What Is My Cycle Missing?

I have spent the last month planning a bulk cycle to be ran in Nov. I have all gear in place but thought I would run it all by the T-Nation members for any additional comments or suggestions. Goal=build mass/strength.

Week 1-12: 1000mg Test E
Week 1-10: 400mg Tren E
Week 1-6: 50mg/day Dbol
Week 1-12: Adex 1mg/day
Week 1-12: HCG 250iu e3rd day
Week 12-18: test taper
Week 13-18: IGF-40mcg/day
Week 13-18: pegMGF-200mcg/e3rd day
I have nolv on hand just in case.

Supplements will include; B-6, Fish oil, Milk Thistle, Multi V, and vit E.
Calories will be at 5600, Protein 425/day
If anyone sees a way to improve on this cycle please let me know.

That’s some God Dang high dosages, you should definitely bulk up. I take it this is not your first cycle?

I have ran multiple cycles and should be back around 235lbs when this starts. Hoping to get to 245-250lbs.

Looks very good. You will like the results.

JW

[quote]JWpushheavy wrote:
Looks very good. You will like the results.

JW[/quote]

You’re my weight and use about the same doses I would/do for a moderate cycle. I eat about 6000 cal/day to maintain 235 though. I like it though, but I like tren.

I know IGF is good for PCT, but MGF? Would this be better to run during cycle? I have no experience with it.

You are running your Adex a little high in my opinion, if .5mg/day is not good enough use a different compound; consider Aromasin at 20mg or Letro at .25/tab.

Your Hcg use at 250iu every 3rd day seems like it would complicate your cycle - if your are on a weekly schedule for everything else (Test & Tren) why not stick with twice a week on the Hcg as well?

You are stopping the AI while tapering? You know that your levels will be far above endogenous levels for about 4+ weeks at your doses? You should continue with the AI, tapering it as well or switch to a SERM during this time.

I don’t understand why the MGF every 3rd day? Never used it, so this might be the best way to use it, but I don’t know why or understand the rational - it is going to have a short active life of less than a day I would assume, and if it’s for some sort of sensitivity issue I would still think that working it around workouts or something other than an aribitary 3rd schedule would be best - BUT, again I don’t really know.

Good luck with it, I really stand behind my first 3 suggestions.

That seems like a killer cycle. I have some questions about mine coming up. Im going to be running something like this

androl: 50mg daily 1-3wk
Test cyp: 500 a week 1-12wk
Deca: 500 week 1-12wk
winstrol 50mg daily 6-12wk
armidex 0.25 daily 1-15
HCG 250iu every 5th day 1-12wk
PCT clomid and nolvadex week 13-15, I also might throw in some IGF-R3 during PCT.

If anybody sees anything they would change let me know. Your help would be great!! Although my main concern is the Deca at that dose vs. the test. Should i change the deca dose or the lenght i run the deca. I dont want any sexual sides from the drug

[quote]swole wrote:
That seems like a killer cycle. I have some questions about mine coming up. Im going to be running something like this

androl: 50mg daily 1-3wk
Test cyp: 500 a week 1-12wk
Deca: 500 week 1-12wk
winstrol 50mg daily 6-12wk
armidex 0.25 daily 1-15
HCG 250iu every 5th day 1-12wk
PCT clomid and nolvadex week 13-15, I also might throw in some IGF-R3 during PCT.

If anybody sees anything they would change let me know. Your help would be great!! Although my main concern is the Deca at that dose vs. the test. Should i change the deca dose or the lenght i run the deca. I dont want any sexual sides from the drug
[/quote]

Start a new thread. You’ll get more feedback.

[quote]2thepain wrote:
I have spent the last month planning a bulk cycle to be ran in Nov. I have all gear in place but thought I would run it all by the T-Nation members for any additional comments or suggestions. Goal=build mass/strength.

Week 1-12: 1000mg Test E
Week 1-10: 400mg Tren E
Week 1-6: 50mg/day Dbol
Week 1-12: Adex 1mg/day
Week 1-12: HCG 250iu e3rd day
Week 12-18: test taper
Week 13-18: IGF-40mcg/day
Week 13-18: pegMGF-200mcg/e3rd day
I have nolv on hand just in case.

