T Nation

Westside and Wrestling

I am going to be wrestling Tuesday and Thursday this month and I typically use a Westside template, so I am going to use an Upper-Lower-Whole Body (M-W-F) template instead of the typical Upper-Lower twice a week. Monday will be ME Lower and Wednesday ME Upper, and Friday a whole body DE day along with some assistance work. What do you guys think?

Looks good as long as you have enough in the tank to roll. If you feel to gassed maybe cut back. Whats the goal though do you supplement weights to your wrestling or wrestle for cardio?

Just make sure you are doing enough conditioning. Anytime I use a PL protocol I get strong as hell but it leaves my stamina in the shitter. If I were you I’d use WSFSB2. That way you are getting all the benefits of Westside but you are still getting a GPP day and a few days of running. The running portion is designed for football conditioning so you can modify that to your needs for wrestling. Just make sure you are doing some sort of anaerobic type running on those days. You’ll need it on the mat.

[quote]NHB 1 wrote:
Looks good as long as you have enough in the tank to roll. If you feel to gassed maybe cut back. Whats the goal though do you supplement weights to your wrestling or wrestle for cardio?[/quote]

My lifting supplements my wrestling.

[quote]Peeott wrote:
Just make sure you are doing enough conditioning. Anytime I use a PL protocol I get strong as hell but it leaves my stamina in the shitter. If I were you I’d use WSFSB2. That way you are getting all the benefits of Westside but you are still getting a GPP day and a few days of running. The running portion is designed for football conditioning so you can modify that to your needs for wrestling. Just make sure you are doing some sort of anaerobic type running on those days. You’ll need it on the mat.[/quote]

I do a basic Westside template but add some hill sprints at the end of my leg day (great hill by my house) and jump-roping supersetted with bodyweight exercises or a Crossfit style bodyweight workout at the end of upper body days for anaerobic conditoning.

[quote]Peeott wrote:
Just make sure you are doing enough conditioning. Anytime I use a PL protocol I get strong as hell but it leaves my stamina in the shitter. If I were you I’d use WSFSB2. That way you are getting all the benefits of Westside but you are still getting a GPP day and a few days of running. The running portion is designed for football conditioning so you can modify that to your needs for wrestling. Just make sure you are doing some sort of anaerobic type running on those days. You’ll need it on the mat.[/quote]

Wrestling IS conditioning and GPP.
KA, you know how to modify it already. Lots of pulling, grip work, etc.
Are you competeing in freestyle and greco this season? States or Nationals?

The workout looks fine. Like wressler 125 said, work on natural movements (sandbag haul, rope climbs, shadow wrestling), but in the midst of all the strength, and conditioning training, don’t forget about power training. (snatches, cleans, jerk press) Many wrestlers make the mistake of opting for strength and forget about power.

[quote]wressler125 wrote:
Peeott wrote:
Just make sure you are doing enough conditioning. Anytime I use a PL protocol I get strong as hell but it leaves my stamina in the shitter. If I were you I’d use WSFSB2. That way you are getting all the benefits of Westside but you are still getting a GPP day and a few days of running. The running portion is designed for football conditioning so you can modify that to your needs for wrestling. Just make sure you are doing some sort of anaerobic type running on those days. You’ll need it on the mat.

Wrestling IS conditioning and GPP.
KA, you know how to modify it already. Lots of pulling, grip work, etc.
Are you competeing in freestyle and greco this season? States or Nationals?[/quote]

Right, all sports are conditioning and GPP. So would you say we dont need to condition for sports because playing the sport itself is conditioning? I think when he competes against guys who have been running hills and bleachers in addition to wrestling he’ll be glad he took the time to do extra conditioning and GPP. Would you tell a boxer or MMA fighter that since fighting IS conditioning that they dont need to condition outside of the ring?

[quote]wressler125 wrote:
Peeott wrote:
Just make sure you are doing enough conditioning. Anytime I use a PL protocol I get strong as hell but it leaves my stamina in the shitter. If I were you I’d use WSFSB2. That way you are getting all the benefits of Westside but you are still getting a GPP day and a few days of running. The running portion is designed for football conditioning so you can modify that to your needs for wrestling. Just make sure you are doing some sort of anaerobic type running on those days. You’ll need it on the mat.

Wrestling IS conditioning and GPP.
KA, you know how to modify it already. Lots of pulling, grip work, etc.
Are you competeing in freestyle and greco this season? States or Nationals?[/quote]

I am not doing any Freestyle or Greco, but I really want to go to States this year. I would have to be the County Champion to go States, and the 2x county champion at my weight class for this season just graduated so I intend to fill his shoes. I was 3rd in my county this year at 160 as a freshmen.

