T Nation

Westside / WS4SB for MMA?

Anyone worked out an MMA specific Westside / WW4SB template? What specific changes did you make?

Defranco had an article about this on his site. This routine is geared towards fighters.
It also has a sample diet.

http://defrancostraining.com/ask_joe/archives/ask_joe_03-09-05.htm#question02

I’ve thought about this before as well. I don’t think you would come up with anything resembling a typical Westside inspired powerlifting routine, but something 2 days a week like Defranco laid out or what Chad did with Hammer Down.

I know Louie Simmons trained Kevin Randleman for the 2004 Pride Grand Prix, and considering he uncorked the gorilla punch from hell on Mirko and almost paralyzed the greatest fighter ever, I’d say he done good. Did Louie ever write anything up about how Randleman trained? I saw an article about some barbell complex’s he had him do for conditioning, but nothing else. I’ve heard on different message boards that he squatted 600 pounds at westside.

Randelman is a beast. If that is true and he did squat 600, that wouldn’t surprise me at all. I knew Kevin trained with Mark Coleman’s camp, but I didn’t know he trained at Westside too.

Thanks for the link. im thinking bout a WS4SB w/out on Mon & Fri, & the HD: Endurance on the Wed. Start with a full body w/out WS4SB, or 1 upper & 1 lower workout?

[quote]Donut62 wrote:
I’ve thought about this before as well. I don’t think you would come up with anything resembling a typical Westside inspired powerlifting routine, but something 2 days a week like Defranco laid out or what Chad did with Hammer Down.[/quote]

How about something like this:

Day 1
DE Lower
Accessory Lower
ME Upper
Accessory Upper

Day 2
DE Upper
Accessory Upper
ME Lower
Accessory Lower

My advice is be careful with lower reps. It’s killer on your CNS and will overtrain you faster than anything else when combined with all of the other training.

Who cares if you can lift more weight if your fight training suffers? That’s why I’m going to stay above 5 reps from now on.

[quote]carter12 wrote:
My advice is be careful with lower reps. It’s killer on your CNS and will overtrain you faster than anything else when combined with all of the other training.

Who cares if you can lift more weight if your fight training suffers? That’s why I’m going to stay above 5 reps from now on. [/quote]

Interesting point. i was going to trial a bit of work with 3 x 3, so as not to build unusable mass.

It wouldn’t hurt to try, just monitor how you feel.

If you’re kind of new to the iron game, I don’t think it will hurt you as much because you won’t be lifting as much weight. But doing 3 x 3 with over 300 in the bench and 400 in the squat will wear you down eventually if it’s done with your other training.

Powerlifters and off season football players can get away with it because that’s really the only training they’re doing (I know, gpp and speed training for football players but that is less taxing on the CNS than sparring in Jiu Jitsu 3-5 x a week).

I trained with much weaker guys than me and they were having no problems with the low rep training while it was seriously running me down. That’s where volume becomes a factor.

Anyway give it a try, just watch how you feel.

For your interest & entertainment, this is my current schedule:

Mon - 6-7am Boxing
Mon - 12pm HD: Strength 1
Tues - 12pm HIIT Cardio
Tues - 6-8pm BJJ
Tues - 9-10pm Muay Thai
Wed - 6am HD: Endurance
Wed - 12pm TUF Cardio Challenge
Thur - 12pm HIIT Cardio
Thur - 6-8pm BJJ
Fri - 12pm HD: Strength 2
Fri - 6-7pm Boxing
Sat - 12-2pm BJJ

Id do more on Mon & Wed nights, but they’re nightschool nights… damn ambitions!

I found this in the archives, maybe it will help:

"There are a lot of variations for TUT training and I have also spoken to Louie Simmons regarding this method. I asked him about how he trained current Pride fighter, Kevin Randleman. Louie would have him perform a 10 minute round of a 205 lb barbell complex that worked like this:

  1. Power clean from ground x 1 rep

  2. hang clean x 1 rep

  3. hang clean and press or jerk x 1 rep

After the 3 rep complex above, Kevin rested 30 seconds and would keep repeating for 10 minutes."

