Whoever Changed His Islamic Religion, Then Kill Him

[quote]Uncle Gabby wrote:
PRCalDude wrote:
I think their hatred for women stems mostly from the fact that Mohammed hated them. He said various things like, “The majority of those in hell are women,” and enslaved several others after killing their men, and married a six year old (Aisha).

I think this hatred for women has something to do with the rampant pederasty in their societies, especially because they don’t allow themselves normal relationships with women.

I think it is a regional thing, and goes back further than Islam. I don’t have my bible handy, but as I recall, Paul said women were to keep their mouths shut in church, and keep their hair covered.

As to why these practices are no longer part of Judaism, or Christianity, but seem stronger than ever in Islam, I have no idea.[/quote]

He was talking about church order, not superiority or inferiority of the quality of their gender. Read the entire passage here:

Explanation of “saved by the childbearing” here:
http://heidelblog.wordpress.com/2007/12/17/saved-by-the-childbearing/

[quote]Makavali wrote:
Gkhan wrote:
…or are you against women’s rights?

Women have rights?[/quote]

Give her a few lefts too.

[quote]Zap Branigan wrote:
Makavali wrote:
Gkhan wrote:
…or are you against women’s rights?

Women have rights?

Give her a few lefts too.[/quote]

LOL. They have the right to feel the back of your hand.

[quote]Makavali wrote:
Gkhan wrote:
…or are you against women’s rights?

Women have rights?[/quote]

Yeah, they have a right to serve their men and be subservient. They have a right to wear a bed sheet over their entire body lest some dude get a hard-on from seeing an ankle. They have a right to keep their mouth shut unless allowed to talk, they have a right to be lower than dog shit.
Remember, this is done to protect the women.

[quote]lixy wrote:
And yet, you pull moronic statements out of your rear end and try to pass them as facts.[/quote]

Really? I explained where I get my facts:

[quote]but hardly a week (and never a month) goes by before we hear of another girl killed by her father/brothers/uncles/family dog because of a religious difference. An, oddly, the religion in question is always Islam.

Always? No. Mostly? Yes.[/quote]

…and you agreed. Duh. You might not like my opinion, but it is based on reporter’s accounts.

Yours, on the other hand, is based on… your snotty blindness to the evils perpetrated by muslims the world over.

So if a muslim kills his daughter over a non-religious question, then it’s no problem?

Thanks for clearing that up. It’s pretty cool to be able to neatly compartmentalize one’s thinking like that and to be able to turn a blind eye to the atrocities committed by fellow believers.

But hey, those little uppity bitches had it coming, right?

Easy. First, the Koran is entirely made up by man. Accept it. It’s a simple truth.

Like everything made by man, it has some good parts and some bad parts; some true parts and some false parts. But it’s just a book like any other book.

The rest is up to you. Learn to think for yourself. No one can do it for you.

I’ll point out the future ones I catch. How’s that? I tend to skip/skim most of what you write, since it’s mostly simple repetitions of the same old litanies.

Why do you keep trying to divert the topic? Unless Obama converted to Islam and then killed his wife or daughter this morning, he’s not relevant.

You’re completely lost here. I’m not implying a relation between religion and infanticide, I’m noting the widely reported link between Islam and killing a daughter.

Don’t worry, if Buddhists eventually lose all their marbles and become barbaric daughter killing cowards, I’ll call them out to.

You tell yourself that. It’s another easy way to avoid looking at the truth.

[quote]pookie wrote:
lixy wrote:
And yet, you pull moronic statements out of your rear end and try to pass them as facts.

Really? I explained where I get my facts:

but hardly a week (and never a month) goes by before we hear of another girl killed by her father/brothers/uncles/family dog because of a religious difference. An, oddly, the religion in question is always Islam.

Always? No. Mostly? Yes.

…and you agreed. Duh. You might not like my opinion, but it is based on reporter’s accounts. [/quote]

It’s not the opinion I challenged. It’s your silly attempt to link the Islamic faith to those murders, while absolving Hindus who lead in the matter by leaps and bounds. Moreover, you threw in a completely baseless claim by saying that infanticide in Christian and Jewish communities was “extremely rare”.

[quote]And if you consider refusing-to-marry-some-dude-your-father-picked a “religious difference”, then there’s no helping you.

So if a muslim kills his daughter over a non-religious question, then it’s no problem? [/quote]

Of course it’s a problem. A huge one at that. But why did you bring up religion for?