I modify Westside by adding more unilateral work, grip work, and more pulling. I also do more quad work than traditional Westside.

[quote]Ohhhh01 wrote:
The workout looks fine. Like wressler 125 said, work on natural movements (sandbag haul, rope climbs, shadow wrestling), but in the midst of all the strength, and conditioning training, don’t forget about power training. (snatches, cleans, jerk press) Many wrestlers make the mistake of opting for strength and forget about power.[/quote]

I feel like power is already worked enough actually practicing wrestling to warrant a significant amount of time dedicated to it off the mat. A penetration step is like an explosive lunge, a double-leg like a speed deadlift, etc., although I do the DE day a la Westside. Although wrestling doesn’t really develop max strength on the mat it sure as hell helps on the mat.

Conditioning is not something I tend to develop easy, so in my particular case I think extra work off the mat is warranted.

[quote]KombatAthlete wrote:
Ohhhh01 wrote:
The workout looks fine. Like wressler 125 said, work on natural movements (sandbag haul, rope climbs, shadow wrestling), but in the midst of all the strength, and conditioning training, don’t forget about power training. (snatches, cleans, jerk press) Many wrestlers make the mistake of opting for strength and forget about power.

I feel like power is already worked enough actually practicing wrestling to warrant a significant amount of time dedicated to it off the mat. A penetration step is like an explosive lunge, a double-leg like a speed deadlift, etc., although I do the DE day a la Westside. Although wrestling doesn’t really develop max strength on the mat it sure as hell helps on the mat.

Conditioning is not something I tend to develop easy, so in my particular case I think extra work off the mat is warranted.
[/quote]

Well, as someone who takes wrestling as well as powerlifting quite seriously, and has had experience with some of the best and worst coaches and practice partners in the country, I’ve found that when a training program doesn’t include some form of strength, and power conditioning, the body will come to a plateau.

Although focusing on form is essential, and conditioning is important, the truth is, if you run up against someone in state qualifiers who’s been in the gym, along with time on the mat, you’re going to notice.

Personally, from my perspective, lunges/penetration steps, even explosive ones have never proven to increase explosive power, and they sure as hell have never felt like cleans to me. You’re going to have to increase the stress levels on the body. It’s like football.

If you only squat 250 in the gym, how the hell are you expecting to move a 300 pound lineman? Or if you’ve only ever trained to change your level to get under 160 pounders, then that’s how you’re going to wrestle. Why not train like you normally get under 215 pounders?

It’s simple math. You don’t train for the exact amount of strength you’re going to need, you train above the expectation.

[quote]Ohhhh01 wrote:
KombatAthlete wrote:
Ohhhh01 wrote:
The workout looks fine. Like wressler 125 said, work on natural movements (sandbag haul, rope climbs, shadow wrestling), but in the midst of all the strength, and conditioning training, don’t forget about power training. (snatches, cleans, jerk press) Many wrestlers make the mistake of opting for strength and forget about power.

I feel like power is already worked enough actually practicing wrestling to warrant a significant amount of time dedicated to it off the mat. A penetration step is like an explosive lunge, a double-leg like a speed deadlift, etc., although I do the DE day a la Westside. Although wrestling doesn’t really develop max strength on the mat it sure as hell helps on the mat.

Conditioning is not something I tend to develop easy, so in my particular case I think extra work off the mat is warranted.

Well, as someone who takes wrestling as well as powerlifting quite seriously, and has had experience with some of the best and worst coaches and practice partners in the country, I’ve found that when a training program doesn’t include some form of strength, and power conditioning, the body will come to a plateau.

Although focusing on form is essential, and conditioning is important, the truth is, if you run up against someone in state qualifiers who’s been in the gym, along with time on the mat, you’re going to notice.

Personally, from my perspective, lunges/penetration steps, even explosive ones have never proven to increase explosive power, and they sure as hell have never felt like cleans to me. You’re going to have to increase the stress levels on the body. It’s like football.

If you only squat 250 in the gym, how the hell are you expecting to move a 300 pound lineman? Or if you’ve only ever trained to change your level to get under 160 pounders, then that’s how you’re going to wrestle. Why not train like you normally get under 215 pounders?

It’s simple math. You don’t train for the exact amount of strength you’re going to need, you train above the expectation. [/quote]

I have been focusing exclusively on developing strength and power for these past few months. It is partly for this reason I want to add in some more conditioning, as I wrestled in an off-season tournament and was gassed in the second period with 1.5 periods and lost to someone I could have beaten if I were in better shape.