Interesting stuff, imo

[quote]Hrastnik wrote:
I found this in the archives, maybe it will help:

"There are a lot of variations for TUT training and I have also spoken to Louie Simmons regarding this method. I asked him about how he trained current Pride fighter, Kevin Randleman. Louie would have him perform a 10 minute round of a 205 lb barbell complex that worked like this:

  1. Power clean from ground x 1 rep

  2. hang clean x 1 rep

  3. hang clean and press or jerk x 1 rep

After the 3 rep complex above, Kevin rested 30 seconds and would keep repeating for 10 minutes."

Interesting stuff, imo
[/quote]

Team Quest do very similar stuff ill post a workout of theirs up in a sec. for now heres GSPs regime. Maybe i should start a new thread just for this… enjoy:

weight training: he says he doesn’t train like a body builder caz he’s not a body builder, instead he trains more for cardio, strength and endurance…he does 4 sequences of 4 exercises superset with 10 reps each…he says he does this 1 - 2 times a week

sequence 1 - chest + back

bench press - 10 reps (he has his legs on the bench when performing the exercise

balance ball pushups (one leg on the ball, the other lifted off to the side - do 10 pushups total, alternate between what leg is supporting you each time)

incline chest fly - 10 reps

bent over barbell rows - 10 reps

**so, he does that circuit without resting between exercises, then he takes a 1 - 1/12 minute break and repeats the whole sequence 2 more time, so you’re doing it 3 times total

sequence 2 - legs

barbell squats - 10 reps (he goes parallel to a chair)

weighted lunges - 12 reps (6 lunges forward then 6 reverse lunges)

one legged hamstring curls on balance ball - 10 reps per leg (don’t alternate, just do one leg at a time)

jump squats - 10 reps

**no rest between exercises, but rest 1 - 1/2 minutes after the sequence then repeat 2 more times

sequence 3 - abs + back

not really sure what these are called, but it’s some sort of lower back or torso rotation lift…he does it on some machine i’ve never seen before, the machine pretty much has his legs held in behind him, and only his waist up is suspended in the air, parallel to the ground…anyways, he does 5 torso rotations clockwise, then 5 counter clockwise

bicycle crunches - 10 reps per side

bent over one arm row - 10 reps per arm

balance ball sit-ups - 10 reps (sitting on top of the ball, lean back to about a 35-45 degree angle, then bring yourself back to the sitting position)

**no rest between exercises, but rest 1 - 1/2 minutes after the sequence then repeat 2 more times

sequence 4 - shoulders + arms

seated dumbell press - 10 reps

military press - 10 reps (he lowers the barbell to his waist and kinda cleans it up to his shoulders before each rep)

barbell bicep curls - 10 reps

skull crushers - 10 reps

**no rest between exercises, but rest 1 - 1/2 minutes after the sequence then repeat 2 more times

and thats his weight training …onto sprint training

this one’s a lot more simple

warm up with a 5 minute jog

sprint 30 seconds - rest 90 seconds - repeat 3 times

sprint 20 seconds - rest 60 seconds - repeat 3 times

sprint 10 seconds - rest 30 seconds - repeat 3 times

that’s it…he also says that he does the sprinting just once or twice a week

[quote]sjfou wrote:
For your interest & entertainment, this is my current schedule:

Mon - 6-7am Boxing
Mon - 12pm HD: Strength 1
Tues - 12pm HIIT Cardio
Tues - 6-8pm BJJ
Tues - 9-10pm Muay Thai
Wed - 6am HD: Endurance
Wed - 12pm TUF Cardio Challenge
Thur - 12pm HIIT Cardio
Thur - 6-8pm BJJ
Fri - 12pm HD: Strength 2
Fri - 6-7pm Boxing
Sat - 12-2pm BJJ

Id do more on Mon & Wed nights, but they’re nightschool nights… damn ambitions![/quote]

That’s a crazy schedule…you work out three times on Tuesday, lasting till 10 p.m. then return to the gym at 6 a.m. Wednesday for an HD: Endurance workout? Man, you must have a great recovery system, there’s no way I could do that.