The perpetrators usually get locked up and it’s way too lenient a punishment in my opinion.

Fsck 'em! They’re not my fellow anything. They’re criminal scum.

But it’s pretty cool to see you put words in my mouth.

I know a couple of billion people who’ll argue that Holy Books were divinely inspired.

I suggest you take it up with them. We already went down that road here.

[quote]If there’s enough to compile a rapist’s manifesto, then surely you must very easily be able to quote me.

I’ll point out the future ones I catch. How’s that? I tend to skip/skim most of what you write, since it’s mostly simple repetitions of the same old litanies. [/quote]

Let me get this straight: You skip over most of my post and yet conclude that they would be worthy of an entry in some rapist’s manifesto.

I think you got a serious case of preconceptions.

He’s Muslim. He must be EVIL.

But I supposed unsubstantiated blind hatred is in fashion nowadays. Obama learned about Islam in school. He must be EVIL

True that. It was just an attempt to illustrate your knee-jerk mentality.

You’d think somebody making the case for the causality between religion and infanticide would at least do the minimum homework.

You wrote: “your religion tells you to kill your own kid”.

You can see why I might have gotten the idea.

Good. Just make sure you call out the Buddhists who might eventually “lose all their marbles”.

Slamming all of them by some twisted association is moronic.

[quote]I liked you better when you used to argue with your brains.

You tell yourself that. It’s another easy way to avoid looking at the truth. [/quote]

I’m telling you that your logic used to be more sound. When you criticized some aspects of Islam or other religions, there was coherence in your arguments. Now it reads like something spouted out by an emotive teenager who can’t be bothered with facts. It’s just my opinion though.

[quote]lixy wrote:
Moreover, you threw in a completely baseless claim by saying that infanticide in Christian and Jewish communities was “extremely rare”.[/quote]

Why do you ask for statistical backup of my claims while simultaneously offering none for yours?

Because it’s the common thread between all those killings.

Actually, they get locked up only after much international fuss is raised over it. And the time they spend in the hole is a joke as punishment for murder.

Right. The old “my religion is peaceful” bullshit again. The “they’re not true muslims” fallacy.

Look genius, they claim to be muslims all their lives, live in muslim community and show up at the local mosque all the time. Why don’t you kick them out if they’re not “real” muslims?

The reality is that you willingly participate in a religion who has no highest authority figure, no means of reigning in fanatics, no way of convincing anyone that they’re doing wrong because some other mullah somewhere is always applauding their barbaric actions and spouting surahs and hadiths in support.

When you see that an organized anything - religion, group, club, cult, whatever - is so basically flawed and so easily subverted into supporting evil, the right (and smart) thing to do is to oppose it, or at the very least, to not participate in it.

Barring that, you should at least try to improve it from within… if all the time you waste on this forum was put towards a reform of Islam movement, you might accomplish something.

Of course, you won’t do that, since it would get you killed on short order.

A couple of billion wrongs don’t make a right.

Told you you wouldn’t be able to do it.

The ones I read before I started skipping them, yes.

Having a knee-jerk reaction upon hearing that a man has killed his daughter is normal. It’s decent. Civilized. Non-barbaric.

You’re the one who’s defending your fellow muslims… claiming that they didn’t kill over “religious matters” but “marriage arrangements.” I wasn’t aware that muslim marriages were secular affairs.

[quote]You wrote: “your religion tells you to kill your own kid”.

You can see why I might have gotten the idea.[/quote]

Now you’re too stupid to infer from context? The guy’s a muslim, his religion is Islam. Maybe you can ask an adult to help you read along and explain all the semantic meanings you miss.

Since we get no reaction from the supposedly peaceful muslim majority, what else can we do but to conclude that you tacitly support those killings? There’s the occasional lip service from a few western mullahs, but mostly, there’s silence. There’s something like a billion of you, and all the outrage for those barbaric acts amount to a couple of press releases? No reform movement? No calls for arrests and trials? No demands for heavy penalties?

Actions speak louder than words. Frankly, all the actions of the world muslim community are saying is: “Ha, ha! Suckers.”

It’s also one of your repetitive dodges. When you’re unable to make a point - which is annoyingly often - you resort to claiming the person is juvenile, emotional, uneducated, misinformed, etc. It wouldn’t be so transparent if you actually could provide information relevant to the discussion and supportive to your side of it.

I’m sure that telling people they have insufficient evidence for their side while providing none at all for yours is coherent, sound and logical to you.

