T Nation

When to Include Tren: Powerlifting Cycle


Hi all,

I am a somewhat novice powerlifter, currently training for a meet that is going to take place in the end of november. I've been training for a little under two years. I have done one cycle so far, a mild one, a low dose test and anadrol cycle. I got a nice amount of strength (which is the whole point of the cycle) and some mass. Now I'm planning my next cycle, which will be more aggressive.

Height 5'7
Weight 180
bf (guesstimated) 15%
Best lifts so far
Squat 440 lbs (Raw, with knee wraps)
Bench 265 lbs(Raw)
Deadlift 440 lbs (Raw)
Overhead press lbs 185 lbs (probably good for more)

As you can see, I'm not hugely strong, but I'm not weak either, so I'm no noob. My next cycle will consist of the following

1-12 test cyp 500mg/week then ramp up to 12-16 test cyp 750mg/week
1-4 dianabol 35 mg/day
12-16 anadrol 100mg/day
I have aromasin in hand to control estrogenic sides. I don't care a whole lot about bloating, I only care about gyno, so I don't see a point in including an AI just to reduce water retention. The meet is in the end of the 16th week.

I have easy access to nolva and clomid and I have a 5000 IU amp of HCG. I can't use it during the cycle as I just have sterile water, not bacteriostatic water, so I'll use it in the end of the cycle to make my nuts grow again and will do the usual protocol with nolva.

Goals on this cycle: gain mass (I'd like to go up to 200 lbs or more, since I plan on competing in the 198 class) but mainly strength. I know this is a fairly long cycle but this keep in mind I'm taking the stuff for strength purposes, that is, to recover better and faster.

Now, to the actual question: I have a bottle of tren E dosed at 200mg/ml that I would like to use on this cycle. My question is: Are the strength gains from tren acute or do they last? I'm trying to figure out if I use the tren (at 200mg/week) in the first half of the cycle, get the strength and hold on to it (and improve it, obviously) until the meet, or to start using it in the 10 weeks leading to the meet. Using it in the beginning would be better regarding sides, as I'd be running along with dianabol and test at reasonable doses, compared to the higher doses and the anadrol in the other half. But it would make more sense to use it near the meet, if the strength gains from the tren don't last. I can't buy another bottle, the thing is too damn expensive and can't afford another bottle. I would also like to keep it low-dose (200 mg/week) as I do not know how I react to it and I can't buy a bottle of tren A to find out.

So, when should I use my tren? from weeks 1-10 or 6-16?


So, I decided to cut the crap and inject all the tren at once, into my left nut. I think I did something wrong, because my left nut hurts like hell and it's pretty swollen.


Why ramp up the test? Either front load it or just run a consistent higher dose. Hcg for pct is a bad idea. Run it during cycle at 250 iu 2 x a week start week 3 or 4.

When is the meet in relation to when you would finish cycle? Seeing as it's tren e and not a, I would run it week 6-16.


The ramp up would have a twofold reason:
-to have higher levels of test during the competition
-to have higher levels of test during a part of the training during which I'll be training very hard.

I don't HAVE to ramp up, if there's a reason not to I can drop it and inject 1g on the week of the competition just so I can have a bunch of test in my blood at that time. I'll be taking halo the day of the meet either way.

I actually have enough test to run 750 mg during the entire 16 weeks (test is very cheap!), but that would be too much and I don't have enough aromasin to run for 16 weeks.

The meet is at the end of the 16th week. Thanks for the input, bchrisen.

EDIT: forgot about the HCG part. The HCG I bought comes with sterile water, not bacteriosatic water, so I have to use it shortly after reconstituting it.


Don't use the little 1ml amp of water that comes with the HCG, get some bac water and sterile vials online and reconstitute it at 1,000iu/ml. Remember the normal single dose for guys is only 250iu. If you use the 1ml of water that comes with it, you will have 5,000iu/ml or 10,000iu/ml depending on which strength you get. It's impossible to dose properly that way. Ever try to draw up .05 units on a slin pin? LOL!


Are you serious? You're gonna run juice after only training for TWO YEARS? Dude, you're not even strong by powerlifting standards. Train hard and get your technique on point. This is f*ing ridiculous.


