T Nation

Why Do Some Men Do Better On Much Less?

So some of you may know, i can’t seem to feel much from TRT at any level. I’ve been trying different protocols for a few years now. One big thing missing for me is libido, amongst other things.

I’m recently trying very large (compared to TRT) doses, up into the 400mg/week range just to see if i can feel SOMETHING. All its done is made me not sleep well. No increasing in gym ability, nothing. Also impossible to orgasm… or very very difficult. (this i’m SURE is increased serotonin)

Anyway, all test is dr prescribed and good.

I’ve read some about people needing very little test to see any results. I’m talking like well under 100mg per week.

Why is this? Is it estrogen? Just test and estrogen together? Why do gyms feel great on steroids, but i feel like blah? Like it’s water i’m injecting?

I know @equel has this issue. And there’s another thread on here about the guy feeling best on like 35mg test per week.

I don’t want this to turn into an Estrogen debate i guess. Just wondering why some people don’t do well on normal to larger doses?

I’ll be interested to hear the responses you get as I’m in a similar position. I was originally prescribed 245mg per week of Sustanon and I thought I’d hit the jackpot! After about six months my brain fog and depression cleared up completely but my libido was in the toilet and I couldn’t burn body fat whatever I tried. I’ve switched to daily subq from E5D IM and I’m reducing my dose every two months. I’m now down to 140mg per week of test cypionate and don’t feel any better or worse. I’ve tried dropping my AI but that’s a longer separate conversation. I’ll let you know if I find a sweet spot.

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You need to have the ability to process the hormones, gene expression must occur for your body to utilize the hormones, insensitive T receptors could be why you don’t feel anything.

My muscles get hard on only 6mg daily, so I have extremely sensitive receptors. There must be people on the other end of the spectrum.

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I know a doc who have worked with bodybuilders in sweden for decades. He say that some men are very sensitive to androgens so they require very little. When you give them “much” - or normal doses - the system gets out of whack.

Also, when I had natty low T of like 260ng/dl, libido was still okay. On high test, its absolutely one.

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I do remember pre TRT i had some libido. Very very little, but felt that rush.

Going on TRT killed it.

I am about to start something low. Like 75mg a week.

I know exactly what ure talking about when u say “rush”, its that erotic sexual excitement, correct? On high testosterone, some times I can feel somewhat in the mood of putting my cock in something ,and i can even get temporarily hard - it will quickly go limp tho - however, I NEVER experience that “rush” on high testosterone, like that erotic desire.

On low low levels, I have that desire, the rush u get from just kissing a girl, like all of your body feels it, excitement, not just “down there” but in all your body and mind.

High T fucks that up for me, completely.

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What were ur levels previous to trt?

Exactly. You summed it up PERFECTLY. No body rush. A little blood to the dick, but no rush to NEED to get laid.

Prior to TRT, my levels were anywhere from 150-350. Multiple testings.

And you still had some libido at those levels. I would suggest u try hit 400ng/dl, maybe 450-500 at most, that will probably bring ya libido back and better than before.

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I’m thinking shoot for 36mg or so twice a week.

Try it. I would not be surprised if even that is too much for optimal libido, try. If it doesnt work, decrease more.

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Do you recall how long it took you to feel something after you lowered your dose?

Just 2-3 weeks really

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Over the 3 years on trt. I started at 100 a week. I remember going down to 90 a week. Felt better or the same.
Then I slowly brought my self up to 140 a week cause from reading this forum it sounds it’s normal to start at 150.

I think at 140 my hr increased. Lost night time erections. Harder to sleep. In the process of going back down to 120. I think at 140 according to labs, my testosterone stayed the same as 120 but e2 jumped.

I remember feeling very good at 90 a week. But I think I feel Better at 110 to 120.
Horny wise, good always on any dose. Maybe I saw a surge during each transition period.

My belief is start at no more than 100. Even 80 a week. Then work your way up if 80 not enough.

Or else how the f do you determine the least amount of medicine to relieve symptoms.

Giving out advice telling guys to start at 150 or 200 a week is wreckless. Maybe because gym progress for some guys is first. For me it’s TRT and health.

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Totally agree.

There are MANY men that cannot seem to reap the trt benefits. The go-to is to increase dose. It works for many, but not all.

I took my shot of 200mg this past Monday. I won’t take a shot Thursday. On this Monday coming up, I’m dropping dose down to likely 35mg. Then another on Thursday, for a total of about 70mg per week.

Trying to not give up.

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So I have been doing some reading on t-nation. I mostly chill in reddit’s steroids subreddit which seems to have less drama and fighting.

Anyway. I noticed equel’s success with NPP only - after not having much stable success with different TRT and blasting protocols of test.
I’ve tried lots of different protocols myself (even going over gram) and in my 4 years of blasting, I haven’t managed to nail a perfect week where libido, erections and general feeling are good each day of the week. There are some 2-3 day streaks where I have libido and sometimes proper 100% boners, but for past half year it seems that I can’t get to 100% hard even with cialis - maybe only for very short time.

As for bloods - my thyroid seems fine, prolactin is (now) under control, estradiol has been high and low (AI or no AI depending on testo) but SHBG has always been less than 8 - never measured it before starting steroids. I was feeling low T before I started, but never got bloods.

Masteron and proviron haven’t been successful when trying to increase libido consistently. I notice that when I get the small streak of libido, it is a bit better, but baseline is still useless.

The point of my current reply was to let equel here know that I am very happy to have found another hope of success (NPP/deca solo) because I can very much relate to some of his previous posts (e.g 750mg test and having “random” success). I’m going to start deca solo asap when I can get my hands on some of it.
Meanwhile I’d like to know if equel has had lasting success or what kind of protocol is currently in use.

To me it makes sense to start an individual on the median dose that works. Then based on symptoms and blood work adjust up or down. To me the median dose is around 150 mg/wk (just my perception from what I have heard). This method should result in a shorter period of time to get dialed in on average than starting at 80 or 100 mg (given that the median effective does is in fact 150 mg/wk, with some needing more and some less).

I read Excelmale forum as well. Seems like over there, if you have lower shbg, they tell you start at like 80mg/week. Maybe lower.

I think with such a lowered dosage, your shbg would rise up a bit. Most get shbg tested after being on TRT, at “normal” doses of 100mg or more. If it comes back low, reducing dosage should increase that figure a bit i’d think, make things a little bit more advantageous.

Try get npp, Short Ester so Easy to modify dose without having to wait too Long.

I remember this Summer when i did npp only for THE first time, 2-3 weeks after My last t shot.

Within just a few days My cock got rock Hard and i like “remembered” how it felt to be really horny again.

But you had this same experience with just low dose test cyp too, correct?