[quote]pookie wrote:
lixy wrote:
Moreover, you threw in a completely baseless claim by saying that infanticide in Christian and Jewish communities was “extremely rare”.

Why do you ask for statistical backup of my claims while simultaneously offering none for yours? [/quote]

Your claims defy common sense.

You gave a pass to Hindus, alleging a “social” aberration when the trend of infanticides there most likely derives from the belief that parents cannot achieve salvation until they get a son to perform their last rites.

The bit about Jewish and Christian infanticide being statistically insignificant is so retarded I can’t begin to comprehend how you got it. If you need backup to reconsider your that statement, then you’re a lost cause. And I’m serious here.

[quote]Of course it’s a problem. A huge one at that. But why did you bring up religion for?

Because it’s the common thread between all those killings. [/quote]

I hear all of them ate bread too.

[quote]The perpetrators usually get locked up and it’s way too lenient a punishment in my opinion.

Actually, they get locked up only after much international fuss is raised over it. And the time they spend in the hole is a joke as punishment for murder.

Fsck 'em! They’re not my fellow anything. They’re criminal scum.

Right. The old “my religion is peaceful” bullshit again. The “they’re not true muslims” fallacy.

Look genius, they claim to be muslims all their lives, live in muslim community and show up at the local mosque all the time. Why don’t you kick them out if they’re not “real” muslims? [/quote]

Shiiiiit! Didn’t we go down that road many times already?

Look genius, if I knew the guy sitting next to me was about to commit murder, I would kick him. But you see, I don’t have prescient superpowers. And generally, getting involved in a family feud ensures you get all of them on your back - including the victim! Of course, once the killing is done, there’s hardly anything one can do about it, isn’t there?

I will NEVER “participate in a religion” that’s centralized. Screw that in your head real hard.

I don’t need no stinking gurus.

I see. You probably also think video games should be banned, cannabis makes you rape women, weapons are inherently evil and rock music is just a cover for satanism.

Evil people are everywhere. Granted, their evil is more pronounced in backwards societies, but my religion’s got nothing to do with that.

If you have a problem with “basically flawed” and “so easily subverted” you should “oppose” or “not participate in” the Human adventure (off-topic: I read in a medical journal, atheists/agnostics are more likely to off themselves than believers. I’ll see if I can dig it up.)

The only one that could have claimed that kind of authority is dead. Me, I offer my interpretation of the message he left us to anyone interested. But I’m not going to go preach to people and ask them to follow me. The I-know-the-one-truth-and-am-here-to-save-you attitude is a big part of the problem, not some kind of solution.

I know my fair share of the I know-the-one-truth-and-are-here-to-save-you crowd who profess(ed) Islam and are alive or died of natural reasons.

But I have a question: If you know I “won’t do that”, then why all the suggestions earlier?

No, but three lefts do.

[quote]Let me get this straight: You skip over most of my post and yet conclude that they would be worthy of an entry in some rapist’s manifesto.

The ones I read before I started skipping them, yes. [/quote]

Translation: You’ve got squat but persist in making baseless slanderous claims.

Textbook FUD.

[quote]True that. It was just an attempt to illustrate your knee-jerk mentality.

Having a knee-jerk reaction upon hearing that a man has killed his daughter is normal. It’s decent. Civilized. Non-barbaric.

You’re the one who’s defending your fellow muslims… claiming that they didn’t kill over “religious matters” but “marriage arrangements.” I wasn’t aware that muslim marriages were secular affairs. [/quote]

I’m not defending anyone. I just don’t want morons to associate me with criminals.

And don’t talk about what you don’t know. It makes you sound like an ass. Forced marriage is not something that’s tolerated in Islam (or in any other religion for that matter).

[quote]You wrote: “your religion tells you to kill your own kid”.

You can see why I might have gotten the idea.

Now you’re too stupid to infer from context? The guy’s a muslim, his religion is Islam. Maybe you can ask an adult to help you read along and explain all the semantic meanings you miss.[/quote]

No, no. I get it alright!

A man who professes Islam killed his daughter → It’s Islam’s fault

[quote]Slamming all of them by some twisted association is moronic.

Since we get no reaction from the supposedly peaceful muslim majority, what else can we do but to conclude that you tacitly support those killings? [/quote]

People oppose murder. If you need reactions, go fetch them on your own time. See if you can communicate with that “majority” to start with.

Your lack of common sense is truly baffling.

Next time, I’ll throw a party everytime someone is butchered.