I seriously hope you lift more than me to talk shit like this. I know I'm not strong, can you not read?


I just turned 19. I started lifting at 16-17. I started training with a group of pretty well known pl'ers last november at age 18. I went from 250/200/315 to 408 (w/only a belt at a meet which was fairly easy)/270/525 (@ 5'9 190lbs) raw from last november til now. My progress has not once stalled and I'm continually making gains both in strength and in size. You can call bullshit if you want, I could care less. What you need to do is get your diet on point and train smart. I could easily see running drugs 6-10 years from now once I stop progressing and have exhausted everything else but why the hell would you do it now? Do you think you're gonna make gains on juice forever? What will you do when you stop progressing then? Just take more juice? You can do whatever you want. I'm just letting you know you're and idiot.


Natty T level progress depends on your T level..insulin and gh levels mainly as well as other genetics. Not everyone can even bench 200 natural. So the drug thing is totally your call. Considering you are weak as hell I would say use the drugs. Obviously you are going to get nowhere in professional powerlifting without drugs. No one does.

As for tren...it looks good on paper, then it kills your appetite about a week in, fucks with your sleep and energy levels, messes with your organs big time. It is toxic as hell. I would suggest high dose test deca and adrol over tren any whatever else anyday. Tren is just not a productive steroid because it is so toxic. Some people I guess can handle it but no one knows what methods are being used to make the tren...be it melting down pellets...some of those methods could be making it very toxic. All I know is had I stayed on whatever tren I got I'd probably be dead in a month. Tren is not worth it.

There is a good reason cows only get tren several weeks before slaughter. IT's because it frickin destroys your organs. Flex wheeler is a great example of what tren abuse does to your kidneys. And even in small doses it is toxic. If any of you want to argue with me, you have to tell me you've been on tren for 6+ weeks.


I don't think he can use genetics as an excuse as he has only been training for two years and has no idea what he is capable of naturally.

Also, I am aware that many top tier powerlifters are using. But there are also a lot of guys who are not who are just as successful.


OK, so you are in the same ballpark as me, you've been lifting for longer and weight more and are lifting around the same poundages as me (you deadlift more, I squat more). Then why the fuck are you talking shit to me? I choose to use drugs, it's my own damn business and stop implying that I don't know how to train or have crappy technique, you're not at my gym to see how I train or squat, so stop pretending you are. Thanks for playing.

Anyone else with some actual advice?


Poor guy.


I'm just a poor boy, I need no sympathy
Because I'm easy come, easy go, Little high, little low


Hey may not be the strongest guy out there, but at least he doesn't have your piss poor attitude. For that he will definitely go further than you. For a guy that supposedly trains with well known powerlifters, you certainly do have a shitty attitude about lifting weights. You don't usually see that from guys that are actually successful.

I will never understand why people want to play Roid Cop and feel like its their place to shove their opinions down someone's throat.


No you are the one that is ridiculous. I know a little about powerlifting and a 440 raw squat at 180 lbs body weight is strong.


Well, I guess there's strong and there's motherfucking STRONG. I'm aiming for motherfucking strong!


There is no other drug that will help you with strength in my opinion than tren. Since you can't get more, I wouldn't waste the one bottle for 200/wk. I would suggest that you wait until you can get more and run it the last 8 weeks of your cycle at 300-400mg a week.

As a newbie to tren I would start with Tren A. If you have horrible sides you can drop it and the sides will reduce fairly quickly. Make sure to take TA ED to keep levels consistent and to help to avoid bad sides. The notorious side affects of Tren are really from person to person. Some do not get them and some get them bad. Good luck.


I really cannot afford tren right now, even tren A. I spent all my bucks on test, since it's pretty much half the price of tren. Sure, it's probably half as effective, but it won't give me night sweats and brain tumors and whatnot like tren, just big titties.

I've seen people taking tren at this dose (200 mg/week) with high test around this board, they seem to do fine, both on terms of sides and strength results. I was under the impression that 200mg would be fine in regard to sides, it's pretty much as low as one can get, right?


Actually you'll find a lot of guys are taking trt doses of test with higher doses of tren with little to no side around here


Well, this would be the opposite of what I'm doing. It sounds great, but expensive as hell.