T Nation

Waterbury Method Impossible?


I think the point of the workout is to do the same amount of reps (30) with 10x3 as opposed to 3x10 right? The point being that you are using more overall poundage during the workout. So going off of a 1 rep max of 305, you could potentially do 10 reps with 75% of that which is about 228. So you'd be doing 2280 pounds total for each set and 6840 for the whole workout.

If you use 85% of your one rep max for 10x3 you'd be lifting about 2600 pounds for each set and after 10 sets you will have lifted a grand total of 7800 pounds for that workout. If you need to lower it in order for you to accomplish the set amount of reps to say 80% of your 1 rep max, you'd still be lifting 7320 pounds per workout which is 480 more total poundage than if you'd done a traditional 3x10. So even if you have to lower the weight a little bit more you're still going to benefit from this workout. Unless of course you are unable to use more than 75% of your 1 rep max for 10x3.


BENXPX I think that is a terrible way to look at training programs for size. People will OCD about things like that and increase total volume for the sake of total volume in one workout. It's the string of workouts over time and hopefully the progression of them, not looking at todays workout volume, that will make someone a success here.



Don't know if you're still interested in any advice. I've successfully done other routines very much like this. Maybe I can make a few suggestions, but first I need a little more info about your lifting past.

Have you ever done any powerlifting or pure strength work?
How long did you train this way?
Did you have any formal coaching?

Lifting heavy, even maximally for reps sometimes requires a different mindset and method than a lot of guys are used to. I can give you some basic pointers that will make a big diff if you're not already doing them.


From what you've written all I see if that you've increased the rest period. That didn't work so now you are being told that lowering the weight would be better.

I would lower the weight enough that you can still work within the prescribed rest periods (which are still only guidelines, mind you - biofeedback is better). If you aren't willing to do that then to answer your original question: yes, WM is impossible.


I do appreciate everyone giving advice. Where I'm coming from is I've already reduced the %'s AND added rest, and I still can't get the sets. Continually telling me to jack with it isn't helping, as I've jacked with it pretty significantly. If I do so any more than it isn't even the Waterbury Method, it's the Whiteflash Method.

The first time I did it I just used a weight I knew I was getting all the sets/reps with, and added 5 lbs every workout. Trying to do the program as closely as outlined is proving to be impossible [for me]. So, with thta, after this week I'll probably drop it in favor of something else.


Ding, ding! Magarhe comes through again. If you are benching over 300 pounds, you should surely have enough weight room experience to start modifying things to suit your individual needs.

Cookie cutter programs suck, and the faster you get past them and are able to train with a basic template geared to your goals the faster you will make major progress. CW tries, but he has to make these programs so general that inevitably many will have problems with them if they aren't able to figure some shit out on their own.


I'd do a split if I was you


That's what it's looking like for the next 3 weeks or so, high rep split then after that I'm gonna fuck around with straight strength training, like wave loading or the sheiko bench program. If I can get to 200lbs-ish and bench 365+ I'd be content[for the time being]. I always seem to waiver between wanting to be jacked and wanting to push weight. Training for both has seemed to help. Who'da thought? I'd like to thank everyone for providing their time/input, even if it wasn't what I wanted to hear. Ya'll be easy.


90 seconds rest 10 sets of 3 with 85%+ of your 1 RM...interesting. Who advocates that shit? Who the fuck suggested 70 seconds?

Looks like you do enough chest anyway- but I think your bench sucks for all your apparent chest development, and this is probably due to your lack of triceps and lats.

Give the bench a break- if you are going for strength on the bench you're going to have to greatly increase those rest periods- talking 3 minutes minimum here. Do NOT lock out on your reps. Your dying on the 4th set...which is rather strange...of 85% 1RM is because of your ridiculously short rest periods and the weight being far too heavy for you to handle at that pace. Check the ego and bust the weight down to something you can actually move for 10 sets. Let 345lb boy do his thing- he's probably 5 feet 6 inches tall with 18 inch long arms to begin with, so don't feel bad- at least you got him on height- or do you...counting the hat, I'm sure you edge him out by a pretty good margin so don't look so sad.


[quote]USNS physique wrote:
90 seconds rest 10 sets of 3 with 85%+ of your 1 RM...interesting. Who advocates that shit? Who the fuck suggested 70 seconds?

Chad Waterbury. That's what we're talking about, his program and the guidelines within. My boy's my height, but outweighs me by 25lbs or so [I'm about 187, he's about 210]. You're right about my tri's being a weakpoint, but my lat's are pretty strong [relatively speaking]. I've been experimenting with tucking my elbows, and that seems to help.


From the article:

These loads won't always be identical for everyone.

Have you tried using the latter?


Wave Loading FTW, but yeah, I believe when you're advance enough, there's no way in hell you can do 80%+ for 10x3, with under a min and a half of rest, there's just no way you can recover that fast when dealing with a heavy bench load. I'd be damn if anyone can do the same with 500+ Squats and Deads with that format.


Ooooh! Don't give up now! Because your having trouble doing it is precisely why you should continue. You can do it...If I can do it anybody can and I am a pussy. I bet you'll master it if you don't give up.


Anybody who is struggling on the bench should immediately stop doing the regular elbows-at-90-degrees style, and immediately switch to tucked elbows. I also have the genetically awesome chest a la columbu so I have to be careful not to become all chest.

Two important factors you should keep in mind: 1.) do not lock out on your reps on the bench 2.) the bar must be seated in the palm in such a way that it is right over the forearm bones. If you look at your hand, you see there's a dip right in the middle of the palm-heel. This is where the bar should be resting during the movement.

Your chest is big enough right now- def do some triceps junk: close grip bench press and barbell extension, but again do not lock out on your reps. The not locking out makes a world of difference.


My 6rm is exactly 80% of my max, and I used 10lbs less than that. Thinking about it, I'm just gonna finish out the last week. The thing is, the weight I'm gonna use next week is my true 80% [245]. USNS, you wanna explain the not locking out thing?


I haven't used this program myself but I'm pretty sure that the point of it is exactly that. It's just another tool to progress if you're not progressing with traditional methods. It's not something that you'd use all of the time. CT talks about this method in one of his articles and I've seen it in a few magazines lately as well.


kroc could do it.


But he wasn't doing 10x3 with 80% or more, he was doing one retardedly amazing strip set.


Yeah not lock out when u bench- do NOT push the bar up and lock the joint...keep the stress on the muscle and come up a few inches before lock out and then lower again. Your bench will improve vastly over what you've been seeing lately.


1.) Tuck elbows
2.) Never lock out on the rep
3.) Always increase weight per set

You'll get stronger so fast you won't ever think of benching any other way again.