[quote]Ricochet wrote:
My duty requires a lot of my body; being athletic… quick, strong, enduring… overall being tough is truly a necessity in the environments I operate in.
My body is a machine and has adapted to many of the fuel sources I have provided it; some being pretty pathetic… with that said I am still in top condition and my body reflects that.[/quote]
What do you do?
[quote]gregron wrote:
[quote]Ricochet wrote:
My duty requires a lot of my body; being athletic… quick, strong, enduring… overall being tough is truly a necessity in the environments I operate in.
My body is a machine and has adapted to many of the fuel sources I have provided it; some being pretty pathetic… with that said I am still in top condition and my body reflects that.[/quote]
What do you do?[/quote]
Porn actor I guess. Maybe not the “quick” part though…but he said he needs to be enduring.
[quote]gregron wrote:
[quote]Professor X wrote:
Yes, this is crap. There are tons of athletes, especially football players, who don’t have the best diets but look better than most here.
[/quote]
you mean like this guy? lol he says he eats Mc Donalds every day.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
…and why Supersize Me was a pile of crap.[/quote]
Supersize Me was never going to work cause he was drinking super sized sodas ever day lol[/quote]
Exactly…but what gets me is the belief that he is so rare.
Dude, one of the guys I trained with in Florida was carrying about 20-30lbs more muscle than that guy and often ate a sleeve of cookies for lunch and then drank Muscle Milk as his only food intake for 3 meals. He stayed at what couldn’t have been much more than 10% body fat because he had full muscle separation even though his back was lagging.
GENETICS and lifting intensity are why I can live at Pizza Hut and still gain more muscle than fat and someone else may not.
That is the only reason these topics bother me. Most of what we hear on these forums is regurgitated ad/copy for the masses.
I am betting when Johnny Jackson is at his heaviest for powerlifting and no abs are visible, that his diet is NOT mostly chicken breasts and rice…not to support that much mass on a frame like that. It sounds good to high school kids who are afraid to eat, but it just isn’t what’s really going on.
The reality is most really big guys work harder in the gym than most people.
That’s just the truth.
Someone like that can eat shit the average guy not sweating with one 25lbs plate on a machine can’t.
[quote]gregron wrote:
[quote]Ricochet wrote:
My duty requires a lot of my body; being athletic… quick, strong, enduring… overall being tough is truly a necessity in the environments I operate in.
My body is a machine and has adapted to many of the fuel sources I have provided it; some being pretty pathetic… with that said I am still in top condition and my body reflects that.[/quote]
What do you do?[/quote]
High-Risk Close Protection… currently serving as a QRF Commander in Assholestan.
SuperSize Me was a pile of crap largely because he lied about his actual caloric intake. If you look at what he is consuming and what he told people his calorie intake was, you’ll realize it doesn’t add up. That’s why he adamantly refuses to release his food log after many requests. He would have to have eaten a lot more than 3 combo meals a day to reach the caloric intake he was telling people he was consuming.
But I guess you can’t have a movie if you only gain 5lb in a month.
[quote]Ricochet wrote:
[quote]gregron wrote:
[quote]Ricochet wrote:
My duty requires a lot of my body; being athletic… quick, strong, enduring… overall being tough is truly a necessity in the environments I operate in.
My body is a machine and has adapted to many of the fuel sources I have provided it; some being pretty pathetic… with that said I am still in top condition and my body reflects that.[/quote]
What do you do?[/quote]
High-Risk Close Protection… currently serving as a QRF Commander in Assholestan.[/quote]
so you’re doing PSD in Afghan? You’re in the Navy?
[quote]Professor X wrote:
Dude, one of the guys I trained with in Florida was carrying about 20-30lbs more muscle than that guy and often ate a sleeve of cookies for lunch and then drank Muscle Milk as his only food intake for 3 meals. He stayed at what couldn’t have been much more than 10% body fat because he had full muscle separation even though his back was lagging.
GENETICS and lifting intensity are why I can live at Pizza Hut and still gain more muscle than fat and someone else may not.
That is the only reason these topics bother me. Most of what we hear on these forums is regurgitated ad/copy for the masses.
I am betting when Johnny Jackson is at his heaviest for powerlifting and no abs are visible, that his diet is NOT mostly chicken breasts and rice…not to support that much mass on a frame like that. It sounds good to high school kids who are afraid to eat, but it just isn’t what’s really going on.
The reality is most really big guys work harder in the gym than most people.
That’s just the truth.
Someone like that can eat shit the average guy not sweating with one 25lbs plate on a machine can’t.
