MD, PHD, or business owner) is completely irrelevant to their knowledge about BODYBUILDING. Sucking at life doesn’t impact being big and/or ripped in any way what-so-ever. As has been documented repeatedly, there are a plethora of guys in prison have built impressive physiques inspite of some of the worst possible circumstances. Does that mean when information about how they’ve done it comes to light it should be ignored because these people represent the definition of “sucking at life”? Obsviously not, but again the source must be considered with those spreading this line of thinking.

BTW, I am a virtually unemployed graduate student (3 credits short of a Masters in Ed., but adding additional endorsements), stay at home father of two who works three days a week selling furniture on the weekends? Think this means I suck at life? :slight_smile:

167

[quote]dwall33 wrote:
SSC wrote:
dwall33 wrote:
I’d agree with this thread if the reasoning behind the title was this:
I don’t want to bench 405 because all I care about is the progress I make with my physique. The weight I use is inconsequential, and numbers are nothing more than bragging statistics.

You don’t really believe that numbers are nothing more than bragging statistics, do you?

If so… wow.

I don’t actually think that, but really if you think about it, what does it matter how much you lift if you are a bodybuilder? Its not a competition of strength.[/quote]

I think you have a deep misunderstanding of what a bodybuilder trains like. You don’t get those really big muscles without being strong as well, so why the hell would someone completely disregard how much they are lifting? I don’t know about you, but there aren’t that many people around me anywhere near as strong as I am on most exercises. That might…just might, have something to do with why I am also larger than most of them as well.

168

[quote]dwall33 wrote:
SSC wrote:
dwall33 wrote:
I’d agree with this thread if the reasoning behind the title was this:
I don’t want to bench 405 because all I care about is the progress I make with my physique. The weight I use is inconsequential, and numbers are nothing more than bragging statistics.

You don’t really believe that numbers are nothing more than bragging statistics, do you?

If so… wow.

I don’t actually think that, but really if you think about it, what does it matter how much you lift if you are a bodybuilder? Its not a competition of strength.[/quote]

There is some truth to that. Generally if you get stronger you will get bigger, but when comparing differnt people a bigger muscle is not always a stronger muscle. I’ve read that Arnold never benched more than 450, less than me but his size and muscularity blow mine away.
Here is an intersting article. Not all bodybuilders, but some pretty big dudes some of which I would have thought were much stronger than they are.

169

[quote]Professor X wrote:
dwall33 wrote:
SSC wrote:
dwall33 wrote:
I’d agree with this thread if the reasoning behind the title was this:
I don’t want to bench 405 because all I care about is the progress I make with my physique. The weight I use is inconsequential, and numbers are nothing more than bragging statistics.

You don’t really believe that numbers are nothing more than bragging statistics, do you?

If so… wow.

I don’t actually think that, but really if you think about it, what does it matter how much you lift if you are a bodybuilder? Its not a competition of strength.

I think you have a deep misunderstanding of what a bodybuilder trains like. You don’t get those really big muscles without being strong as well, so why the hell would someone completely disregard how much they are lifting? I don’t know about you, but there aren’t that many people around me anywhere near as strong as I am on most exercises. That might…just might, have something to do with why I am also larger than most of them as well.[/quote]

Now you’re putting words in my mouth. My entire point is simply that the actual amount you are lifting is not necessarily a good indication of your musculature. Where did I ever say that people shouldn’t try to lift more weight? You get bigger by progressing, and some people get way too caught up in the numbers rather than just worrying about lifting and improving.

170

[quote]jstreet0204 wrote:
dwall33 wrote:
SSC wrote:
dwall33 wrote:
I’d agree with this thread if the reasoning behind the title was this:
I don’t want to bench 405 because all I care about is the progress I make with my physique. The weight I use is inconsequential, and numbers are nothing more than bragging statistics.

You don’t really believe that numbers are nothing more than bragging statistics, do you?

If so… wow.

I don’t actually think that, but really if you think about it, what does it matter how much you lift if you are a bodybuilder? Its not a competition of strength.