Supplements will include; B-6, Fish oil, Milk Thistle, Multi V, and vit E.
Calories will be at 5600, Protein 425/day
If anyone sees a way to improve on this cycle please let me know. [/quote]

  1. Your tren is dosed to low for the amount of test you are taking. It needs to be around 600-700mg/week.

  2. You don’t need to stop the tren early, as it is the same ester as the test. If you were running deca, that would be fine, but why stop the tren early if you don’t need to?

  3. Adex looks a little high. But at your dosage, it may not be that bad of an idea.

  4. You don’t need the HCG for the entire cycle. If you have to use it - start it in the last 2 weeks of the cycle.

  5. If you can, get some prop for the taper.

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[quote]bushidobadboy wrote:
If you really want to get funky with the peptides, why not use some GHRP-6? At the very least, it will ramp up your appetite no end. At least, it did with me.

Bushy[/quote]

How do you dose it, bushy? I have several vials in my freezer, but have been unable to find a decent protocol.

[quote]rainjack wrote:

  1. Your tren is dosed to low for the amount of test you are taking. It needs to be around 600-700mg/week.

  2. You don’t need to stop the tren early, as it is the same ester as the test. If you were running deca, that would be fine, but why stop the tren early if you don’t need to?

  3. Adex looks a little high. But at your dosage, it may not be that bad of an idea.

  4. You don’t need the HCG for the entire cycle. If you have to use it - start it in the last 2 weeks of the cycle.

  5. If you can, get some prop for the taper. [/quote]

He NEEDS 600-700mg of Tren? I’ll agree that it should be a little higher, but not a set number.

Using hcg for the last two weeks is foolish, I know you don’t like it, but if it works then why would you wait? Does it interfew with gains or would it be for convienence sake? You tend to state everything as fact and gospel, without stating or admiting opinion unless confronted.

True he doesn’t “NEED” it, but why use it the last two weeks then if he doesn’t, why not the last 4 or 3 or whatever. Good thing to use in my opinion through the whole cycle.

Why would you want Prop for the taper, commonily suggested by many, but doesn’t make sense TO ME. Many switch to Prop to control the clearance date, but tapering with one of the shortest esters seems backwards to me, please explain as I would think that one would want frequent long-ester doses for a slow/steady decline and not the steep decline with prop.

This is a question and not a saying you and everyone else is wrong sort of thing.

[quote]TheBeat wrote:
He NEEDS 600-700mg of Tren? I’ll agree that it should be a little higher, but not a set number.[/quote]

Not a set number? WTF does that even mean? If you read around - most people suggest running tren at 60% - 75% of test. He’s is at gram of test - I’ll leave it to you to do the math.

It is a waste of money to use it through out the cycle. Do you have any proof that using it for the last two weeks is not foolish? Or is that opinion?

I have a news flash for you here, kiddo - everything wrt to AAS is opinion. Unless you can copy/paste some significant AAS studies done on human males recently, all we have in this comnmunity is varying opinions, and anecdotal proof.

I think your opinion is wrong. Most vets will tell you to hold off on the hcg until the end of a cycle. It’s not like I am pulling stuff out of my ass.

Why would you want long estered doses when you are coming off? Think about it. Shorter esters means a quicker recovery of the HTPA. You really need to gain and understanding of the subject matter before you start jumping on my ass about something I happen to know a little bit about.

[quote]This is a question and not a saying you and everyone else is wrong sort of thing.
[/quote]

You need to show more respect because it sounds exactly like you are trying to let everyone know just how smart you are.

My 5600 calories may seem low for a bulking cycle but I have been stable at 228-230 all summer off of 3800 calories. I spend a lot of time behind a desk now, so I have been able to cut back a little in the eating.

The reason I am running 1 mg/day adex is because I am using a research chemical. I have heard that research chemicals should be ran at a slightly higher dosage. Is this not the case? RJ can probably answer this question for me.

I was considering getting more tren, the reason I cut it short is because that was all the Tren E I could get. My supplier only has Tren A left. I could get more Tren A but don’t think that mixing the two would work well. Could I just run the tren E until gone and make a complete switch to Tren A, of course adjusting my injection fequency?

