T Nation

What Happens with No PCT?

I’ve red a lot about what needs to be done for PCT. But does anybody know what happens if you just stop your T-Enth cycle after 8 weeks with no PCT at all ?
I’m just curious how long it will take for the body to start production again…

Find out and let us know :wink:

To answer your question:

it all depends on what happens to your natural test. I’ve been told that a cycle as short as 6 weeks (of injections - blood levels are up above natural output for 8 full weeks at 500+ mg /week) of test enth may not lead to shutdown. 8 weeks of injections may lead to shutdown. From anecdotal reports, the level of natural test shutdown is variant from person to person.

It’d be dumb not to run some PCT though, whether it be Nolva or clomid 2-3 weeks after last inject.

[quote]BulletproofTiger wrote:

it all depends on what happens to your natural test. I’ve been told that a cycle as short as 6 weeks (of injections - blood levels are up above natural output for 8 full weeks at 500+ mg /week) of test enth may not lead to shutdown.[/quote]

You were lied to. +2 weeks and you are shutdown.

OP
Your balls spontaneously combust if you don’t do some sort of PCT.

No one knows the answer to your question. No one knows exactly what will happen in your body. You could do permanent damage or you could just delay the process of restarting your HPTA. Not something you want to find out.

[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:
BulletproofTiger wrote:

it all depends on what happens to your natural test. I’ve been told that a cycle as short as 6 weeks (of injections - blood levels are up above natural output for 8 full weeks at 500+ mg /week) of test enth may not lead to shutdown.

You were lied to. +2 weeks and you are shutdown.
[/quote]

I wasn’t clear. I meant “until the 8th week” or +2 weeks beyond week 6 (as you say)…

Using a half life calculation (which of course is not completely accurate), it takes 16-17 days is I remember correectly for blood concentration to be below 100mg… that’s the point at which I would recomend starting PCT Long story short, I’m sorry if it was not as clear as I intended. Thanks Bonez for ensuring the OP understood.

[quote]
OP
Your balls spontaneously combust if you don’t do some sort of PCT.

No one knows the answer to your question. No one knows exactly what will happen in your body. You could do permanent damage or you could just delay the process of restarting your HPTA. Not something you want to find out. [/quote]

X2


No PCT OP

[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:
BulletproofTiger wrote:

it all depends on what happens to your natural test. I’ve been told that a cycle as short as 6 weeks (of injections - blood levels are up above natural output for 8 full weeks at 500+ mg /week) of test enth may not lead to shutdown.

You were lied to. +2 weeks and you are shutdown.

OP
Your balls spontaneously combust if you don’t do some sort of PCT.

No one knows the answer to your question. No one knows exactly what will happen in your body. You could do permanent damage or you could just delay the process of restarting your HPTA. Not something you want to find out. [/quote]

[quote]BulletproofTiger wrote:
BONEZ217 wrote:
BulletproofTiger wrote:

it all depends on what happens to your natural test. I’ve been told that a cycle as short as 6 weeks (of injections - blood levels are up above natural output for 8 full weeks at 500+ mg /week) of test enth may not lead to shutdown.

You were lied to. +2 weeks and you are shutdown.

I wasn’t clear. I meant “until the 8th week” or +2 weeks beyond week 6 (as you say)…

Using a half life calculation (which of course is not completely accurate), it takes 16-17 days is I remember correectly for blood concentration to be below 100mg… that’s the point at which I would recomend starting PCT Long story short, I’m sorry if it was not as clear as I intended. Thanks Bonez for ensuring the OP understood.

OP
Your balls spontaneously combust if you don’t do some sort of PCT.

No one knows the answer to your question. No one knows exactly what will happen in your body. You could do permanent damage or you could just delay the process of restarting your HPTA. Not something you want to find out.

X2[/quote]

Actually when I said “+ 2 weeks and you are shutdown” I meant 2+. As in after two weeks you are fully suppressed.

[quote]Growing_Boy wrote:
No PCT OP

BONEZ217 wrote:
BulletproofTiger wrote:

it all depends on what happens to your natural test. I’ve been told that a cycle as short as 6 weeks (of injections - blood levels are up above natural output for 8 full weeks at 500+ mg /week) of test enth may not lead to shutdown.

You were lied to. +2 weeks and you are shutdown.

OP
Your balls spontaneously combust if you don’t do some sort of PCT.

No one knows the answer to your question. No one knows exactly what will happen in your body. You could do permanent damage or you could just delay the process of restarting your HPTA. Not something you want to find out.

[/quote]

haha that’s 3

you get the biggest boner of ur life

actually have done this long ago… ya i know save it chaps ha. but it was 500 per week 12 weeks and my production started actually fairly quickly now granted i was younger then im sure that had quite a bit to do with it but ive also never needed or at least never used HCG or anything of that type. also no arimidex

[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:
BulletproofTiger wrote:
BONEZ217 wrote:
BulletproofTiger wrote:

it all depends on what happens to your natural test. I’ve been told that a cycle as short as 6 weeks (of injections - blood levels are up above natural output for 8 full weeks at 500+ mg /week) of test enth may not lead to shutdown.

You were lied to. +2 weeks and you are shutdown.

I wasn’t clear. I meant “until the 8th week” or +2 weeks beyond week 6 (as you say)…

Using a half life calculation (which of course is not completely accurate), it takes 16-17 days is I remember correectly for blood concentration to be below 100mg… that’s the point at which I would recomend starting PCT Long story short, I’m sorry if it was not as clear as I intended. Thanks Bonez for ensuring the OP understood.