There is some truth to that. Generally if you get stronger you will get bigger, but when comparing differnt people a bigger muscle is not always a stronger muscle. I’ve read that Arnold never benched more than 450, less than me but his size and muscularity blow mine away.
Here is an intersting article. Not all bodybuilders, but some pretty big dudes some of which I would have thought were much stronger than they are.

Oh and I said “Generally if you get stronger you’ll get bigger” only because there is a certain amount of technique involved in exercises like bench press that can make your numbers go up drastically if you aren’t using them.
The only muscle that gets bigger then is the ego muscle :slight_smile:
[/quote]

You do realize most people will NEVER bench press 450lbs?

Just checking.

Also, I am sure that was FOR REPS and not some one rep max. I do 450 for 10 reps as my last set on pressing movements when training chest. I can make that exercise even harder with the same weight by either holding the reps for longer periods of time or even by how I lift it. That is why there seems to be some confusion here. Powerlifters judge strength by the most they can do one time. Bodybuilders use weight to affect the target muscle group and when going that heavy (as in over 400lbs) there are many ways to stimulate it even more than simply worry about a one rep max weight.

171

[quote]Professor X wrote:
jstreet0204 wrote:
dwall33 wrote:
SSC wrote:
dwall33 wrote:
I’d agree with this thread if the reasoning behind the title was this:
I don’t want to bench 405 because all I care about is the progress I make with my physique. The weight I use is inconsequential, and numbers are nothing more than bragging statistics.

You don’t really believe that numbers are nothing more than bragging statistics, do you?

If so… wow.

I don’t actually think that, but really if you think about it, what does it matter how much you lift if you are a bodybuilder? Its not a competition of strength.

There is some truth to that. Generally if you get stronger you will get bigger, but when comparing differnt people a bigger muscle is not always a stronger muscle. I’ve read that Arnold never benched more than 450, less than me but his size and muscularity blow mine away.
Here is an intersting article. Not all bodybuilders, but some pretty big dudes some of which I would have thought were much stronger than they are.

Oh and I said “Generally if you get stronger you’ll get bigger” only because there is a certain amount of technique involved in exercises like bench press that can make your numbers go up drastically if you aren’t using them.
The only muscle that gets bigger then is the ego muscle :slight_smile:

You do realize most people will NEVER bench press 450lbs?

Just checking.

Also, I am sure that was FOR REPS and not some one rep max. I do 450 for 10 reps as my last set on pressing movements when training chest. I can make that exercise even harder with the same weight by either holding the reps for longer periods of time or even by how I lift it. That is why there seems to be some confusion here. Powerlifters judge strength by the most they can do one time. Bodybuilders use weight to affect the target muscle group and when going that heavy (as in over 400lbs) there are many ways to stimulate it even more than simply worry about a one rep max weight.[/quote]

“Bodybuilders use weight to affect the target muscle group and when going that heavy (as in over 400lbs) there are many ways to stimulate it even more than simply worry about a one rep max weight.”

This is exactly what I’ve been trying to say the whole time.

172

[quote]dwall33 wrote:
Professor X wrote:
jstreet0204 wrote:
dwall33 wrote:
SSC wrote:
dwall33 wrote:
I’d agree with this thread if the reasoning behind the title was this:
I don’t want to bench 405 because all I care about is the progress I make with my physique. The weight I use is inconsequential, and numbers are nothing more than bragging statistics.

You don’t really believe that numbers are nothing more than bragging statistics, do you?

If so… wow.

I don’t actually think that, but really if you think about it, what does it matter how much you lift if you are a bodybuilder? Its not a competition of strength.

There is some truth to that. Generally if you get stronger you will get bigger, but when comparing differnt people a bigger muscle is not always a stronger muscle. I’ve read that Arnold never benched more than 450, less than me but his size and muscularity blow mine away.
Here is an intersting article. Not all bodybuilders, but some pretty big dudes some of which I would have thought were much stronger than they are.