Beats the silence.

Ah, so now we have “a couple of press releases”? Good.

You’re going out of your way to be illogical.

Again, Islam doesn’t say to kill your daughter. If it did, it wouldn’t have a billion point two adepts.

And for the last time, there’s no central authority in Islam!

???

You’re not making any sense.

I think I’m done here. If you must associate all Muslims with murderers because a murder happened to be perpetrated by a Muslim (and knowing murder is a no-no in Islam), then there’s nothing I can do about it. You believe religion is evil, and I can’t say I blame you for thinking that.

But that you have to file everybody under the same banner, can’t be bothered to assume good faith and think Muslims are guilty (of supporting murder) until proven innocents is inexcusable.

[quote]lixy wrote:
can’t be bothered to assume good faith and think Muslims are guilty (of supporting murder) until proven innocents is inexcusable.[/quote]

All civilized cultures have laws in place to severely punish murderers.

If you have religious societies that either don’t have laws, don’t apply them, or have penalties that are no more than a slap on a wrist, the only logical conclusion is that murders - at least in some forms (like the ones that involve females in this case) - are, if not encouraged, at least well tolerated.

The Koran consistently describes women as being worth, at most, half a man and usually less. And just as we don’t give life sentence to people who kill animals, you don’t see muslim societies heavily sanction crimes against woman. And why should they, once they’ve convinced themselves that half of humanity is just talking cattle?

Your religion sucks. Deal with it.

[quote]pookie wrote:
lixy wrote:
can’t be bothered to assume good faith and think Muslims are guilty (of supporting murder) until proven innocents is inexcusable.

All civilized cultures have laws in place to severely punish murderers.

If you have religious societies that either don’t have laws, don’t apply them, or have penalties that are no more than a slap on a wrist, the only logical conclusion is that murders - at least in some forms (like the ones that involve females in this case) - are, if not encouraged, at least well tolerated.

The Koran consistently describes women as being worth, at most, half a man and usually less. And just as we don’t give life sentence to people who kill animals, you don’t see muslim societies heavily sanction crimes against woman.

And why should they, once they’ve convinced themselves that half of humanity is just talking cattle?

Your religion sucks. Deal with it.
[/quote]

And so started the last religious war, Atheists vs. Muslims. Pitching humanity into a dark and bloody struggle for the next 232 years, future archaeologist will trace it’s flash point to one post, on a bodybuilding forum. Thanks alot, man.

[quote]Sloth wrote:
And so started the last religious war, Atheists vs. Muslims. Pitching humanity into a dark and bloody struggle for the next 232 years, future archaeologist will trace it’s flash point to one post, on a bodybuilding forum. Thanks alot, man.[/quote]

Atheism is a religion like not collecting stamps is a hobby.

But kidding aside, Pookie’s thinking is quite dangerous. Not only is he wrong on what the punishment for murder is on the books, but he insists on laying the blame and responsibility on preventing those crimes on Muslims. Not society, not governments, not people: Muslims.

The thought that I am equally to blame for some whackado strangling his kids as himself doesn’t even enter his mind.

Pookie is the atheist version of blind extremism.

[quote]Gkhan wrote:
…or are you against women’s rights?[/quote]

That was a question for Lixy, I had trouble quoting last night so I just posted it.

[quote]lixy wrote:
But kidding aside, Pookie’s thinking is quite dangerous. Not only is he wrong on what the punishment for murder is on the books, but he insists on laying the blame and responsibility on preventing those crimes on Muslims. Not society, not governments, not people: Muslims.
[/quote]

Kind of the way you blame America for all the Muslim problems and then blame the voters and tax payers.

Is your kind of thinking dangerous as well?

edit: Yes…it’s the rational behind all of al-qaeda’s attacks on innocent civilians and why groups like Hezbollah (to name one example, terrorists themselves) denounce them.

[quote]lixy wrote:
You gave a pass to Hindus, alleging a “social” aberration when the trend of infanticides there most likely derives from the belief that parents cannot achieve salvation until they get a son to perform their last rites.[/quote]

There is no pass for infanticide. Those parents will be stuck in the cycle of life and death until they make up for murder. Which will take a while.

Ain’t Karma a bitch?

[quote]lixy wrote:
Not society, not governments, not people: Muslims.[/quote]

Yes, because we all know that in Saudi Arabia, there is clear separation of church and state.

Muslims are quite big on keeping their religion out of as many domains as possible.