[/quote]
Genetics definitely are the “X Factor” in this equation… The guys we’re talking about are the exception and not the rules, wouldnt you agree?
I have a good buddy who is like that. He eats whatever whenever he wants and is shredded. He’s not huge but is 6’1" and 190lbs with 6-8%BF year round and looks great (no homo)… I hate him lol
[quote]Professor X wrote:
eat cheeseburgersz[/quote]
oh…
[quote]gregron wrote:
[quote]Professor X wrote:
Dude, one of the guys I trained with in Florida was carrying about 20-30lbs more muscle than that guy and often ate a sleeve of cookies for lunch and then drank Muscle Milk as his only food intake for 3 meals. He stayed at what couldn’t have been much more than 10% body fat because he had full muscle separation even though his back was lagging.
GENETICS and lifting intensity are why I can live at Pizza Hut and still gain more muscle than fat and someone else may not.
That is the only reason these topics bother me. Most of what we hear on these forums is regurgitated ad/copy for the masses.
I am betting when Johnny Jackson is at his heaviest for powerlifting and no abs are visible, that his diet is NOT mostly chicken breasts and rice…not to support that much mass on a frame like that. It sounds good to high school kids who are afraid to eat, but it just isn’t what’s really going on.
The reality is most really big guys work harder in the gym than most people.
That’s just the truth.
Someone like that can eat shit the average guy not sweating with one 25lbs plate on a machine can’t.
[/quote]
Genetics definitely are the “X Factor” in this equation… The guys we’re talking about are the exception and not the rules, wouldnt you agree?
I have a good buddy who is like that. He eats whatever whenever he wants and is shredded. He’s not huge but is 6’1" and 190lbs with 6-8%BF year round and looks great (no homo)… I hate him lol[/quote]
I understand what you mean, but I have seen it too much to act like it is an “exception” to some rule.
By most rules, the average person will not be able to build legit arms over 18" naturally…yet there are quite a few people on this site who did it.
Are they all “exceptions to the rule”?..or just another part of the population that gets ignored lately as if EVERYONE is a “hardgainer”?
I can eat at Whataburger one meal a day and lose body fat. That doesn’t mean everyone else can do that. I’m not an “exception”…there is simply a whole world of people out there NOT like you who the exact same generic response as far as diet will not apply directly to.
Yeah, some people are better off and making more progress eating cookies. Let 'em…and while you’re at it…find out more about yourself so you know what it is you really respond to.
I think I’m just tired of people reacting like the earlier poster did as if he was completely unaware that Mc Donald’s served food that wasn’t toxic.
It means they aren’t really looking at the break down of food. They are just labeling shit and falling in line with mass-speak.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
Yeah, some people are better off and making more progress eating cookies. Let 'em…and while you’re at it…find out more about yourself so you know what it is you really respond to.
I think I’m just tired of people reacting like the earlier poster did as if he was completely unaware that Mc Donald’s served food that wasn’t toxic.
It means they aren’t really looking at the break down of food. They are just labeling shit and falling in line with mass-speak.[/quote]
I agree, food is food; yes, some food choices are much healthier than others but no matter what it’s still all processed by our bodies none the less. Yes, obesity and poor health is due to poor diets and shitty food choices and some genetics is at play, but the main culprit is that we have become lazy… living increasingly sedentary lives sitting hours and hours before our boob tubes. Why such dark lenses? Why the blinders? Open your eyes up and see the bigger picture. Be more flexible in the manner in which you want to reach your goals as you’ll quickly be surprised to find there is always more than one best way to achieve them.
Plus, it can’t be ignored why so many of these “hard-gainers” and “nutritional prima donnas” aren’t getting any bigger and/or stronger:
They are so concerned about what they are eating and determining their daily macros that they have lost sight of the most important aspect of their diet… eating and eating enough! And if that means getting in some sloppy calories so be it.
They simply don’t train at the required intensity/volume levels to warrant such growth…
And/or worse they think that only three or four times a week in the gym is enough to accomplish their unrealistically lofty goals in an unreasonable amount of time.
Time and time again one thinks they are really training hard to only find out that their killer manly workout is a warm-up for some little cute female Olympian hopeful in a training center in the next town over, who by the way is on her third training session of the day.
It’s a long crooked road with many detours, speed traps, and traffic jams; many are not patient enough to ride it out and thus why we have what we call the elite amongst us. Personally, I like it this way as the slugs, dirt bags, ill-attitudes, and underachievers all make us look good!
Along with this, I know someone who used to be a college running back…with abs visible. He is now on the verge of being obese at the age of 39. He claims he is eating about the same as he always did as he never paid attention to his food intake.