Oh and I said “Generally if you get stronger you’ll get bigger” only because there is a certain amount of technique involved in exercises like bench press that can make your numbers go up drastically if you aren’t using them.
The only muscle that gets bigger then is the ego muscle :slight_smile:

You do realize most people will NEVER bench press 450lbs?

Just checking.

Also, I am sure that was FOR REPS and not some one rep max. I do 450 for 10 reps as my last set on pressing movements when training chest. I can make that exercise even harder with the same weight by either holding the reps for longer periods of time or even by how I lift it. That is why there seems to be some confusion here. Powerlifters judge strength by the most they can do one time. Bodybuilders use weight to affect the target muscle group and when going that heavy (as in over 400lbs) there are many ways to stimulate it even more than simply worry about a one rep max weight.

“Bodybuilders use weight to affect the target muscle group and when going that heavy (as in over 400lbs) there are many ways to stimulate it even more than simply worry about a one rep max weight.”

This is exactly what I’ve been trying to say the whole time.[/quote]

Right. But, someone who’s doing 225 x 10 isn’t going to be as big as someone doing 450 x 10.

That’s what I’ve been saying.

So no one’s wrong.

173

[quote]Professor X wrote:
jstreet0204 wrote:
dwall33 wrote:
SSC wrote:
dwall33 wrote:
I’d agree with this thread if the reasoning behind the title was this:
I don’t want to bench 405 because all I care about is the progress I make with my physique. The weight I use is inconsequential, and numbers are nothing more than bragging statistics.

You don’t really believe that numbers are nothing more than bragging statistics, do you?

If so… wow.

I don’t actually think that, but really if you think about it, what does it matter how much you lift if you are a bodybuilder? Its not a competition of strength.

There is some truth to that. Generally if you get stronger you will get bigger, but when comparing differnt people a bigger muscle is not always a stronger muscle. I’ve read that Arnold never benched more than 450, less than me but his size and muscularity blow mine away.
Here is an intersting article. Not all bodybuilders, but some pretty big dudes some of which I would have thought were much stronger than they are.

Oh and I said “Generally if you get stronger you’ll get bigger” only because there is a certain amount of technique involved in exercises like bench press that can make your numbers go up drastically if you aren’t using them.
The only muscle that gets bigger then is the ego muscle :slight_smile:

You do realize most people will NEVER bench press 450lbs?

Just checking.

Also, I am sure that was FOR REPS and not some one rep max. I do 450 for 10 reps as my last set on pressing movements when training chest. I can make that exercise even harder with the same weight by either holding the reps for longer periods of time or even by how I lift it. That is why there seems to be some confusion here. Powerlifters judge strength by the most they can do one time. Bodybuilders use weight to affect the target muscle group and when going that heavy (as in over 400lbs) there are many ways to stimulate it even more than simply worry about a one rep max weight.[/quote]

Ha ha, most people will who even step foot in a gym won’t break out of the 200’s. Fewer will ever get past 1.5 times their body weight. You’d like to think the ones that show enough interest to post here would be the exception.

There was an Arnold special edition of one of the bodybuilding mags a year or two back, and he said that was the most he ever did once, and I was pretty surpised. It may very well be that a 1 rep max was never a priority. None of this is however should be used as an excuse to place limits on ones goals like OP seems to have done here, so I didn’t mean to derail the thread here.

174

[quote]dankid wrote:

So how far are you willing to go?[/quote]

All the way, actually. I try to do as much as possible to build muscle. My life is richer for it too, i am happy and healthy.
Brook

175

[quote]jstreet0204 wrote:
Professor X wrote:
jstreet0204 wrote:
dwall33 wrote:
SSC wrote:
dwall33 wrote:
I’d agree with this thread if the reasoning behind the title was this:
I don’t want to bench 405 because all I care about is the progress I make with my physique. The weight I use is inconsequential, and numbers are nothing more than bragging statistics.

You don’t really believe that numbers are nothing more than bragging statistics, do you?

If so… wow.

