T Nation

Which Type of Fighting

[quote] No offense but that stuff dosent work if your opponent is alot bigger than you. I’m in law inforcement and have been trained in all that stuff but for the most part it dosent work. A fellow officer is a black belt in judo and he cannot throw me around, he’s tryed I’m 6’4 240 pounds and hes 6’ 180. It just dosent work.

Also when fighting on the street all that ground fighting isn’t going to last long because pavement isn’t a soft mat and even if your on top you knee’s will be hamberger if not need sergery. Sure once you have a arm or rist lock your opponent will relent but good luck getting to that point.
something to think about
God bless[/quote]

For god’s sake of course it doesn’t work on you!!! you are 6’4’ and 240!!! What percentage of the population is that big? So because it doesn’t work on you because you are genetically gifted it doesn’t work on the majority of the population?

Trust me it does.

[quote]ScrambyEggs wrote:
Miserere wrote:
Muay Thai. It’s not fancy, it’s effective. You get the boxing skills (the best in close combat, whatever anyone says) and the added elbows; plus the legwork (which you may or may not have a chance to use in a real fight).

Agreed. Muay Thai is the way to go.
[/quote]

I also agree - if there is one you want to have in your back pocket it is muay thai and this is coming from a life long shotokan/bjj guy.

But like anything in life you must learn it properly.

Remember, no one ever wins a fight.

But I do agree that a combo of boxing and MA is the best way to go. Ground stuff is good but if the person you’re fighting has friends, being on the ground is bad news…

Thats so true Lostinthougth just last week I saw a bouncer trained in bjj take a guy down in a fight and then get his head kicked in by the guys six friends, in that situation it is best to try and stay on your feet and not go to ground fighting if you can help it.

[quote]Massif wrote:
Dude,

I would seriously look at doing a combo of boxing and wrestling. Get some good solid, no-bullshit technique down on both of them and you’ll be ahead in the game.

[/quote]

As a former Nat’l & Int’l level competitor in a Martial Art, I agree with the above statement 100%. The quickest way to learn to fight (Best Bang for the Buck) is to start Boxing. Once you’ve got that down some, start wrestling.

The key is to find a COMPETENT TEACHER. You might have to filter through a lot of Bullshit to find one. DOn’t waste your time with a Bad Teacher, no matter what type of fighting.

[quote]GoodKnight wrote:
Xvim wrote:
I started out training in Judo, did some MMA with Dan Severn with his unique combination of greco/sambo and I’m currently studying Sho Bu Do Jiu Jutsu which has a lot in common with Aikido. I’ve found a lot of the JJ very useful in real life situations and much of what we do in this style of JJ is used to some degree in Aikido. I do tend to agree that Aikido classes tend to focus on choreographed excercises rather than practial application.

Most of what we do involves standing joint locks, arm bars and some nasty throws in coordination with a wide variety of striking techniques. Most of our strikes revolve around making an opponent vulnerable to some other soft technique but we do some bag work and a lot of breaking techniques, arms, wrists, fingers etc.

No offense but that stuff dosent work if your opponent is alot bigger than you. I’m in law inforcement and have been trained in all that stuff but for the most part it dosent work. A fellow officer is a black belt in judo and he cannot throw me around, he’s tryed I’m 6’4 240 pounds and hes 6’ 180. It just dosent work.

Also when fighting on the street all that ground fighting isn’t going to last long because pavement isn’t a soft mat and even if your on top you knee’s will be hamberger if not need sergery. Sure once you have a arm or rist lock your opponent will relent but good luck getting to that point.
something to think about
God bless[/quote]

Bull Shit…my experience it works just fine against a bigger opponent…IN A DEFENSE situation. also, maybe your buddy just sucks.

The best form of Martial Art is Krav Maga. It is the oficial martial art of the Isreal Army. It has been tested in real world applications. This art teaches against multiple attacks and also against armed aggressors.

First, I have to agree with Mental about attitude/confidence being the number one factor in avoiding a fight. Not a BAD attitude, just a confident one.

About actual systems…I think that a mix of boxing/wrestling IS great for one-on-one fights. But as for street fights, you want to end them as quickly as possible. I’d look into something like Jeet Kune Do as well. Yes, I’m partial because that’s what I study, but there’s a reason I chose it.

Boxing, wrestling, muay thai, Brazilian Jiu jitsu, judo, mma, or sambo.

Personally, I’d go with a combination of any of the above, preferably a grappling art and a striking art.

I chose these because I’m definitely of the mind that competition is the best way to train for the street, not the “self defense” classes. You have to get to know yourself under the pressure of performance and competing is the safest way.

Train in Muay Thai and Karate.

Rationale: Karate will condition you to deliver strong, square, effective blows. The training is a controlled environment, but in a street fight where it’s not a controlled situation, it will benefit you as your natural movements will cause you to deliver strong blows.

Muay Thai will make you a better street fighter all around. Every once in a while in the news, there are stories of muay thai fighters getting jumped and accidentally killing someone with a fatal blow.

Sure, no one wants to hurt anyone else, but if you’re forced to defend yourself from someone who is out to harm or kill you or someone in your family, you have every right to do what needs to be done.

Train in Muay Thai and Karate.

Rationale: Karate will condition you to deliver strong, square, effective blows. The training is a controlled environment, but in a street fight where it’s not a controlled situation, it will benefit you as your natural movements will cause you to deliver strong blows.

Muay Thai will make you a better street fighter all around. Every once in a while in the news, there are stories of muay thai fighters getting jumped and accidentally killing someone with a fatal blow.

Sure, no one wants to hurt anyone else, but if you’re forced to defend yourself from someone who is out to harm or kill you or someone in your family, you have every right to do what needs to be done.

Ggonta47,

You just haven’t met the right practitioner. I’m also 6’4" 240, and I’ve worked out with a Gracie BJJ practicioner (5’10" 170) who could tie me in knots. My background is 10 years of karate and a little wrestling in high school. We didn’t try for knockouts, but I could hit him at will standing up. However, once he got a grip on me, I wasn’t exactly helpless - but he always managed a submittal.

[quote]gonta47 wrote:
No offense but that stuff dosent work if your opponent is alot bigger than you. I’m in law inforcement and have been trained in all that stuff but for the most part it dosent work. A fellow officer is a black belt in judo and he cannot throw me around, he’s tryed I’m 6’4 240 pounds and hes 6’ 180. It just dosent work.

Also when fighting on the street all that ground fighting isn’t going to last long because pavement isn’t a soft mat and even if your on top you knee’s will be hamberger if not need sergery. Sure once you have a arm or rist lock your opponent will relent but good luck getting to that point.
something to think about
God bless

For god’s sake of course it doesn’t work on you!!! you are 6’4’ and 240!!! What percentage of the population is that big? So because it doesn’t work on you because you are genetically gifted it doesn’t work on the majority of the population?

Trust me it does.
[/quote]

http://images.t-nation.com/forum_images/7/6/760206.1127164503623.bluff.bmp

Id go with Krav Maga, fast, instinctive movments and, well, dirty. Most MMA are good for the streets, try out a few and se wich one you like. All offer some serious cardio so youll be burning fat to:) Obviously as you seen in previouse posts, the opinions are many of the most effective, thats an endless discussion. One thing is for ceartin though, wich ever you choose you`ll be better prepared than you are now so try a few out before you decide; boxing, krav, karate or BJJ, they are all better than nothing.

Anything with full contact striking - muay thai, boxing, mma.

Don’t put too much emphasis on the ground if you’re not looking to compete, but don’t neglect it either.

This will give you a grounding only. You need to get a group of you and go full tilt boogie in some scenrios. Start with a confrontation and work from it. Basically this will just allow you to apply use your mma training.

As for knives and guns, there are a few good dvds out there, but again you need to get together with a few guys and just work shit out…and then go full tilt.

Don’t bother with anything that doesn’t go full contact, or wastes time with fancy moves.

NHB are testing grounds and are pretty good indicators of what works - flappy shit soon get dropped it if doesn’t work. So forget the Seagal picking-the-knife-out-of-the-air-and-throwing-him-using-only-a-wrist-lock-bullshit.

Compliancy kills. Go full tilt or go home.

