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Westside Training

For those who didn’t read my last post, I decided on competing soon in powerlifting at the 220 lb weight class. My squat is 355, bench is 245, deadlift is 405. I’m pretty sure I want to use the Westside method to continue to improve upon these numbers as I get ready for a meet. However, I’m a little confused about some of the methodology. I was thinking Sunday would be my Max Effort squat/deadlift day, Tuesday my Max Effort bench, Thursday my dynamic squat/deadlift, Friday my dynamic bench. But I don’t understand how I can do Max Effort on both squat and deadlift the same day. Do I rotate every three weeks? Westside articles have mentioned about that. And what do I rotate the bench with on Max Effort bench days? What accessory work should be added? As you can see, I have a lot of questions. Any and all help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks a lot

Given your present strength levels, I think you will profit far more from a more traditional periodization model of strength training than the more advanced conjugated periodization model of the WSB method. Because the Westside model works well for advanced powerlifters does not necessarily mean that it works well for someone just beginning. Use the right tool at the right time. IMHO, now is not the time for you to use a more advanced program.

Matthew A. Levy
Los Angeles Lifting Club

There is actually quite a wide variety of lifts that are used in the Westside system for the different lifts. Go to www.elitefts.com and take a look (under the articles section) and you’ll see the vast number of exercises that they use.

[quote]Checkmate wrote:
Given your present strength levels, I think you will profit far more from a more traditional periodization model of strength trainingLos Angeles Lifting Club
[/quote]

What would you mean by this? I’ve been doing a lot of 5x4 work, 8x3, some maxing out. Should I just stick with that stuff, keep rotating it, throw in some speed work? Thanks for the help.

And BigRedMachine, I didn’t really understand elitefts, it’s just not as well written. What exercises do they talk about? Thanks again

go to www.elitefts.com. Click on the “articles” link. Now on the left hand side(the far left frame) there will be a link called “elite fts articles”. Click on it and scroll to the bottem. You will see articles entitled “max effort squat exercises, max effort bench exercises, deadlift exercises, etc…” Click one and start reading.

Laxxone:

What I meant was that a more traditional linear periodization model is more appropriate for beginner through intermediate lifters (which, according to the numbers you posted at a body weight of 220 would be you). In order to get the most out of more advanced forms of periodization (which the WBC method is an but one of many examples of) you should be far more advanced. Stick to the basics early on. Do not run before you learn to walk. Do not walk before you learn to stand.

Matthew A. Levy
Los Angeles Lifting Club

[quote]Laxxone wrote:
But I don’t understand how I can do Max Effort on both squat and deadlift the same day. Do I rotate every three weeks? Westside articles have mentioned about that. And what do I rotate the bench with on Max Effort bench days? What accessory work should be added? As you can see, I have a lot of questions. Any and all help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks a lot[/quote]

You would not do a max squat or a max deadlift in the same session, but special exercises designed to mimic and bring up weak points in the main powerlifts. The same muscles you use to squat are pretty much the same muscle you use on a DL. I would check the article section at Elitefts. There are two articles one lists all the ME Squat/DL movements, and the other lists all the ME bench movements. ME movement can be trained anywhere from a 5RM to a 1RM. Most if not all accessory work is done in the 8-15 rep range for 3-5 sets.

I rotate my ME movements every week. My DE movements stay the same, but the percentages change along with the accommodated resistance every three weeks. Here is a sample DE squat/ DL cycle:

  1. Box Squat
    With chains or straight weight;
    Week 1 10x2 @ 50% of 1 rep max
    Week 2 10x2 @ 55%
    Week 3 8x3 @60%

With bands;
Week 1 8x2 @47%
Week 2 8x2 @50%
Week 3 8x2 @53%

  1. Deadlift 6-10x1 with 60% of your DL 1RM

  2. Low back movement

4.Ab movement

For bench I would rotate my ME exercises every week or two as well. 1,2,3,4,5 board presses, Incline presses, decline presses, and Rack lockouts. Keep a training log and strive to break PRs every week with each new exercise. It’s good to hit PRs every week, but as long as you give it your maximum effort that is all that counts. The percentages for DE bench are similar to the ones I typed above. DE benches are done with a full ROM and are done as sets of three reps, unlike squats which are done in sets of two. Both DE squat and DE bench are done as fast as possible while maintaining control and keeping perfect form.

Follow your speed benches and ME bench movements with tris, lats and upper back or shoulders. I would definitely recommend going over to EliteFTS.com and read all the articles. I would also recommend you buy the EFS dynamic squat manual and the EFS Training Templates. I think they are giving the Training templates manual away with all orders. Hopefully I didn’t confuse you more than you already are. If I can help anymore let me know.

Joe

[quote]Checkmate wrote:
Laxxone:

What I meant was that a more traditional linear periodization model is more appropriate for beginner through intermediate lifters (which, according to the numbers you posted at a body weight of 220 would be you). In order to get the most out of more advanced forms of periodization (which the WBC method is an but one of many examples of) you should be far more advanced. Stick to the basics early on. Do not run before you learn to walk. Do not walk before you learn to stand.

Matthew A. Levy
Los Angeles Lifting Club[/quote]

I like ‘Periodization Training for Sports’ by Bompa. It is a great read to learn about periodization. It is basic enough to be beneficial in seting up a beginner routine but also goes into depth on periodization models.

[quote]Laxxone wrote:
…But I don’t understand how I can do Max Effort on both squat and deadlift the same day. Do I rotate every three weeks? Westside articles have mentioned about that. And what do I rotate the bench with on Max Effort bench days? …[/quote]

You’re getting a little confused by the terms. ME- SQ/DL means you do one maximum (1-3 RM) movement to strengthen your Squat and/or DL. This movement is not actually a competition squat or DL but some variation of them (conjugate method). Same goes for the ME-bench. Perform a movement that strengthens the bench but not an actual competition bench press.

Thanks a lot for the help everyone. Brian Whiddon, is there anywhere I can get the information in Bompa’s book without buying it? I’m a broke college kid and honestly can’t afford a $20 book. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

[quote]Laxxone wrote:
Thanks a lot for the help everyone. Brian Whiddon, is there anywhere I can get the information in Bompa’s book without buying it? I’m a broke college kid and honestly can’t afford a $20 book. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.[/quote]

Ask and yea shall receive. PM me your address. I’ll mail you my copy. You can give it back when you are done.

Brian

[quote]I like ‘Periodization Training for Sports’ by Bompa. It is a great read to learn about periodization. It is basic enough to be beneficial in seting up a beginner routine but also goes into depth on periodization models.

[/quote]

An exellent choice of books and one of my favorites. I do not agree with everything that Bompa writes, but on the whole there are very few books on periodization as useful and as full of information as “Periodization Training for Sports”.

Matthew A. Levy
Los Angeles Lifting Club

[quote]Laxxone wrote:
I’m a broke college kid and honestly can’t afford a $20 book.[/quote]

heh, yeah we college kids gotta prioritize, u could get a 30 of keystone for $20

check out the 8 Keys Article, answers every question you have.

Here’s the links to Dave Tate’s 8 Keys series of articles:

http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do?id=459489

http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do?id=459486

http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do?id=459484

http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do?id=459483

Hope that helps!

awesome gesture BW!

Thanks a lot for the help everyone, especially Brian. Thanks also for helping keep me humble. I was so proud of finally breaking 1000 (raw, natural) that I was getting a little full of myself. But hey, some little girl somewhere is warming up with my max, right?

You might also want to read the “Periodization Bible” by Dave Tate as well. Extremely helpful. I don’t know that I agree with the fact that based on your numbers you can’t train WS. All of our members train WS regardless of their total and level of experience. They ease into it and work on form for the first few weeks. Once they have that dialed in then they go with the WS template full speed.

We rotate or MES days between a GM, DL, and squat and do some variation of each every three weeks. Then accessory work is done to focus on the weaknesses. I usually do things such as dimels, rack pulls, anderson squats, arched back GMs, ultra low box squats…etc. Then I always finish with reverse hypers and an ab movement.

Because I am so new to this type of training I keep it pretty simple and have had tremendous results. I have put over 200lbs on my squat, 150lbs on my bench and aboput 200lbs on my DL, and it has only been a year.

Best of luck with it!

~Ericka

I was just going through the archives on the westside website and found these excerpts written by Louie Simmons:

"I hear all the time that Westside training is for the advanced and that only top 10 lifters can do the training that is required at Westside. It is true that our training is advanced, but it is also great for beginners. Why start out wrong, or start with a program that will yield only small results? "

“There is no reason that a beginner should not start with an advanced system. Everyone sends his son to Bobby Knight’s basketball camp. I’ve seen lots of lifters come and go. Don’t be one of those. Start right and you won’t incur injuries or fail to make progress and be forced to stop lifting”

[quote]Ericka wrote:
You might also want to read the “Periodization Bible” by Dave Tate as well. Extremely helpful. I don’t know that I agree with the fact that based on your numbers you can’t train WS. All of our members train WS regardless of their total and level of experience. They ease into it and work on form for the first few weeks. Once they have that dialed in then they go with the WS template full speed.

We rotate or MES days between a GM, DL, and squat and do some variation of each every three weeks. Then accessory work is done to focus on the weaknesses. I usually do things such as dimels, rack pulls, anderson squats, arched back GMs, ultra low box squats…etc. Then I always finish with reverse hypers and an ab movement.

Because I am so new to this type of training I keep it pretty simple and have had tremendous results. I have put over 200lbs on my squat, 150lbs on my bench and aboput 200lbs on my DL, and it has only been a year.

Best of luck with it!

~Ericka[/quote]

I couldn’t agree more Erika. I have a basement gym here in Atlanta (not nearly as decked out as Diablo or WSB) but we all train WSB style regardless of where we are at in our program. Sure, we may start out with a GPP phase, or I have some people who may work a powerclean in here or there and we do a lot of kettlebell stuff too. EVERYONE gains almost immediately following the WSB template. In about 10 months of WSB-style training I have put 175lbs on my squat, 85lbs on my bench, and 110lbs on my deadlift, and am going into my first PL meet on Sunday. I have no doubt in my mind a beginner SHOULD start with the basic WSB-style workout.

Good stuff…

-Scott