When to Start Eating Like a Machine?

[quote]Fat Boy 33 wrote:
Just put a loaded syringe in a checked bag and if anyone happens to ask (which they won’t), tell them it’s Vitamin B12. Pinning once a week is just asking for problems with E.[/quote]

I think you’ve got it backwards there buddy. Taking drugs on an airplane via loaded syringe and lying to TSA is ‘asking for problems’, much more so than pinning Test E once a week 1 time.

[quote]flipcollar wrote:

[quote]Fat Boy 33 wrote:
Just put a loaded syringe in a checked bag and if anyone happens to ask (which they won’t), tell them it’s Vitamin B12. Pinning once a week is just asking for problems with E.[/quote]

I think you’ve got it backwards there buddy. Taking drugs on an airplane via loaded syringe and lying to TSA is ‘asking for problems’, much more so than pinning Test E once a week 1 time.[/quote]

Thank god some one else agrees here.

[quote]cycobushmaster wrote:

[quote]eatmorefood wrote:

[quote]cycobushmaster wrote:

[quote]Saftfrucht wrote:
Hey guys, planning my first cycle - 500mg test e e7d only. And as test injections take a while to take full effect, I was wondering when would be the optimal time to increase my calories significantly. I obviously don’t want to do it too soon and become an ambulocetus before the test even starts working.

I am cutting right now and maintain at around 2400 kcals (tiny guy at 5’6 here) and usually when bulking normally I go to 2900. How much should I add on top of that to maximize my gains on the cycle?

I was thinking up to 2900 immediately and then go to 3400 as test takes effect - good or bad idea? I am terrified at getting fat and would rather leave a pound or two of gains on the road rather than gain too much fat.[/quote]

i’d suggest pinning something like sun-thur, as test e/cyp has a half life of 4.5 days… pinning once a week is gonna result in more roller coaster hormone issues.
[/quote]

Arent cyp/enth in the 10-12 day range? Should still pin twice weekly but I thought they right around 10-12. [/quote]

nope.

for some reason, somebody claimed that a while back and wrote up some chart with all these half-lives and such, but it was way off.

anecdotally, if it was 10-12 days, then it would never make any sense as to why using test e/cyp 2x a week was a good idea. and in looking at the actual pharmokinetics of the drug, we see that it’s 4.5 days, so all the sudden, one realizes that twice weekly administration does make sense…

Ok. Not disagreeing as I’ve probably just been reading the same info that everyone else has. I can’t get the article to load but I have to ask. Why do we then recommend PCT starts 2 weeks after last pin and why do many doctors have TRT patients pin cyp once weekly?

[quote]eatmorefood wrote:

[quote]cycobushmaster wrote:

[quote]eatmorefood wrote:

[quote]cycobushmaster wrote:

[quote]Saftfrucht wrote:
Hey guys, planning my first cycle - 500mg test e e7d only. And as test injections take a while to take full effect, I was wondering when would be the optimal time to increase my calories significantly. I obviously don’t want to do it too soon and become an ambulocetus before the test even starts working.

I am cutting right now and maintain at around 2400 kcals (tiny guy at 5’6 here) and usually when bulking normally I go to 2900. How much should I add on top of that to maximize my gains on the cycle?

I was thinking up to 2900 immediately and then go to 3400 as test takes effect - good or bad idea? I am terrified at getting fat and would rather leave a pound or two of gains on the road rather than gain too much fat.[/quote]

i’d suggest pinning something like sun-thur, as test e/cyp has a half life of 4.5 days… pinning once a week is gonna result in more roller coaster hormone issues.
[/quote]

Arent cyp/enth in the 10-12 day range? Should still pin twice weekly but I thought they right around 10-12. [/quote]

nope.

for some reason, somebody claimed that a while back and wrote up some chart with all these half-lives and such, but it was way off.

anecdotally, if it was 10-12 days, then it would never make any sense as to why using test e/cyp 2x a week was a good idea. and in looking at the actual pharmokinetics of the drug, we see that it’s 4.5 days, so all the sudden, one realizes that twice weekly administration does make sense…