Mart.
ps that age old advice of “just run away” is shit too. What if you’re with you kids/wife/mother/friend/loved one etc. Are you just gonna leave them there?

pps “Just kick 'em in the nuts” is a load of crap too. If it were that easy then or effective then street violence would be stopped after the first blow. Assumptions are the mother of all fuck ups.

[quote]Mr ian wrote:
Would def. agree with MASSIF. Get some good stand up and ground fighting, with the two of them combined you cant go wrong. [/quote]

I agree. I would also recommend Muay Thai or a street fighting class. Some schools offer a real street or self defense fighting class. (not cardio kickboxing, etc.)

Another thing is this…

Just because your sensei/Shamrock/Tyson/Bruce Less or anyone else has a super effective strike or system doesn’t make it the best.

If you can’t pull of the move than it’s useless to you. Find what works for you and use. If you find that you’re KOing everyone with a right cross/backfist/chin tickle then good for you. DO what works, fuck the rest. Efficency is key.

Mart.

get hyooge and talk like Clint Motherfucking* Eastwood.

*i looked it up. Clint’s middle name is, in fact, Motherfucking.

[quote]HHH wrote:
G’day everyone

Im looking for advice on to which type of fighting would best help me on the street. Let me explain.

Now im not a voilent person at all,very laid back and mellow but if someone goes to hurt me or my family (luckily has not happened) then that would be a different story.

What would u guys reccomend for a fighting style i could train .I have no formal fight training of any kind but i want something to protect myself say if i got into a situation where i could not talk my way out of or if some drunk comes swinging at me.

Now im fairly strong and could manhandle some sack of shit if need be but if i come across someone who is big and can fight then well im pretty screwed.

So what do u reccomend for basic protection on the streets, apart from a gun or knife :confused:
Boxing
Karate
kickboxing
wrestling etc etc

Thanks heaps

HHH[/quote]

Hi HHH,

I have been practicing Karate for 8 years and I can tell you it is a good art. However if what you have in mind is effective street self-defence or fighting, it needs not to be Karate but the school should have the following essences in general:

  1. The school teaches you how to hit hard, throw hard, fight hard etc.
  • Believe it or not, there are a lot of McDojo that do not practice the above.
  1. The other students of the school follows (1) well and hit/throw/fight you hard during practice.
  • This is equally important to the first point.
  1. The school teaches you how to assess different people, different situation etc.
  • Street is not Dojo but not every school teaches you that - Schools that are more sport-wise often “forget” to do this.

  • During practice you do not run away, but in reality sometimes you might just have to do so. A good self-defence school would teach you how to walk out or run from a fight safely without the need to engage.

  1. The school practice difficult real-life situations/scenarios, e.g. mulitple attackers, attacker with weapon etc.
  • This point goes with point (1) and (3). Some school tell people just to run when facing mulitple attackers and/or weapons, which is not realistic.

There are more than the above but I think the above are the most important of identifing a good self-defense school.

My $0.02NZD,

Geek boy

I would suggest AKKI Kenpo Karate. The founder is Paul Mills, and I have to say that it IMO it is very effective. It is based off of physics and proper body mechanics, rather than doing things a certain way just because of tradition. Paul Mills used to be a bouncer, and I’d say has more than enough knowledge of what works and what doesn’t. I know I’ve personally experienced the fact that it works, through having to defend myself. It relies heavily on hand strikes (lots of heal palms), eye gouges, elbows, knees, you also do learn ground fighting in it, and I can say that it works, after having MMA matches with friends who train in wrestling and other grappling arts. It’s definately a very complete art.

That being said, it might also be a good idea to take some boxing or Muay Thai at the same time. Learning how to take a hit is just as important as learning how to hit someone. Where I take Kenpo, it’s normal for us to take plenty of good hits while practicing, especially the higher up in rank we get, we definately blast each other and you can build up a tolerance to it. But it’s still not quite the same as to sparring in a spontanious enviroment, and having some guy who’s really trying to hit you hard repeatedly.

Do boxing or muay thai for stand up.

Do submission or wrestling for ground work.

Just find places that have guys actively competing in the ring and you can’t go wrong.