I’m curious as to what the TUF Cardio Challenge is?

[quote]sjfou wrote:
Hrastnik wrote:
I found this in the archives, maybe it will help:

"There are a lot of variations for TUT training and I have also spoken to Louie Simmons regarding this method. I asked him about how he trained current Pride fighter, Kevin Randleman. Louie would have him perform a 10 minute round of a 205 lb barbell complex that worked like this:

  1. Power clean from ground x 1 rep

  2. hang clean x 1 rep

  3. hang clean and press or jerk x 1 rep

After the 3 rep complex above, Kevin rested 30 seconds and would keep repeating for 10 minutes."

Interesting stuff, imo

Team Quest do very similar stuff ill post a workout of theirs up in a sec. for now heres GSPs regime. Maybe i should start a new thread just for this… enjoy:

weight training: he says he doesn’t train like a body builder caz he’s not a body builder, instead he trains more for cardio, strength and endurance…he does 4 sequences of 4 exercises superset with 10 reps each…he says he does this 1 - 2 times a week

sequence 1 - chest + back

bench press - 10 reps (he has his legs on the bench when performing the exercise

balance ball pushups (one leg on the ball, the other lifted off to the side - do 10 pushups total, alternate between what leg is supporting you each time)

incline chest fly - 10 reps

bent over barbell rows - 10 reps

**so, he does that circuit without resting between exercises, then he takes a 1 - 1/12 minute break and repeats the whole sequence 2 more time, so you’re doing it 3 times total

sequence 2 - legs

barbell squats - 10 reps (he goes parallel to a chair)

weighted lunges - 12 reps (6 lunges forward then 6 reverse lunges)

one legged hamstring curls on balance ball - 10 reps per leg (don’t alternate, just do one leg at a time)

jump squats - 10 reps

**no rest between exercises, but rest 1 - 1/2 minutes after the sequence then repeat 2 more times

sequence 3 - abs + back

not really sure what these are called, but it’s some sort of lower back or torso rotation lift…he does it on some machine i’ve never seen before, the machine pretty much has his legs held in behind him, and only his waist up is suspended in the air, parallel to the ground…anyways, he does 5 torso rotations clockwise, then 5 counter clockwise

bicycle crunches - 10 reps per side

bent over one arm row - 10 reps per arm

balance ball sit-ups - 10 reps (sitting on top of the ball, lean back to about a 35-45 degree angle, then bring yourself back to the sitting position)

**no rest between exercises, but rest 1 - 1/2 minutes after the sequence then repeat 2 more times

sequence 4 - shoulders + arms

seated dumbell press - 10 reps

military press - 10 reps (he lowers the barbell to his waist and kinda cleans it up to his shoulders before each rep)

barbell bicep curls - 10 reps

skull crushers - 10 reps

**no rest between exercises, but rest 1 - 1/2 minutes after the sequence then repeat 2 more times

and thats his weight training …onto sprint training

this one’s a lot more simple

warm up with a 5 minute jog

sprint 30 seconds - rest 90 seconds - repeat 3 times

sprint 20 seconds - rest 60 seconds - repeat 3 times

sprint 10 seconds - rest 30 seconds - repeat 3 times

that’s it…he also says that he does the sprinting just once or twice a week [/quote]

I’d still like to see T-Nation do a profile on GSP, especailly since he’s sponsored by Spike.

[quote]Djwlfpack wrote:
That’s a crazy schedule…you work out three times on Tuesday, lasting till 10 p.m. then return to the gym at 6 a.m. Wednesday for an HD: Endurance workout? Man, you must have a great recovery system, there’s no way I could do that.

I’m curious as to what the TUF Cardio Challenge is?[/quote]

lol - no, i dont, i just what i need to do. The gym i go to has a squash centre. For me throw a med ball around on the courts i have to do it before anyone else gets there!