The fact that the Iraqi constitution mentions allah in its first sentence is simple coincidence. A mere typo. Just like “Islam is the official religion of the state and is a basic source of legislation”… I mean, who hasn’t slipped up on the keyboard and typed that by mistake many times?

I mean, all the other muslim nations have no mention of allah or the koran in their constitution, right? I could name dozens of examples, like… well… er… Do your own damn research, ok?

No, no. The truth is that muslims don’t want to their religion to get mixed up in governments, laws, by-laws, rules or anything of that sort.

Except for Danish cartoons, but that’s the only exception.

Well, that and the naming of teddy bears. Can’t leave important stuff to chance, right?

Apart from those two important matters - and, well, the occasional culling of daughters - Islam is really a very peaceful private affair.

In fact, if you discount the 999,999,996 false muslims who don’t understand that when allah speaks about killing he actually means “hugs and kisses”; and concentrate on the 4 true muslims of this planet, you’d see right away how peaceful they are.

I’m such a big meanie for failing to see that. Bad, dangerous pookie.

[quote]lixy wrote:
Sloth wrote:
And so started the last religious war, Atheists vs. Muslims. Pitching humanity into a dark and bloody struggle for the next 232 years, future archaeologist will trace it’s flash point to one post, on a bodybuilding forum. Thanks alot, man.

Atheism is a religion like not collecting stamps is a hobby.

But kidding aside, Pookie’s thinking is quite dangerous. Not only is he wrong on what the punishment for murder is on the books, but he insists on laying the blame and responsibility on preventing those crimes on Muslims. Not society, not governments, not people: Muslims.

The thought that I am equally to blame for some whackado strangling his kids as himself doesn’t even enter his mind.

Pookie is the atheist version of blind extremism.[/quote]

Dunno. I just wanted to write something prophetic.

[quote]pookie wrote:
In fact, if you discount the 999,999,996 false muslims who don’t understand that when allah speaks about killing he actually means “hugs and kisses”; and concentrate on the 4 true muslims of this planet, you’d see right away how peaceful they are.[/quote]

Hyperbole, but I agree with this. The violent ones are the most vocal. The only people I know outspoken against the general mess that is organized Islam would be the people who don’t listen to the Islamic religious “leaders” (yet still identify themselves as Muslims).

Even you have to admit Lixy, that taken at face value Islam is violent.

[quote]Sloth wrote:
And so started the last religious war, Atheists vs. Muslims. Pitching humanity into a dark and bloody struggle for the next 232 years, future archaeologist will trace it’s flash point to one post, on a bodybuilding forum. Thanks alot, man.[/quote]

I call movie rights.

I seem to recall you checking out my honor killing thread, where I demonstrated that honor killing is linked to Islam. Was something possessing your body then and you have no recollection of it?

Hindus lead the way in honor killings? I’ve never heard of a single instance of a Hindu honor killing.

Do you just come on this forum to be made a fool? The standard conversation with you, every single time, goes like this:

infidel a: Moslems did [insert description of some act of terror or villainy].

lixy: Actually, Islam doesn’t support that. We believe [insert some obfuscation or outright lie].

infidel on this forum familiar with Islam: Actually, according to these jurists or commentators and according to this and that Islamic text [insert rulings and texts], you’re completely lying!

lixy: [crickets chirping in background]

Do you understand that you have exactly zero credibility on this forum? Even people initially sympathetic to your America hatred are off-put by you because you don’t know how to tell the truth, so they become dreaded “Islamophobes” as well.

Sadly, you’re representative of most Muslims. You all live in an upside-down world, where right is wrong, and wrong is right.

[quote]lixy wrote:
Sloth wrote:
And so started the last religious war, Atheists vs. Muslims. Pitching humanity into a dark and bloody struggle for the next 232 years, future archaeologist will trace it’s flash point to one post, on a bodybuilding forum. Thanks alot, man.

Atheism is a religion like not collecting stamps is a hobby.

But kidding aside, Pookie’s thinking is quite dangerous. Not only is he wrong on what the punishment for murder is on the books, but he insists on laying the blame and responsibility on preventing those crimes on Muslims. Not society, not governments, not people: Muslims.

The thought that I am equally to blame for some whackado strangling his kids as himself doesn’t even enter his mind.

Pookie is the atheist version of blind extremism.[/quote]

Unless pookie has plans to convert us all to atheism by the sword, his extremism is really just academic, isn’t it? Your co-religionists, on the other hand, are a different matter.