T Nation

We Need Healthcare Reform


#1

Cuba Is 38 I believe. Of course they also pay about 600 dollars a year for health care compared to thousands we spend. They also live longer, so go figure.


#2

Do they pay for fertility treatments?


#3

600 dollars in Cuba is a shitload of money.


#4

Cuba Is 38 I believe. Of course they also pay about 600 dollars a year for health care compared to thousands we spend. They also live longer, so go figure.

Did he mention that the WHO does not do them anymore because there are too many variables to judge health care system?

If he went to their page he would know that.

Did he also mention that if you factor in accidents and violent deaths you are actually number 1?


#5

This is a good point, a large portion of Cuba is poor. 600 dollars might not seem like much to us, but to those in Cuba it is a small fortune.


#6

Plus you cannot compare them to us in any formulative way. Demographics...No. Population...No. Economy...No.


#7

Plus their cigars are overrated.


#8

This is a good example of leftist thinking.

The leftist thinks that the producers will produce no matter what they do to them. Atlas has unlimited blood.

So of course health care costs can be brought down by an enlightened dictator such as Castro, or whomever they wish for the United States.

Why pay doctors the kind of money they get? Cuba has barefoot doctors -- which makes the good little leftists feel all warm and tingly inside, and brings a smile to their faces. Just pay doctors say $10,000 per year and that is very generous. This won't reduce the supply.

And the expensive diagnostic and other equipment, costing hundreds of thousands or sometimes millions a pop. Ripoff! Pay the company $10,000 for the machine, and that won't reduce production.

After all, if they don't produce, there's always the labor camp.

Learn to love Big Brother.


#9

I'm more than aware that there are a lot of variables in judging a healthcare system( i.e. cost, death rates, life expectancy, obesity, etc.) . I also know that if you're 37 on the list your not anywhere close to #1 which is where we should be.

And what? I know our murder rates are incredibly high in the u.s., but I don't think they would affect the average life expectancy that much. Certainly not pushing us to #1. Accidents are just as frequent in other countries as well. Besides, you just mentioned that there are a lot of variables in measuring a healthcare system. We generally suck in all of them.


#10

No really, this discussion was not really intended to be about Cuba, so we don't need to go there. They are after all one step lower than the u.s.

What about the 36 that are supposedly better than America?


#11

Cuba Is 38 I believe. Of course they also pay about 600 dollars a year for health care compared to thousands we spend. They also live longer, so go figure.

Did he mention that the WHO does not do them anymore because there are too many variables to judge health care system?

If he went to their page he would know that.

Did he also mention that if you factor in accidents and violent deaths you are actually number 1?

I'm more than aware that there are a lot of variables in judging a healthcare system( i.e. cost, death rates, life expectancy, obesity, etc.) . I also know that if you're 37 on the list your not anywhere close to #1 which is where we should be.

And what? I know our murder rates are incredibly high in the u.s., but I don't think they would affect the average life expectancy that much. Certainly not pushing us to #1. Accidents are just as frequent in other countries as well. Besides, you just mentioned that there are a lot of variables in measuring a healthcare system. We generally suck in all of them.

He didn't say he THINKS the US would be number 1, he said the US IS number 1 you twit.

And yes, when you factor in violent deaths and accidents, the US is number 1. If you factor in obesity and smoking, and we are far and above number 1.


#12

I'm sure you can imagine i don't like being called a twit for making my argument.

Perhaps I am being obtuse though. How do you you factor murders, smoking, and obesity into the ranking system? Other countries smoke a lot more than us and still have better health. We are also a VERY obese nation which should in no way be discounted in our health system. Plus, like I said I think there are around 10,000 murders a year in the u.s. which shouldn't really affect mortality rates when we have 300,000,000 people in our country.

Here's a few statistics to help make this clearer.

51% of U.S. adults do not receive all recommended screenings and preventative services.
Only 52% of adults are insured all year long.
Quality of care vs. Cost of care has a very poor ratio.
53% of citizens with a serious mental illness do not receive care in a given year.
We have a high mortality amenable to healthcare rate(115 deaths per 100,000 population). France (the real #1) has the lowest (75 per 100,000).

The rating system can't ignore those facts.


#13

I am going to tell you about #2, Italy, since you probably don't know. The healthcare there is often despised by its citizens because of the wait. Also, if you saw their tax rate, you might fall over. They might be taxed at around 50-55% for this "stellar" healthcare. Imagone that, taking home only half of what you earn. They are now becoming more right-sided about the issue since they see the flaws with it.

When you get to it, is it good? Yes, but their technology is behind ours, and that sucks if you are dealing with something major. If you have a flu or cold, yea its no biggie.

You need to consider numerous factors (which is something the WHO doesn't do.) People in other countries do not eat fast food at the rate that people here do, and that is something WHO probably doesn't account for. Shit, I have driven through some towns where there isn't even a traffic signal.


#14

That's a good point. There are probably others on that list that aren't happy with there system. Germany is one that I know of, and their at 30 or something.

Canada is pretty happy with the one they have though. Couldn't that be evidence for public option healthcare?


#15

This post was flagged by the community and is temporarily hidden.


#16

http://www.miamiherald.com/news/americas/cuba/story/1203953.html

Cuba cant even get the toilet paper they need until the end of December at the soonest. I bet the working conditions in their hospitals are oh so very sterile. Try again please.


#17

True this rating system is like letting my dad and uncle rate beer, uggghhhhhg...


#18

Dont have anything to add really other than this:

http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IBDArticles.aspx?secid=1502&status=article&id=337909690110379&secure=1&show=1&rss=1


#19

People can bitch and moan all they want, but this is the best the world has to offer right now, you have foreign dignitaries coming here for treatment.

Push has a point, if you knew the behind the scenes story of my birth, you would be glad you are here. To make it short, the nurses went on strike and patients were left to change their own clothes, sheets, towels, linens, etc. The day after giving birth, this is probably the last thing on your mind. Plus those responsible for sanitizing those linens also went on strike. Can you spell stink city?


#20

You didn't make an argument you ignored one. And you have to consider that murder and accidents often take YOUNG lives, screwing statistics. Also, Americans are fat. French people aren't fat. This make a significant impact on our life expectancies. If Sweden had as many fat asses as we do, I assure you their life span average would be quite lower.

I'll address your points as lettered.

A) ...And? I fail to see how this is a problem. If people want to get preventative services they can pay for them. If they don't WANT to pay for them, they won't get them. I don't see how this is so horrible.
B) Again, I fail to see the issue. Plenty of adults feel they don't need insurance, particularly young adults.
C) Bully. We have the best QUALITY in the world bar none, and we don't pay a price THAT much higher all things considered (tax rates, lost jobs due to government price controls etc...).
D) Define "serious mental illness." A very vague term. Why is it the states job to care for the supposedly "mentally ill?"
E) You're gonna have to clarify this stat. No idea what it means =P