T Nation

WallSJ: An Obama Update


aka: Obama is a tool.

"Americans have welcomed the Obama era in the same spirit of hope the President campaigned on. But after five weeks in office, it's become clear that Mr. Obama's policies are slowing, if not stopping, what would otherwise be the normal process of economic recovery. From punishing business to squandering scarce national public resources, Team Obama is creating more uncertainty and less confidence -- and thus a longer period of recession or subpar growth."

"The market has notably plunged since Mr. Obama introduced his budget last week, and that should be no surprise. The document was a declaration of hostility toward capitalists across the economy. Health-care stocks have dived on fears of new government mandates and price controls. Private lenders to students have been told they're no longer wanted. Anyone who uses carbon energy has been warned to expect a huge tax increase from cap and trade. And every risk-taker and investor now knows that another tax increase will slam the economy in 2011, unless Mr. Obama lets Speaker Nancy Pelosi impose one even earlier."

I wonder if all the fools who supported letting park bench dwellers vote this 'Clam Bake' into office are starting to regret it.


HH absolutely agree, the markets and their reaction should be the barometer by which the Obama sitmulus plan is gauged rather than the politicical and journalistic soundbites themselves.

This comment from Jim Rogers the investment guru.

"The idea that you can solve a problem of too much debt and too much consumption and too much borrowing by more borrowing and more consumption and more debt, to my mind, is ludicrous, insane."

Bottom line Wall Street listens to people who know what they are talking about.


So ... starting ANOTHER thread on the market vs Obama?

You guys don't understand the markets, economy, or money. Or politics. Or people.

You are very silly if you think the markets are the barometer of what should be done.

I am NOT saying the debt/rescue plan / Obama is doing the right thing.

I am saying you don't understand the markets - stop using it as an example.

Markets have been going up up up for years and what was actually going on behind the scenes was utter economic disaster. they are not going down now in recognition of some new disaster, they are going down because the latest scam has been found out. Don't worry there will be a new scam in a few years, there always is.


Why don't you then educate us then? It's easy to make generalized comments, but harder to back them up.

What do we not understand oh smart one?


The adjustments had already been made. The markets bottomed out in November and were relatively stable until Opie's inauguration. The losses we have seen in the last couple months are a direct result of fear, uncertainty, and legislation put forth by Obama and his administration.


Palpable fear on what obama's spending will do --- people are envisioning 20% or 30% inflation in a year or two, as trillions of dollars come out of hiding.


Yes they are....The certainly reflect the uncertainty that Obama's policies have inflicted upon the country.

What do think the market response would be tomorrow if Obama came on TV tonight and said that he was going to suspend corporate taxes for six months and reintroduce them at a lower level there after. What if he further proclaimed that he is going to cut government spending to the bare knuckles so as to not cause undo burden to taxes payers over the next 4 years to allow businesses and individuals to recover. What if instead of bail outs he put forth a pool of money as loans that have to be paid back? The these banks would not rely on the government and be forced to have to do what they are in business to do which is credit. We'd be out of this quagmire in 6 months and well on our way to recovery.

I understand this shit well, thank you. I also understand how and why his policies have virtually stagnated to economy like a stopped up toilet...He has pushed to much shit through the hole.

He wasted no time at being a failure.


Speaking as a business owner I'm not putting any more money out then I have to right now and it is directly related to the lack of confidence I have in the economy and where the manchurian president is taking it.

Business is about risk and smart business people take calculated risks every day. The good ones thrive the poor ones do not. I have a good customer base and a stable and experienced work force. I'm treading water right now by choice. I have no confidence in the leadership and I'm building up a war chest instead of making investments in capital going into my busy season. Everyone in business I do is doing the same.

It's about lack of faith. Nothing more.


Nope, none of you understand the markets, and I am not going to educate you on them.

Market up now, does that mean Obama has done something right? Or does he have to get it higher than it ever has been before?


Lucky, your opinions don't count for anything as far as markets, politics, or the economy count. Your vote does nothing, your opinions carry no weight - it must suck to be in a situation like that, in a failing economy, blinkers on your eyes, ranting at things that didn't cause it, blaming, trying to sway public opinion towards what you think is the problem, in a desperate attempt to change things.

If you really understood (anything) you'd be sitting back laughing, making profits from it - because I guarantee you, that is what the people who drive these systems are doing. Laughing at you. As you blame others.

hedo, this doesn't include you, and a lot of people, it is much harder for any business owner to jump around changing conditions, there isn't much you can do. but lack of faith is not the problem. there is always faith when a scam is running and money flows freely. too much faith is the problem, and years of unjustified faith has made the coffin in which you all now lay. it is not up to Obama to tell you the coffin is really great.