TUF 1 Cardio challenge is:
On a treadmill:

5mins @ 5mph
5mins @ 6mph
5mins @ 7mph
5mins @ 8mph
5mins @ 9mph
5mins @ 10mph

no rest in between.

The TQ workout i was talkin about is as follows:

6 sets, 8 reps with 60 seconds rest in between: 1. Bent Over Row
2. Upright Row
3. Military Press
4. Good Morning
5. Split Squat Left (lunges)
6. Split Squat Right (lunges)
7. Squat & Push Press (tighten stance for push-press; widen for squat)
8. Straight Legged Deadlift

start with only the bar (45 Lbs) & aim to work up to 95lbs

And how many reps or seconds of working time for each set?

[quote]Classy_Cojones wrote:
And how many reps or seconds of working time for each set?[/quote]

damn, ill chase it up for you. Heres another series of complexes from Alwyn Cosgrove:

Complex One

* Deadlift - 6 reps
* Romanian Deadlift - 6 reps
* Bent Over Row - 6 reps
* Power Clean - 6 reps
* Front Squat - 6 reps
* Push Press - 6 reps
* Back Squat - 6 reps
* Good Morning - 6 reps

Complex Two

* Snatch Grip Deadlift - 6 reps
* Snatch Pull - 6 reps
* Upright Row - 6 reps
* Power Snatch - 6 reps
* Reverse Lunge - 6 reps each leg
* Push Jerk - 6 reps
* Jump Squat - 6 reps

That’s 8 exercises at 6 reps each. Each rep is performed with good control and flows directly into the next exercise without rest. At about 2 seconds per rep, this complex should only take about 96 seconds. The key is to just keep the bar moving.

After each complex we rest for 90 seconds and repeat for four complexes.

The entire “interval training” program as described will take about twelve minutes.

* Week one: 4 circuits x 6 reps 90s rest
* Week two: 4 circuits x 6 reps 75s rest
* Week three: 4 circuits x 6 reps 60s rest
* Week four: 4 circuits x 6 reps 45s rest
* Week five: 5 circuits x 6 reps 90s rest
* Week six: 5 circuits x 6 reps 75s rest, etc.

CC - 8 reps & ive edited above to read it

[quote]sjfou wrote:
Djwlfpack wrote:
That’s a crazy schedule…you work out three times on Tuesday, lasting till 10 p.m. then return to the gym at 6 a.m. Wednesday for an HD: Endurance workout? Man, you must have a great recovery system, there’s no way I could do that.

I’m curious as to what the TUF Cardio Challenge is?

lol - no, i dont, i just what i need to do. The gym i go to has a squash centre. For me throw a med ball around on the courts i have to do it before anyone else gets there!

TUF 1 Cardio challenge is:
On a treadmill:

5mins @ 5mph
5mins @ 6mph
5mins @ 7mph
5mins @ 8mph
5mins @ 9mph
5mins @ 10mph

no rest in between.

The TQ workout i was talkin about is as follows:

6 sets, 8 reps with 60 seconds rest in between: 1. Bent Over Row
2. Upright Row
3. Military Press
4. Good Morning
5. Split Squat Left (lunges)
6. Split Squat Right (lunges)
7. Squat & Push Press (tighten stance for push-press; widen for squat)
8. Straight Legged Deadlift

start with only the bar (45 Lbs) & aim to work up to 95lbs
[/quote]

I hear you about getting into the racquetball/squash courts…I sometimes call and make a reservation. It’s funny everytime I go in there to do the medicine ball exercises and I start throwing the ball around against the wall, people stop and stare. Not sure why, I guess b/c it sounds louder than a racquetball and they’re probably wondering what the heck I’m doing because you know, you’re not allowed to do untraditional workouts or anything…I like doing things that work that no one else thinks to do.

i think the loud thuds & my attempts not to throw up make it obvious im not in training for handball at the Beijing olympics! The cleaners always stick their head in… lol