I have increased my deadlift from an ugly 295 to a solid 350 and my upper body has gone up considerably.

I usually prioritize strength over power, reasoning that getting stronger at my level will improve both strength and power but not vice versa. The only power work I have been doing is the speed deadlifts on the lower DE day and the upper body speed exercise.

I’m using a Westside style template but am not wrestling this off season. That will probably come back and bite me in the ass this next season though. Anyway as endurance work, I drag a sled with moderate weight for a long distance about once every week.

I’ll also go push my brother’s jeep. I do sprints once a week but thats mostly for football. I was doing Oly style lifts and farmers walks 1 day a week for a while but then messed my back up.

I think all this right here is making me strong enough and giving me good endurance and stamina.

[quote]KombatAthlete wrote:
Ohhhh01 wrote:
KombatAthlete wrote:
Ohhhh01 wrote:
The workout looks fine. Like wressler 125 said, work on natural movements (sandbag haul, rope climbs, shadow wrestling), but in the midst of all the strength, and conditioning training, don’t forget about power training. (snatches, cleans, jerk press) Many wrestlers make the mistake of opting for strength and forget about power.

I feel like power is already worked enough actually practicing wrestling to warrant a significant amount of time dedicated to it off the mat. A penetration step is like an explosive lunge, a double-leg like a speed deadlift, etc., although I do the DE day a la Westside. Although wrestling doesn’t really develop max strength on the mat it sure as hell helps on the mat.

Conditioning is not something I tend to develop easy, so in my particular case I think extra work off the mat is warranted.

Well, as someone who takes wrestling as well as powerlifting quite seriously, and has had experience with some of the best and worst coaches and practice partners in the country, I’ve found that when a training program doesn’t include some form of strength, and power conditioning, the body will come to a plateau.

Although focusing on form is essential, and conditioning is important, the truth is, if you run up against someone in state qualifiers who’s been in the gym, along with time on the mat, you’re going to notice.

Personally, from my perspective, lunges/penetration steps, even explosive ones have never proven to increase explosive power, and they sure as hell have never felt like cleans to me. You’re going to have to increase the stress levels on the body. It’s like football.

If you only squat 250 in the gym, how the hell are you expecting to move a 300 pound lineman? Or if you’ve only ever trained to change your level to get under 160 pounders, then that’s how you’re going to wrestle. Why not train like you normally get under 215 pounders?

It’s simple math. You don’t train for the exact amount of strength you’re going to need, you train above the expectation.

I have been focusing exclusively on developing strength and power for these past few months. It is partly for this reason I want to add in some more conditioning, as I wrestled in an off-season tournament and was gassed in the second period with 1.5 periods and lost to someone I could have beaten if I were in better shape.

I have increased my deadlift from an ugly 295 to a solid 350 and my upper body has gone up considerably.

I usually prioritize strength over power, reasoning that getting stronger at my level will improve both strength and power but not vice versa. The only power work I have been doing is the speed deadlifts on the lower DE day and the upper body speed exercise.
[/quote]

Mind giving a few stats? Daily routine, nutrition, maxes,?

[quote]Peeott wrote:
wressler125 wrote:
Peeott wrote:
Just make sure you are doing enough conditioning. Anytime I use a PL protocol I get strong as hell but it leaves my stamina in the shitter. If I were you I’d use WSFSB2. That way you are getting all the benefits of Westside but you are still getting a GPP day and a few days of running. The running portion is designed for football conditioning so you can modify that to your needs for wrestling. Just make sure you are doing some sort of anaerobic type running on those days. You’ll need it on the mat.

Wrestling IS conditioning and GPP.
KA, you know how to modify it already. Lots of pulling, grip work, etc.
Are you competeing in freestyle and greco this season? States or Nationals?

Right, all sports are conditioning and GPP. So would you say we dont need to condition for sports because playing the sport itself is conditioning? I think when he competes against guys who have been running hills and bleachers in addition to wrestling he’ll be glad he took the time to do extra conditioning and GPP. Would you tell a boxer or MMA fighter that since fighting IS conditioning that they dont need to condition outside of the ring?[/quote]

No, but I also wouldn’t tell an out of season wrestler to focus on his conditioning when he’s 6 months out from any big competition. Out of season, the focus should be on building strenght and technique. It takes longer to build a strong strenght base than it does a conditioning base.

And btw, I AM a boxer and a MMA fighter. My wrestling season was 9 months long including nationals. When your training like this, you need to periodize your training a little better than “well you should do this”.