OP
Your balls spontaneously combust if you don’t do some sort of PCT.

No one knows the answer to your question. No one knows exactly what will happen in your body. You could do permanent damage or you could just delay the process of restarting your HPTA. Not something you want to find out.

X2

Actually when I said “+ 2 weeks and you are shutdown” I meant 2+. As in after two weeks you are fully suppressed. [/quote]

Oh, I see what you mean. You’re right, in that 2+ weeks is when the blood levels are down, and this is also the time when the effects of supression would be felt. I followed the concepts, but was missing the point. I think we all do that.

OP - Blood levels of the drug will be gone by the 2+ weeks, and you will feel the effects of supression at this time. Will it be total surpression? I dunno. Depends on the person. How long will the supression last? Again, it’s dependent on the individual. but for the sake of your gains, use some freakin SERM PCT, read Nolva or Clomid.

**Check the stickies at the top of the steroids tab… there’s one on PCT somewhere and there are also threads on SERMs and or Clomis/Nolva in there too.

[quote]BulletproofTiger wrote:
BONEZ217 wrote:
BulletproofTiger wrote:
BONEZ217 wrote:
BulletproofTiger wrote:

it all depends on what happens to your natural test. I’ve been told that a cycle as short as 6 weeks (of injections - blood levels are up above natural output for 8 full weeks at 500+ mg /week) of test enth may not lead to shutdown.

You were lied to. +2 weeks and you are shutdown.

I wasn’t clear. I meant “until the 8th week” or +2 weeks beyond week 6 (as you say)…

Using a half life calculation (which of course is not completely accurate), it takes 16-17 days is I remember correectly for blood concentration to be below 100mg… that’s the point at which I would recomend starting PCT Long story short, I’m sorry if it was not as clear as I intended. Thanks Bonez for ensuring the OP understood.

OP
Your balls spontaneously combust if you don’t do some sort of PCT.

No one knows the answer to your question. No one knows exactly what will happen in your body. You could do permanent damage or you could just delay the process of restarting your HPTA. Not something you want to find out.

X2

Actually when I said “+ 2 weeks and you are shutdown” I meant 2+. As in after two weeks you are fully suppressed.

Oh, I see what you mean. You’re right, in that 2+ weeks is when the blood levels are down, and this is also the time when the effects of supression would be felt. I followed the concepts, but was missing the point. I think we all do that.

OP - Blood levels of the drug will be gone by the 2+ weeks, and you will feel the effects of supression at this time. Will it be total surpression? I dunno. Depends on the person. How long will the supression last? Again, it’s dependent on the individual. but for the sake of your gains, use some freakin SERM PCT, read Nolva or Clomid.

**Check the stickies at the top of the steroids tab… there’s one on PCT somewhere and there are also threads on SERMs and or Clomis/Nolva in there too.[/quote]

I’m still not quite sure you understand. What BONEZ said was that going from “natural” to “on” for a mere 2 weeks will result in suppression of your natural T. This is not when the test E will be out of your system, this is when your natural test is GONE. In other words, by the end of week 2 of any given cycle your natural production of T is GONE, and even if you stop then you will have to spend time recovering. 2 weeks in is usually about the time people start “feeling” that the test E they’ve decided to run is finally in their system and doing its job.

The difference is the length and difficulty of recovery. In a 2 week cycle your sensitivity to LH is still high, and so recovery of natural test is quick and can be done without PCT as per Bill Roberts. After 6 weeks, this is not so. It may still be quicker than a 10-12 week cycle, but you will crash to some degree.

Your test will have been shutdown fully 100% by week 3, and isnt being produced as you were supplying it externally.
The estrogen that is in your body from the aromatization of the high dose testosterone will become the dominant hormone, leading to gynocomastia, reduced libido, motivation, depression.

The simple PCT of nolvadex will stimulate the HPTA to help “kick start” the bodies own production, you will likely still not feel great but a 6 weeker is not hard to recover from with SERM PCT.

Depending on the ester of the test you need to have a certain number of days or weeks off totally before PCT or you will be trying to stimulate your HPTA while there is ample test still suppressing your HPTA.

Kapeesh?

Brook

With test, the suppression of the testes (pituitary) will be by week 2 - full suppression (hypothalamus) will be at week 3.

Try to get a gain in 2 weeks on.

The closest to avoiding total suppression is BR 2/4 cycle… and this is often never attempted/done correctly as it uses alot of drugs and is difficult. ie. short acting drugs with high doses (IIRC HCG) for the two weeks and clomid and anavar for the 4 off IIRC.

Read about it in the mesomorphosis.com articles.

Brook

Over time I’ve known of a fair number of individuals that got away with this or similar things satisfactorily, a fair number that had a slump afterwards but not too awful (when only 8 weeks), and there was one case of the natural T remaining in the toilet for an extended period of time and the individual finally going to a doctor and getting put on HRT: thus never getting his natural T back.

Though I expect that most likely he could have, even at the time of having given up and going to the doctor, instead used a SERM and gotten natural production back. But he did not get in contact with me till after all this, and had been unaware that he could have done this.

So, short answer: it will vary with the individual.

sounds like PCT is highly recommended then…
Thx

Thanks Brook, Aragorn, and Bill. Kapeesh now :slight_smile: