[quote]conorh wrote:
PM me if you want to come up to Ames and train in the Weight Club gym a couple days some weekend or this summer. We’ll help try to straighten you out.
At 6’2" and two hundy, I bet you’re about as thick as a coat hanger, putting some thickness on will help you bench, as will getting fatter than holy hell, but I bet you don’t want that.[/quote]
You’re right. I don’t really want to get super fat. I have some long arms, which probably doesn’t help matters.
I’ll send you a PM
Well I have a few suggestion for you:
Since you incline bench and flat bench are the same this could mean a couple of things 1 your lats are weak 2 your triceps are weak. When incline benching lats are virtually unincoperated. Since you said that you got stuck at midpoint I would say that your lats aren’t weak and it would most likely be your triceps.
What are you doing for tricep work? Extensions- they will help your lock out but not the midpoint of bench press. I would stick to exercises such as floor press, closegrip and reverse bench and possibly dips to help strengthen the midpoint.
You could try a speed day if you are missing half way up, but probably you should just try harder. You should probably cut some of the assistance or do another press/squat/dl for assistance. IE Floor press to 3RM maybe 2-3 heavy sets of 3-5 with a slightly lower weight, 2-5 sets of heavy overhead work(around 6-10RM), 2-5 sets of Chins(or rows),2-3 sets of face pulls(or something similiar), done.
If you arent spent after that, then put more weight on and do the same thing next time. It looks like you are probably slow, by where you are missing and a DE day would probably be the ticket. All the assistance work is RE anyways so why do you need even more?
For the DE just switch it for the ME movement, do lighter, slightly higher rep(8-15) assistance work, even with the same lifts if you want after your DE movement.
I think the point of DeFranco switching the DE for extra RE work is because he mostly trains athletes and when he gets a kid with a 350 lb max squat and a 35 inch vertical jump he obviously doesnt need a ton of speed work, and it is probably wasting that particular individuals time.
If you are a particular individual that is not as gifted in that department then you are a particular individual who may benefit from speed work. That said, get a set of weights for home cause you will look like a particular individual that is a tool doing 80lbs on the bench press.
Edit: looking like a tool infront of the cardio bunnies might make you a particular individual who is more willing to try harder to up the weight.
[quote]Avocado wrote:
Yeah I’d cut back on the lifts that aren’t full ROM benching and keep the regular bench press volume high. there is a long long way to go before you need anything like floor or board press. Just bench/squat/deadlift/pull/press for the next 2 or more years.
If you progress the volume and intensity of these basic movements you will be surprised how much you can get out of them. A fella I train with has done nothing but O-lifts and the 5 movements above for the last 10 years of his training. The only none basic lifts he does are shoulder rotations and stuff like that in the warm up. That being said he is an Olympic athlete for Canada. He’s jacked.
So I’d say until you get very competetive in things such as benching or PLing (which could be a ton of fun) there isn’t much purpose behind doing movements that aren’t the simple basic movement.
Just be sure to keep the weights going up and vary the repetition range from 3-6 and occasionally down to 1 on a test or post-test.
Rippetoe and Starr are both really realy strong options for someone at your level.
-chris[/quote]
That’s some very good advice. I’ve been lifting for a few years now and whenever I make the fastest progress is when I get my head on straight, stop fooling around with the monthly internet fad and just log in some reps on the few classic exercises.
Donnie Thompson on speed training for beginners.
[quote]boyscout wrote:
Regular Gonzalez wrote:
I would recommend the intermediate routine at this site.
It’s nothing special but it works. I think you would benefit from the fact that it has you flat benching twice per week.
Would the Rippetoe’s program work well too?
[/quote]
Yes
A good progression would be to start with Rippetoe and milk it for as long as you can and then when your gains slow down follow it up with the intermediate Bill Starr routine.
Worry about the more complicated stuff when you can no longer make consistent progress following a basic routine.
I just don’t see any need for you to be worrying about varying the rep range on different days, rotating ME exercises etc.
[quote]Scrotus wrote:
You could try a speed day if you are missing half way up, but probably you should just try harder. You should probably cut some of the assistance or do another press/squat/dl for assistance. IE Floor press to 3RM maybe 2-3 heavy sets of 3-5 with a slightly lower weight, 2-5 sets of heavy overhead work(around 6-10RM), 2-5 sets of Chins(or rows),2-3 sets of face pulls(or something similiar), done.