I don’t actually think that, but really if you think about it, what does it matter how much you lift if you are a bodybuilder? Its not a competition of strength.

There is some truth to that. Generally if you get stronger you will get bigger, but when comparing differnt people a bigger muscle is not always a stronger muscle. I’ve read that Arnold never benched more than 450, less than me but his size and muscularity blow mine away.
Here is an intersting article. Not all bodybuilders, but some pretty big dudes some of which I would have thought were much stronger than they are.

Oh and I said “Generally if you get stronger you’ll get bigger” only because there is a certain amount of technique involved in exercises like bench press that can make your numbers go up drastically if you aren’t using them.
The only muscle that gets bigger then is the ego muscle :slight_smile:

You do realize most people will NEVER bench press 450lbs?

Just checking.

Also, I am sure that was FOR REPS and not some one rep max. I do 450 for 10 reps as my last set on pressing movements when training chest. I can make that exercise even harder with the same weight by either holding the reps for longer periods of time or even by how I lift it. That is why there seems to be some confusion here. Powerlifters judge strength by the most they can do one time. Bodybuilders use weight to affect the target muscle group and when going that heavy (as in over 400lbs) there are many ways to stimulate it even more than simply worry about a one rep max weight.

Ha ha, most people will who even step foot in a gym won’t break out of the 200’s. Fewer will ever get past 1.5 times their body weight. You’d like to think the ones that show enough interest to post here would be the exception.

There was an Arnold special edition of one of the bodybuilding mags a year or two back, and he said that was the most he ever did once, and I was pretty surpised. It may very well be that a 1 rep max was never a priority. None of this is however should be used as an excuse to place limits on ones goals like OP seems to have done here, so I didn’t mean to derail the thread here.

[/quote]

I’d expect Arnold to be benching 375-405*6-10 in his prime, size-wise, with that horrible scare-crow form :wink:

Guys the size of McGrath usually do around 40510-12 or so, Ronnie-size gets you around 4958-10 in the off-season… Of course it’s different from person to person, but just to give people a rough idea.
And that is obviously not PL form.
There are a few guys who semi-tuck their elbows though (Warren, for example).
I also don’t think that there is much difference between full reps and half reps in the bottom portion of ROM, in terms of how many reps people get with the same weight with bb-form.

Btw, while they had progression in mind as well, the routines of the guys during Arnold’s time and a little later imo weren’t really all that well-suited to for becoming as large/strong(for reps) as possible.
Nowadays, standard bb routines ultimately allow for more total progress imo and guys back then were still way too concerned with the pump and doing too much random shit.
And let’s not forget that their dietary views weren’t exactly great either. As little fat as possible in their diets and too little protein etc.

I bet that Arnold and co could, using the same (probably quite a bit less, actually) amount of drugs as they did back then, get significantly bigger by using modern routines, focus on progression and modern day bb dietary principles…
And not to forget some of the nice HS equipment we have now, though that’s obviously of secondary importance compared to the other factors.

176

Oh, and they used to do a ton of running as cardio too… Cutting that shit in half would probably allow for +3-4 inches of leg size/strength progress alone lol

177

[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
jstreet0204 wrote:
Professor X wrote:
jstreet0204 wrote:
dwall33 wrote:
SSC wrote:
dwall33 wrote:
I’d agree with this thread if the reasoning behind the title was this:
I don’t want to bench 405 because all I care about is the progress I make with my physique. The weight I use is inconsequential, and numbers are nothing more than bragging statistics.

You don’t really believe that numbers are nothing more than bragging statistics, do you?

If so… wow.

I don’t actually think that, but really if you think about it, what does it matter how much you lift if you are a bodybuilder? Its not a competition of strength.

There is some truth to that. Generally if you get stronger you will get bigger, but when comparing differnt people a bigger muscle is not always a stronger muscle. I’ve read that Arnold never benched more than 450, less than me but his size and muscularity blow mine away.
Here is an intersting article. Not all bodybuilders, but some pretty big dudes some of which I would have thought were much stronger than they are.