What changed?
Possibly the last near 20 years at a desk job with no exercise eating the same crap.
The physique is night and day.
This is about BALANCE, in life, in the gym, in the kitchen and even in the bed room.
Yeah, there are tons of people who can eat pure shit all day and look like they belong on the cover of a magazine.
Anyone want to take bets that they also work a hell of a lot harder than the guys acting like a slice of pizza will kill their progress?
That guy I mentioned who ate cookies would train for damn near 3 hours at a time.
I am training twice a day now and finding it takes even more calories than before to hold my weight constant…which is cool shit to me.
My body did not respond the same at all when I was walking with a limp, wasn’t climbing any stairs or doing any cardio at all and had even quit riding my motorcycle for months. Aside from hitting the gym the same, I was largely “sedentary” elsewhere and my routine was completely missing any “conditioning” component because of the injuries.
If my body is moving, I can eat pretty much what I want as long as I am focused on providing my body with the basics.
If I start avoiding stairs, cut way back on everything BUT simply lifting heavy for 40min a day, I can gain fat just like anyone else…and have enough times to know what I’m saying is true.
I know when I was at my personal best, 6ft, 220, 10%bf, I was in college. I lived off campus and grocery shopped but I had a meal plan too for convenience as weekdays I was on campus all day, kicking things off lifting in the rec center early. If you’ve been to college you know the all you can eat set up with horrible nutritious value. I mean its greasy, salty slop. I do not have freak genetics but I lifted 6x per week on a split. Upper push, upper pull, lower body w/lower back and abs. Always built around compound lifts and free weights.
I used every bit of shit I ate bc ultimately it breaks down to the macros we all know. I found out at the doc though that my blood pressure and lipid levels were through the roof so there is that. I spent more time at the salad bar and brown bagged more often and was excellent at a follow up a couple months later FWIW.
Guys, I’m pretty sedentary and normally follow what some here would consider a “clean” diet. I cook my own chicken breasts, pork tenderloin, top round, roast turkey, etc. Yet when you travel, you just have to be adaptable. Like X said, there are choices at these fast food places. You DON’T have to order fries. Every place seems to have grilled chicken and at Wendy’s you can even get a baked potato. Want a burger, just get it without mayo, cheese or fries (the BK triple whopper comes to mind). Drink water or diet soda. I get back from travel and in a couple days I’m back to normal after flushing the excess water from my system.
Sit down places are even easier. There’s always meat and vegetables on the menu. Just skip the deep fried, breaded bacon strips. 
[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:
I found out at the doc though that my blood pressure and lipid levels were through the roof so there is that. I spent more time at the salad bar and brown bagged more often and was excellent at a follow up a couple months later FWIW.[/quote]
This has a HUGE genetic component though. While you may notice an issue, someone else may not at all. It does help for everyone to be more knowledgeable of their current state of health though.
For instance, I noticed some sleep apnea at near 290lbs. I know some people who experience it without even hitting 220. Your body isn’t the same as everyone elses.
That guy I mentioned before has sleep apnea. He says he currently weighs about 270lbs but he is only about 5’7".
We also discussed how many people we’ve seen who used to play football who used to be in shape but are now literally morbidly obese.
The story is the same with nearly all of them…they only worked out because of football…so when that stopped and they kept eating the same, everything changed.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:
I found out at the doc though that my blood pressure and lipid levels were through the roof so there is that. I spent more time at the salad bar and brown bagged more often and was excellent at a follow up a couple months later FWIW.[/quote]
This has a HUGE genetic component though. While you may notice an issue, someone else may not at all. It does help for everyone to be more knowledgeable of their current state of health though.
For instance, I noticed some sleep apnea at near 290lbs. I know some people who experience it without even hitting 220. Your body isn’t the same as everyone elses.
That guy I mentioned before has sleep apnea. He says he currently weighs about 270lbs but he is only about 5’7".
We also discussed how many people we’ve seen who used to play football who used to be in shape but are now literally morbidly obese.
The story is the same with nearly all of them…they only worked out because of football…so when that stopped and they kept eating the same, everything changed.[/quote]
Yep. Cals in, cals out. You just have to be cognizant of the nutritional value your diet provides bc dietary needs are of course broader than energy and protein for muscle growth. You can have a great physique and be in horrible health for sure. Who knows, had I not made a change, after years of arterial wall plaque build up, a heavy squatting session could’ve been a heart attack despite a bodacious beach bod.