Again. You say NOTHING that explains anything. Great job!

Capital generated by private markets drive the economy...NOT THE GOVERNMENT...bottom line. The fact that Obama is now experimenting with a GOVERNMENT driven economy IS DRIVING THE MARKET DOWN. Hgher Corp taxes, capital gains taxes. This is scaring the PRIVATE market and killing it. Do you think investors are going to put money in a market that is less profitable even when up??

It's very simple, yet you don't get it. You act as if the market bears nothing from the tinkering of government within it. We are throwing money at failing companies. This will not instutute any business changes to the market conditions, as companies MUST always do to survive. It is simply PROLONGING the bad situation and making it worse down the road by wasting money we should be otherwise cutting taxes with.


And an example of how a tax cut drives the economy.....even in RED CHINA for fucks sake!



This post made me LMFAO.

I LOVE how all of a sudden, everyone is a hundred times more "informed" than everyone else.


Were you thirsty and had a big refreshing cup of ego?


You're pretty goddamn full of yourself aren't you? I bet people must love you.

Why don't you contribute to the conversation to make people less "wrong", because from here it just looks like you know jack shit and have an extremely loud internet voice.


Most of us will readily admit this economic
morass is hard to understand and harder to fix. I doubt anyone in Washington in either party really know what to do and
most if not all are only looking out for themselves anyway.

For those reasons, we
didn't enter the primaries and tell voters
(real or imaginary) that we could handle the presidency in spite of the fact we'd never run so much as a hot dog stand.

No matter who caused the problem initially,
we need a solution rather than finger pointing and generalities.

Wonder Boy assured us all it would be a walk
in the park as he spoke in meaningless platitudes. Now it's about time for
something other than eloquence, intellect,
rhetoric and nuanced responses.


You'll never hear me uttering a civil word
about Hitlery Rotton Clinton but she could beat what Obama's doing.

I'm a Louisiana Republican who has twice
refrained from voting for Bobby Jindal but
yeah, he could beat what Obama's doing.
And Sarah Palin would start by selling
Pelosi's plane on ebay. We'd be better off
if we'd elected Cynthia Mc Kinney. She did run, you know.


And what do you do? do you own or run a business? Do you employ people? Doubt it.


No, it is not hard to understand. It is simply that many in the government do not want us to understand it so that they can take this oppurtunity to pass liberal tax and spend policies. We just saw it in a $1,000,000,000,000 'stimulus' bill, a $700,000,000,000 bank take-over plan, a $450,000,000,000 omnibus bill, and Lord knows how much more to the likes of AIG and Citi, who is currently profitable, btw. (Why exactly do you need a bailout if you are turning a profit?) Soon we will see it with a health-care bill, another stimulus, and more money and regulations for banks.

We (Reagan) solved similar problems less than thirty years using basic free market principles. The formula is simple. Get the government out of the banks. Give them less restrictions and the freedom to give credit as they see fit. Rescind all capital gains taxes on new investment for 1-2 years, then slowly bring it back up to a peak of 10% or so. Lower the ridiculously high corporate tax rate, which is second in the developed world only to Japan (who's economy is just wondrous), to a level close to Ireland's 12.5%, and remove it completely in all instances that it results in double taxation (first on the corporation, then on the shareholder).

Finally, drastic cuts to Federal spending will be needed. This will be done regardless. We just as well do it now while we have the choice instead of waiting until it is forced upon us when we go bankrupt.

If the president were to come out and start putting the pieces in place to advance this agenda, we could very easily see the markets double from their recent lows within one year.


Fact: The moron telling us all we don't understand the market thinks when we say "market" we mean the actual stock market.

Or so I have been interpreting it.


Here's what Warren Buffett has to say about all this. Even he says that the current system is probably beyond repair.

"The derivatives genie is now well out of the bottle, and these instruments will almost certainly multiply in variety and number until some event makes their toxicity clear. Central banks and governments have so far found no effective way to control, or even monitor, the risks posed by these contracts. In my view, derivatives are financial weapons of mass destruction, carrying dangers that, while now latent, are potentially lethal."

He said this quite some time ago and no one (not even Obama?!?!?) is going to fix it. We have to now suffer a Great Depression, probably ending in a National Socialist type state.