Oh and I said “Generally if you get stronger you’ll get bigger” only because there is a certain amount of technique involved in exercises like bench press that can make your numbers go up drastically if you aren’t using them.
The only muscle that gets bigger then is the ego muscle :slight_smile:

You do realize most people will NEVER bench press 450lbs?

Just checking.

Also, I am sure that was FOR REPS and not some one rep max. I do 450 for 10 reps as my last set on pressing movements when training chest. I can make that exercise even harder with the same weight by either holding the reps for longer periods of time or even by how I lift it. That is why there seems to be some confusion here. Powerlifters judge strength by the most they can do one time. Bodybuilders use weight to affect the target muscle group and when going that heavy (as in over 400lbs) there are many ways to stimulate it even more than simply worry about a one rep max weight.

Ha ha, most people will who even step foot in a gym won’t break out of the 200’s. Fewer will ever get past 1.5 times their body weight. You’d like to think the ones that show enough interest to post here would be the exception.

There was an Arnold special edition of one of the bodybuilding mags a year or two back, and he said that was the most he ever did once, and I was pretty surpised. It may very well be that a 1 rep max was never a priority. None of this is however should be used as an excuse to place limits on ones goals like OP seems to have done here, so I didn’t mean to derail the thread here.

I’d expect Arnold to be benching 375-405*6-10 in his prime, size-wise, with that horrible scare-crow form :wink:

Guys the size of McGrath usually do around 40510-12 or so, Ronnie-size gets you around 4958-10 in the off-season… Of course it’s different from person to person, but just to give people a rough idea.
And that is obviously not PL form.
There are a few guys who semi-tuck their elbows though (Warren, for example).
I also don’t think that there is much difference between full reps and half reps in the bottom portion of ROM, in terms of how many reps people get with the same weight with bb-form.

Btw, while they had progression in mind as well, the routines of the guys during Arnold’s time and a little later imo weren’t really all that well-suited to for becoming as large/strong(for reps) as possible.
Nowadays, standard bb routines ultimately allow for more total progress imo and guys back then were still way too concerned with the pump and doing too much random shit.
And let’s not forget that their dietary views weren’t exactly great either. As little fat as possible in their diets and too little protein etc.

I bet that Arnold and co could, using the same (probably quite a bit less, actually) amount of drugs as they did back then, get significantly bigger by using modern routines, focus on progression and modern day bb dietary principles…
And not to forget some of the nice HS equipment we have now, though that’s obviously of secondary importance compared to the other factors.
[/quote]

Ok, I take back my apology for derailing the thread, this is much more intersting than the point the OP tried to make. :slight_smile:

178

Whoever said benching 225 for 20 reps was not strong is a jackass.

179

[quote]AimHigh wrote:
Whoever said benching 225 for 20 reps was not strong is a jackass.[/quote]

180

I’ve only read a small portion of this thread, and from my take a lot of you feel this is not “BODYBUILDING” and should not be included in the “BODYBUILDING” forum. Why then don’t the mods MOD? That is the purpose of a moderator to ensure the topics stay on topic (novel concept, eh?) for each particular forum. If someone started a ‘omg look at this ass’ thread in the Politics forum certainly it would get moved to SAMA, right? Or am I missing something here? Instead of allowing all this pointless crap to clutter the “BODYBUILDING” forum why aren’t these threads moved to their appropriate section?

There are countless posts of people expressing their displeasure with many of the threads in the “BODYBUILDING” forum not being related to “BODYBUILDING”. Many of them ought to be in the Beginners forum or the suggested idea of creating a General Fitness forum. If someone posted about bench shirts in the “BODYBUILDING” forum that ought to be moved to Strength Sports. If someone posted about running shoes (a topic listed on the front page) that ought to be moved to General Fitness.

If someone posted about ‘does this routine look good’ or ‘i just finished bulking what now’ that ought to be moved to Beginners. This is all very simple and basic moderating. Move threads to where they belong already and keep the “BODYBUILDING” forum strictly about “BODYBUILDING”.