Fortunately I went to the doc for a routine check up and listened. Small substitutes like mixed salad and whole grains with whatever meat they served instead of mashed potatos, gravy, biscuits etc, coupled with regular excercise gave me and excellent profile within two months. Didn’t sacrifice muscle either though my salads were huge to make up calories. I felt generally better too.
But yes, if you quit lifting you’ve got to know you’re done and quit justifying huge meals as muscle preservation. These days I do avoid empty cals most of the time. Every thing I eat provides for at least two objectives. Energy, protein, vitamins/phytonutrients, fiber. Any combo is fine but each food food satisfies at least two requirements and a meal hits them all at least once with food combos. I supplement EFAs.
[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:
Yep. Cals in, cals out. .[/quote]
…which seems to be the biggest issue people have along with completely missing the boat as far as their understand of what “pushing to your limits” really means.
It really doesn’t matter that you’ve calculated your protein intake down to the 10th of a decimal point if the guy next to you who just finished a filling trip to Wendy’s and couldn’t even tell you how much he ate is blowing passed you and you aren’t gaining shit.
The issue still comes down to not eating enough.
Yes, I do believe that eating strategy can have quite a bit to do with overall progress and it is always favorable to limit fat gain to what is needed to see the most physical progress…but in the end you should still be gaining that muscle whether your diet was conceived in a medical sterilizing unit or eaten off the floor at Micky D’s.
Until that muscle is built, calories are the most important factor.
Once you’re huge, you can play around with eating strategies all you want. Until then, you are likely just wasting time you won’t ever get back.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:
Yep. Cals in, cals out. .[/quote]
…which seems to be the biggest issue people have along with completely missing the boat as far as their understand of what “pushing to your limits” really means.
It really doesn’t matter that you’ve calculated your protein intake down to the 10th of a decimal point if the guy next to you who just finished a filling trip to Wendy’s and couldn’t even tell you how much he ate is blowing passed you and you aren’t gaining shit.
The issue still comes down to not eating enough.
Yes, I do believe that eating strategy can have quite a bit to do with overall progress and it is always favorable to limit fat gain to what is needed to see the most physical progress…but in the end you should still be gaining that muscle whether your diet was conceived in a medical sterilizing unit or eaten off the floor at Micky D’s.
Until that muscle is built, calories are the most important factor.
Once you’re huge, you can play around with eating strategies all you want. Until then, you are likely just wasting time you won’t ever get back.[/quote]
I agree and frankly I think most people put too much emphasis on macro ratios. If you are eating and lifting you will grow. Eat too much relative to output and you get uneccessarily fat and vice versa. Arthur Jones and his under study, Ellington Darden Phd, put out some very impressive physiques on carb dominant diets with relatively low protein intake. Think Casey Viator. You can manipulate diet all you want but each and every theory, strategy diet et cetera with the corresponding appropriate level of work has produced great results. And without work, neither do any strategies. But for general health, we all need fruits, veggies, meat and arguably whole grains daily, fads aside. Eat for variety and your own caloric needs based on training goals ftw imo. Diets are like training plans, they all work. Body builders cutting from 8% fat to sub 5% may benefit from fancy pants ratios but even they can’t maintain that shit year round even if they did up caloric volume.
People have been coming up with countless studies/experiments that its getting way too clouded.
The golden rule, as far as pure weight loss is concerned is still "calories in > calories out.
There’s someone a while back, I believe he was a Doctor, who ate potato chips all day for X amount of time and lost weight.
[quote]MODOK wrote:
[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:
[quote]Professor X wrote:
[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:
I found out at the doc though that my blood pressure and lipid levels were through the roof so there is that. I spent more time at the salad bar and brown bagged more often and was excellent at a follow up a couple months later FWIW.[/quote]
This has a HUGE genetic component though. While you may notice an issue, someone else may not at all. It does help for everyone to be more knowledgeable of their current state of health though.
For instance, I noticed some sleep apnea at near 290lbs. I know some people who experience it without even hitting 220. Your body isn’t the same as everyone elses.
That guy I mentioned before has sleep apnea. He says he currently weighs about 270lbs but he is only about 5’7".
We also discussed how many people we’ve seen who used to play football who used to be in shape but are now literally morbidly obese.
The story is the same with nearly all of them…they only worked out because of football…so when that stopped and they kept eating the same, everything changed.[/quote]
Yep. Cals in, cals out. [/quote]
Nope. People simplifying human physiology to equate it to a simple machine are extremely misguided. If you think of metabolism as calories in, calories out you are missing nearly the entire concept of metabolism.
[/quote]in total perhaps. But for the average lifter it absolutely is that simple. I don’t disagree specific manipulations can be beneficial however and said so.
So if im understanding the point of this thread correctly…