Ok. Not disagreeing as I’ve probably just been reading the same info that everyone else has. I can’t get the article to load but I have to ask. Why do we then recommend PCT starts 2 weeks after last pin and why do many doctors have TRT patients pin cyp once weekly?[/quote]

Google “pharmokinetics of testosterone esters” when ya get a chance…

well, for TRT once a week is still fine… there’s a peak from the injection, and then 4.5 days it’s down to half it was. and most the guys on TRT are floating around the upper range of normal, whereas most guys are prolly more in the middle anyway…

with that being said, if you inject 500 mg of test e/cyp, in 4.5 days, it’s 250, in 9 days, it’s 125, etc…

there’s no point starting PCT until the exogenous test is down to at least close to what we can normally produce (20-70 mg a week), as anything higher will continue to suppress and just be a waste of the SERM.

it’s kinda hard for me to explain here, but once you plug it into an Excel spreadsheet, it all makes sense pretty quick…

I’ve been researching this for a few minutes now and I found where your article says 4.5 days. Then I see 10.5 for E which was what I always believed and 12 for cyp. Then drugs.com shows cyp at 8 days. There is some seriously conflicting info out there.

[quote]Fat Boy 33 wrote:
Just put a loaded syringe in a checked bag and if anyone happens to ask (which they won’t), tell them it’s Vitamin B12. Pinning once a week is just asking for problems with E.[/quote]

Hello no. I’m in consulting, I never travel alone and I definitely don’t want any colleague to witness any uncomfortable event at security involving me and a syringe. No, no, no.

Considering the injection schedule, I could probably divide the injection up to monday mornings and friday evenings - that’s as regular as I could get. Looks like this might be more sensible than e7d? 300mg on monday and 200 on friday, or an even 250 split.

Thanks for the input so far

[quote]eatmorefood wrote:
I’ve been researching this for a few minutes now and I found where your article says 4.5 days. Then I see 10.5 for E which was what I always believed and 12 for cyp. Then drugs.com shows cyp at 8 days. There is some seriously conflicting info out there.[/quote]

i’ve never seen any real data (studies, pharm info) that showed 10-12 days…

I didn’t say studies. I was just referencing what is readily available and commenting on how much different the info is. I did get your page to load. I’d like to know where the misinformation comes from. I also saw quite a few pages with debates on the half of cyp specifically. Seems like this has been going on for awhile.

[quote]eatmorefood wrote:
I didn’t say studies. I was just referencing what is readily available and commenting on how much different the info is. I did get your page to load. I’d like to know where the misinformation comes from. I also saw quite a few pages with debates on the half of cyp specifically. Seems like this has been going on for awhile.[/quote]

ah, okay.

yeah, i don’t know who started it.

i think it might be similar to some of the other “bro-science” floating around… for instance, the data on EQ and deca, as far as collagen synthesis (some claim they increase this 200-300%). nobody has every substantiated this, as far as i know…

i did see what you mentioned on drugs.com, they mentioned the cyp half-life as 8 days.

i’ll do some digging in my notes, as i have some other links on the various esters…

[quote]cycobushmaster wrote:

[quote]eatmorefood wrote:
I didn’t say studies. I was just referencing what is readily available and commenting on how much different the info is. I did get your page to load. I’d like to know where the misinformation comes from. I also saw quite a few pages with debates on the half of cyp specifically. Seems like this has been going on for awhile.[/quote]

ah, okay.

yeah, i don’t know who started it.

i think it might be similar to some of the other “bro-science” floating around… for instance, the data on EQ and deca, as far as collagen synthesis (some claim they increase this 200-300%). nobody has every substantiated this, as far as i know…

i did see what you mentioned on drugs.com, they mentioned the cyp half-life as 8 days.

i’ll do some digging in my notes, as i have some other links on the various esters…[/quote]

http://www.pfizer.ca/en/our_products/products/monograph/182

I started eating pre cycle to get use to it. It’s not easy to eat above maintenance if you’re not use to it… Rather fail off cycle than fail on.

[quote]nooberific wrote:
I started eating pre cycle to get use to it. It’s not easy to eat above maintenance if you’re not use to it… Rather fail off cycle than fail on.[/quote]

That’s not the problem actually. I can eat that much without any problem, what I am concerned with is the right moment to actually go significantly beyond even what I would normally eat when bulking, as I am afraid to get fat if I do this too early.