If you arent spent after that, then put more weight on and do the same thing next time. It looks like you are probably slow, by where you are missing and a DE day would probably be the ticket. All the assistance work is RE anyways so why do you need even more?
For the DE just switch it for the ME movement, do lighter, slightly higher rep(8-15) assistance work, even with the same lifts if you want after your DE movement.
I think the point of DeFranco switching the DE for extra RE work is because he mostly trains athletes and when he gets a kid with a 350 lb max squat and a 35 inch vertical jump he obviously doesnt need a ton of speed work, and it is probably wasting that particular individuals time.
If you are a particular individual that is not as gifted in that department then you are a particular individual who may benefit from speed work. That said, get a set of weights for home cause you will look like a particular individual that is a tool doing 80lbs on the bench press.
Edit: looking like a tool infront of the cardio bunnies might make you a particular individual who is more willing to try harder to up the weight.[/quote]
Do you really see any point in having him worry about speed work at his current level?
He would be using around 100lb.
Scrotus, I’d thought about adding a speed day. I probably just need to get stronger doing some more basic stuff. Anyway, I’m planning on giving rippetoe a try. I’ll keep you guys posted.
Also: no cardio bunny’s to look like a tool in front of in my gym. The weight room is in a separate part of the facility.
Thanks for all the help guys.
I also need to fucking eat more. I was hungry the whole day today. That’s not really the goal.
[quote]Regular Gonzalez wrote:
Scrotus wrote:
You could try a speed day if you are missing half way up, but probably you should just try harder. You should probably cut some of the assistance or do another press/squat/dl for assistance. IE Floor press to 3RM maybe 2-3 heavy sets of 3-5 with a slightly lower weight, 2-5 sets of heavy overhead work(around 6-10RM), 2-5 sets of Chins(or rows),2-3 sets of face pulls(or something similiar), done.
If you arent spent after that, then put more weight on and do the same thing next time. It looks like you are probably slow, by where you are missing and a DE day would probably be the ticket. All the assistance work is RE anyways so why do you need even more?
For the DE just switch it for the ME movement, do lighter, slightly higher rep(8-15) assistance work, even with the same lifts if you want after your DE movement.
I think the point of DeFranco switching the DE for extra RE work is because he mostly trains athletes and when he gets a kid with a 350 lb max squat and a 35 inch vertical jump he obviously doesnt need a ton of speed work, and it is probably wasting that particular individuals time.
If you are a particular individual that is not as gifted in that department then you are a particular individual who may benefit from speed work. That said, get a set of weights for home cause you will look like a particular individual that is a tool doing 80lbs on the bench press.
Edit: looking like a tool infront of the cardio bunnies might make you a particular individual who is more willing to try harder to up the weight.
Do you really see any point in having him worry about speed work at his current level?
He would be using around 100lb.
[/quote]
Im not sure, I used to do speed pushups every day when I was in little. It didnt seem to hurt me, and he should be getting enough volume in through his assistance lifts to grow. I dont see the point of doing sets of 25-40. It has never been something that has worked for me, but who knows maybe it will work for him. Maybe heavyish speed work(70+%) of 5-6 sets of 5-6 might be the ticket, as Donnie Thompson said on the video I put on the previous post. I swear it is not a Rick Roll.
Because your partner sucks at benching.
[quote]Airtruth wrote:
Because your partner sucks at benching.[/quote]
lol, his training partner —> Rick Roll - YouTube
This is not so much directed at boyscout as it is a general statement. Since everyone is posting videos here’s on I like:
The point in more gentle language is don’t over think it. All these advanced programs will never replace training. Every minute online is a minute you’re not training. Sure you want to maximize your knowledge who does not. Just don’t over think things.
[quote]boyscout wrote:
Okay, let me preface this by saying I am not strong.[/quote]
Thats your problem right there.
[quote]sapasion wrote:
This is not so much directed at boyscout as it is a general statement. Since everyone is posting videos here’s on I like:
The point in more gentle language is don’t over think it. All these advanced programs will never replace training. Every minute online is a minute you’re not training. Sure you want to maximize your knowledge who does not. Just don’t over think things. [/quote]
Right when I was going to come back to this thread, and ask “what am I going to do next?” I didn’t really check on this one after a while, and missed this. Thanks Sapasion, I think I needed that.