I will also taper off of the adex going into the test taper, probably three weeks at .75,.5, and .25mg.

Bushy- I am just now running my first course of IGF/pegMGF so my experience is little and gaining slowly. Your dosing protocol for the 2 week IGF followed by 1 week MGF makes good sense to me. I will be running one more IGF/pegMGF cycle before I start this bulking cycle. I will use this protocol and see if I notice a definite difference. I am also interested in the GHRP-6 protocol, I wouldn’t mind getting a little “funky” with the peptides.

[quote]TheBeat wrote:

He NEEDS 600-700mg of Tren? I’ll agree that it should be a little higher, but not a set number.

Why would you want Prop for the taper, commonily suggested by many, but doesn’t make sense TO ME. Many switch to Prop to control the clearance date, but tapering with one of the shortest esters seems backwards to me, please explain as I would think that one would want frequent long-ester doses for a slow/steady decline and not the steep decline with prop.
[/quote]

The tren would work just fine at 400mg/wk. It’s not like he won’t have an effect because of the high amount of testosterone. It is faulty logic and physiologically it just doesn’t work that way.

Plus as Bushy said, over that amount and progesterone and other sides sides might become an issue. I know many people who have done 37.5mg/day with over a gram of other gear and definitely “felt” it.

Test prop would be a good idea to use while the enanthate tapered off so that test levels remainded high until all test is stopped and PCT starts. If we’re talking a classic test taper P22 style then there is no real benefit of using propionate for the taper.

Given the length of the tapering period enanthate would be just fine to use. If you wanted to taper more quickly then prop would be better, but that also defeats the purpose of the taper.

I’ve got no experience with MGF, but I’ve read about cycling it with IGF-1 as Bushy said. Bushy seems experienced and knowledgeable about peptides.

I also don’t use HCG as I’m on HRT, so no help there either.

[quote]Schwarzenegger wrote:
The tren would work just fine at 400mg/wk. It’s not like he won’t have an effect because of the high amount of testosterone. It is faulty logic and physiologically it just doesn’t work that way.
[/quote]

It does work that way. At least in cattle, and from my own experience.

I’m not going to get in a pissing match with everyone over the proper dosage of tren. I know what works for me, and others. The ratios keep everything balanced. The ratios work.

He is on 1mg/day of adex, and is taking b6. Very little risk of progesterone build up - which can only turn to tren gyno if estrogen is not controlled. Read what LLewellyn has to say on the issue. If the guy is going to be on this much gear - he must not have a problem with gyno.

How can you be sure tren is doing anything if you are on a gram of test, and barely over 250mg of tren?

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[quote]rainjack wrote:

  1. Your tren is dosed to low for the amount of test you are taking. It needs to be around 600-700mg/week. [/quote

I was thinking of adding more tren but my supplier was out of Tren E. That is why I cut the tren a little short. I can get more Tren A, but am unsure if it is wise to switch esters in the middle of a cycle.

[quote]Schwarzenegger wrote:

You’re my weight and use about the same doses I would/do for a moderate cycle. I eat about 6000 cal/day to maintain 235 though. I like it though, but I like tren.

I will be bumping my tren up to 600mg/week as many have said it would help. As far as my low calorie intake, I have a new desk job that is keeping my calorie intake at a lower range. My weight has been steady on about 3800 calories/day, so I think 5600 should work well, if not I can make adjustments mid cycle. Years ago I can remember eating 7000-8000 a day just to get to 220lbs. People thought I was insane.

[quote]bushidobadboy wrote:
rainjack wrote:
How can you be sure tren is doing anything if you are on a gram of test, and barely over 250mg of tren?

Well according to Lewellyns ref. book, tren has 5 times the anabolic/androgenic strength of test, so you’d still notice the effect surely?

I thought the ratio of test:tren was purely to do with sexual sides and nothing else…
Bushy[/quote]

I know cattle implants are dosed at a 1:1 ratio. And they don’t really care about sexual sides.

Cattlemen will not give fina only at all.

It has to do with the repartitioning properties of the tren.

I’m sure bathing the tren in test reduces the sexual sides as well.

Like I said - it’s all opinion. I gave mine and you have yours. I guess the OP has a plethera of varied opinions to choose from.