I am now planning to up the ante slowly from maintenance on the day of the first injection to 1,000 kcal over maintenance after 4 weeks, adding 250 kcals per week until that point and then maintaining that level for the duration of the cycle, going back down as I taper off the test.

I’d be interested in experiences if this is a good idea or not, and in general if going 1,000 over maintenance is a sensible thing to do on a beginner cycle or if someone has had other experiences with regards to calorie surplus.

As I said, I travel a lot and it’s pretty complicated logistically to eat well on the road - so better safe than sorry.

[quote]Saftfrucht wrote:

[quote]nooberific wrote:
I started eating pre cycle to get use to it. It’s not easy to eat above maintenance if you’re not use to it… Rather fail off cycle than fail on.[/quote]

That’s not the problem actually. I can eat that much without any problem, what I am concerned with is the right moment to actually go significantly beyond even what I would normally eat when bulking, as I am afraid to get fat if I do this too early.[/quote]

Can’t you just keep an eye on yourself, and adjust as necessary? If you start to get fat, cut calories. It seems pretty simple to me. It’s not like you have to commit to anything and stick with it, no matter the results. Just be reasonable.

Flip that makes way too much sense. Absolutely no way that this problem can be solved by nor completely over thinking all this.

[quote]flipcollar wrote:

[quote]Fat Boy 33 wrote:
Just put a loaded syringe in a checked bag and if anyone happens to ask (which they won’t), tell them it’s Vitamin B12. Pinning once a week is just asking for problems with E.[/quote]

I think you’ve got it backwards there buddy. Taking drugs on an airplane via loaded syringe and lying to TSA is ‘asking for problems’, much more so than pinning Test E once a week 1 time.[/quote]

Well, I’ve never lied to TSA, because no one’s every asked. Keep in mind, I’m talking about a checked bag, not one you’re taking through security. They do x-ray it, but unless you’re tucking it between a kilo of coke and couple pounds of yellow cake uranium, I think it’s probably not that big of a deal. Maybe I need to be more paranoid.

[quote]Fat Boy 33 wrote:

Well, I’ve never lied to TSA, because no one’s every asked. Keep in mind, I’m talking about a checked bag, not one you’re taking through security. They do x-ray it, but unless you’re tucking it between a kilo of coke and couple pounds of yellow cake uranium, I think it’s probably not that big of a deal. Maybe I need to be more paranoid.
[/quote]

All well and maybe you are right, but I never check any bags. I take all my luggage into the cabin with me, so it all goes through the security checkpoint.
I have resolved on injecting mondays and fridays now anyway, so it doesn’t matter.

[quote]Fat Boy 33 wrote:

[quote]flipcollar wrote:

[quote]Fat Boy 33 wrote:
Just put a loaded syringe in a checked bag and if anyone happens to ask (which they won’t), tell them it’s Vitamin B12. Pinning once a week is just asking for problems with E.[/quote]

I think you’ve got it backwards there buddy. Taking drugs on an airplane via loaded syringe and lying to TSA is ‘asking for problems’, much more so than pinning Test E once a week 1 time.[/quote]

Well, I’ve never lied to TSA, because no one’s every asked. Keep in mind, I’m talking about a checked bag, not one you’re taking through security. They do x-ray it, but unless you’re tucking it between a kilo of coke and couple pounds of yellow cake uranium, I think it’s probably not that big of a deal. Maybe I need to be more paranoid.
[/quote]

I thought you were trolling at first, but I guess since you came back to defend yourself, you actually mean this.

The risk/reward for what you’re doing is just fucking awful. The reward of not skipping a pin or 2 is negligible. I don’t know why you think pinning Test E once a week should be avoided at all costs, but this simply isn’t true. I know Reed only pins once a week with it, as do I. Beyond this though, the risk is enormous. On the off chance that you DO get caught, you will be in jail. Period. Depending on where you’re traveling, you could literally be facing multiple years in prison. That’s a ridiculous risk to take in my opinion.

But you can do whatever you want I guess.