Anyway, progress to report. As was suggested, I started doing the starting strength routine.
Today I squatted 245 for 3x5–245 was a previous 1RM the last time I tested squat. I also benched 160 for 3x5 (recall my previous 1RM was 165, hence this thread). Some good progress. I also got 6x5 on pull ups today (at bodyweight only), something I’ve never been able to do before.
Things I’ve learned:
-I can do okay increasing weight on a big movement like the squat or bench each session, but not for long. After about three weeks, my body doesn’t seem to like it much any more.
-I suck at OH pressing, and have a hunch that if get better at it, I’ll get better at every sort of pressing movement.
-Bands are fun. and I credit being able to some prehab stuff at home with helping me make some progress.
-I need to quit being a pussy about DL progress.
Anyway, I’m going to piss around for the rest of the week with lifting, do some single leg work. Visit ConorH in Ames and get some pointers on big lifts, and otherwise chill out. Then drop the weights by 10-20% and ramp back up using the 3x5 scheme again. I don’t know if I have gotten everything I could out of it, but I intend to find out.
Progress report.
Just hit 185 for 5 reps. Good to know something is working! Thanks for the advice everyone.
[quote]boyscout wrote:
Progress report.
Just hit 185 for 5 reps. Good to know something is working! Thanks for the advice everyone.[/quote]
Good job, so what worked?
[quote]Regular Gonzalez wrote:
Scrotus wrote:
You could try a speed day if you are missing half way up, but probably you should just try harder. You should probably cut some of the assistance or do another press/squat/dl for assistance. IE Floor press to 3RM maybe 2-3 heavy sets of 3-5 with a slightly lower weight, 2-5 sets of heavy overhead work(around 6-10RM), 2-5 sets of Chins(or rows),2-3 sets of face pulls(or something similiar), done.
If you arent spent after that, then put more weight on and do the same thing next time. It looks like you are probably slow, by where you are missing and a DE day would probably be the ticket. All the assistance work is RE anyways so why do you need even more?
For the DE just switch it for the ME movement, do lighter, slightly higher rep(8-15) assistance work, even with the same lifts if you want after your DE movement.
I think the point of DeFranco switching the DE for extra RE work is because he mostly trains athletes and when he gets a kid with a 350 lb max squat and a 35 inch vertical jump he obviously doesnt need a ton of speed work, and it is probably wasting that particular individuals time.
If you are a particular individual that is not as gifted in that department then you are a particular individual who may benefit from speed work. That said, get a set of weights for home cause you will look like a particular individual that is a tool doing 80lbs on the bench press.
Edit: looking like a tool infront of the cardio bunnies might make you a particular individual who is more willing to try harder to up the weight.
Do you really see any point in having him worry about speed work at his current level?
He would be using around 100lb.
[/quote]
Ha ha ha!
No kidding. This guy can’t bench two wet socks and someone suggested a speed day??? LOL!
I love the internet.
[quote]Reef wrote:
boyscout wrote:
Progress report.
Just hit 185 for 5 reps. Good to know something is working! Thanks for the advice everyone.
Good job, so what worked?[/quote]
Lots of push ups. Only benching heavy in the 3-5 rep range once/week. High rep arm stuff. Using an approach that hit different rep ranges each training day. Using band circuits as cardio for active recovery.
Just some of the stuff I tried. I didn’t really approach it scientifically and change one thing at a time, so I can’t pinpoint it.
Oh, and a ton of upper back work.
[quote]boyscout wrote:
Reef wrote:
boyscout wrote:
Progress report.
Just hit 185 for 5 reps. Good to know something is working! Thanks for the advice everyone.
Good job, so what worked?
Lots of push ups. Only benching heavy in the 3-5 rep range once/week. High rep arm stuff. Using an approach that hit different rep ranges each training day. Using band circuits as cardio for active recovery.
Just some of the stuff I tried. I didn’t really approach it scientifically and change one thing at a time, so I can’t pinpoint it.
Oh, and a ton of upper back work.[/quote]
Good job.
I think many people forget the value in performing a lot of pushups in addition to heavy, low-rep benching. They do make a big difference.