T Nation

What is the Highest Dose of Test Cyp You Can Take Without an AI?


Is it possible to run a mild cycle of Test Cyp without an AI or estrogen controller? What would a good cycle of Test Cyp only be each week?


go read.


To give them an idea. I’m on 600 mg t and 800 mg eq and my e2 rested at 25. The one time I used 6mg aromasin on this cycle my e2 tanked to 7. They are not needed nearly as much as people think


Would one see a big difference from 150mg a week to 600g a week of test cyp only? How long would you recommend staying on that high of a dose?


It’s going to ultimatley depend on your body. The best folks here can tell you is what’ they’ve experienced. Run your cycle and get bloods done a few weeks into it and see where your numbers are and then add or adjust your AI based on that…that will be the only way you’ll know for sure what works for you.
Or as Flip said: “Go read”.


To further illustrate how much this question depends on the individual I will tell you my numbers.

Pre-TRT e2 was 11. After 200mg/w test c and .5mg Adex twice a week my e2 was 47. I need 1.5mg per week to keep me right around 30-33, which seems to be just right for me personally. Meanwhile you’ve got a guy on here who runs 600mg of test a week along with EQ and he doesn’t need an AI. So yeah, it depends on your body and there’s no way to answer your question until you have blood work done.


I’m gonna hijack this thread.

I’m planning on running EQ for 4 months leading up to a strongman comp. My plan is to run 750 test for the first 2 months, 1g test for the last 2. And I plan to run 600 EQ the whole time. Also Dbol for the first and last 6 weeks (month break in between), maybe an extra oral at the end, and Tren A for the last 6-8 weeks at 500/week.

I guess I’ll ask you 2 questions. 1. Do you like the cycle in general for strength purposes? And 2. Anything specific you would suggest regarding the EQ? I’ve only run it once, in a much more basic cycle. Do you like the dose? And I’ve been told to watch out for RBC getting high, do you think this dose is high enough to be problematic in that regard? I’ve seen conflicting answers. When I ran it before, RBC did not go up out of normal range.


Totally right. Guys also need to take liver supps to help clearance of e2. TUDCA, NAC, and curcumin help tons.


Hey flip. Happy to help. Yea man the cycle looks super strong and on point. You’ll def get super damn strong. I fucking love EQ. A lot of people shit on it and compare it to deca etc blah blah. Eq is fabulous. You will absolutely get strong man. Slow and steady wins the race. Always. Will you ramp the dbol dose?

Blood donation is beneficial regardless of your actual hematocrit and hemoglobin numbers getting out of hand. They will def elevate on this cycle. Every three months should be plenty if they do a full donation. Otherwise some phlebotomy pulling out about 200ml every few Months is totally helpful. Also a lot of your h and h numbers revolve around hydration. Just pound water and food rinse and repeat.


Do you ever get nasty stomach cramps from NAC? I’ve avoided taking it because I had heard that was a side effect.


Never. Not once.


great advice, I appreciate that.

I’m certainly open to ramping the dbol. I figured 50mg/day for the first 6 weeks. I’m taking the month long break in the middle so that I can avoid ramping to an extent, but yea I’m open to it. I have plenty, lol.

How about this. You’re planning a 4 month strength cycle, and you have plenty of dbol available. How would you use it? would you run it the whole time and ramp a couple times, or something else?


If I were running the dbol I would start at 20mg a day and increase by 20mg weekly until I got to 100mg a week. So by week five running 100 mg a week. Then I would taper down by 20 mg weekly for another 5 weeks down to 20mg a day. All your long esters would be kicked in fully by then. That’s one way.

Another way is to say fuck it all and run 50mg a day for 20 weeks haha :slight_smile: I also like 25 mg proviron a day on this cycle.


for what? I have some, could get more.


I like it for its mild effects on e but moreso as an additional DHT


Thanks. If I ask my doc for an AI wouldnt he know something was up? Good news is he is progressive so I’m sure I could get it. Been on TRT now for about 5 months. My bloodwork is really consistent: 650 trough and right around 22-23 E2. If I havent needed an AI and all of a sudden I would, like I said, wouldnt he know something is up?

Im a newbie to this although I’ve been training for a decade. My doctor is the only route I have to get Test. I literally have zero connection nor know how to get one for any other type of pharma which is why I’m asking how to run a cycle on Test and Test alone.



I mean, you have access to the internet, so you have about a thousand sources. Just saying.

And yeah, if your e2 is controlled and all of the sudden you start asking for an AI it would seem suspicious.


I’ve had some luck with taking DIM to lower my E but found that it provided diminishing returns at around the 600-800mg /day range. If you’re trying to avoid asking your doc for an AI then I would suggest trying DIM and run some bloods to see if it’s working for you.


Thanks. As a follow up - since I am on TRT and have no plans of coming off can I run a cycle as follows:

  • 400mg Test per week for X amount of weeks and then come back down to my normal TRT levels (150mg) week without an drastic sides? I’m not sure how coming down from a high dose to a more normal dose affects the body.


Yes you can do that but AGAIN no one can tell you wether you’ll experience any drastic sides…I ‘doubt’ you will because 400mg a week is a fairly low dose. The side effects will be entirely dependant on your individual body cheimstry. My best recommendation is to have some AI or atleast a SERM on hand and to have your blood tested before, during and after your cycle. You want the before tests to refer back to as your ‘baseline’…the during test(s) so you can see what effect any given dose has on your blood chemistry and to know definatively if you need to throw the AI into the mix (and then to test to see if the dosge of AI needs to be adjusted) and finaly the After test to see if your body rebounded from te cycle or not.