T Nation

Vintage LEO Training

I thought this was cool.

From the description:

Regards,

Robert A

Thanks, Robert. A classic for the ages, all the changes in training, it still comes down to putting the bullet where it needs to go…

[quote]idaho wrote:
Thanks, Robert. A classic for the ages, all the changes in training, it still comes down to putting the bullet where it needs to go…[/quote]

Very much so.

My first thoughts were “Holy shit” at the demo’s.

It was interesting to watch the “running” point shooting. A lot of thumb cocking revolvers in that video as well.

So, what are the odds of an LA LEO organization, or any for that matter, using trick shooting demo’s as part of their PR these days?

Regards,

Robert A

[quote]Robert A wrote:

[quote]idaho wrote:
Thanks, Robert. A classic for the ages, all the changes in training, it still comes down to putting the bullet where it needs to go…[/quote]

Very much so.

My first thoughts were “Holy shit” at the demo’s.

It was interesting to watch the “running” point shooting. A lot of thumb cocking revolvers in that video as well.

So, what are the odds of an LA LEO organization, or any for that matter, using trick shooting demo’s as part of their PR these days?

Regards,

Robert A[/quote]

Absolutely none, anywhere that I am aware of in the States. They are more focused on “cross cultural training” on how to handle a Black/White/Latino/Asian/Middle Eastern/Central Asia/South Asia transgender domestic dispute…with sensitivity and understanding (naturally)

Well, to be fair, they are going to get about 10,000 times the latter calls compared to former.

I can’t lie, I wouldn’t mind seeing ‘beat’ police work drift more toward social worker than SEAL TEAM 6. My tend to change the personalities of the guys drawn to it in the first place.

There are guys who’d rock in a Ranger Battalion wearing PD uniforms now. But most of the time they should just be in combat arms instead of gearing up like Blackwater on a security convoy to the Baghdad International Airport.

[quote]pulphero wrote:
Well, to be fair, they are going to get about 10,000 times the latter calls compared to former.

I can’t lie, I wouldn’t mind seeing ‘beat’ police work drift more toward social worker than SEAL TEAM 6. My tend to change the personalities of the guys drawn to it in the first place.

There are guys who’d rock in a Ranger Battalion wearing PD uniforms now. But most of the time they should just be in combat arms instead of gearing up like Blackwater on a security convoy to the Baghdad International Airport.[/quote]

Not sure what you are saying here. I have both domestic and international law enforcement experience and I can tell you that large, modern, US PD’s are heavily geared toward “social worker” cops. Thats why one is killed about every 4 days in the US (IMHO). So you want a social worker responding to a violent crime?

I worked security convoy details (PSD) to BIAP for about 2 years. I never carried anything I didnt need to stay alive. As a former SWAT tactial team leader, I never sent my people into any situation without the best weapons and equipment, I could get them. Not sure what your point is here. You dont want the police armed?

Law enforcement doesnt need to attract “social workers”,you want a non-aggressive person trying to fight an asshole juiced to the gills on PCP? There are many situations in street work, where you cant talk about the social injutice done to the poor badguy. Sometimes, you just have to kick their ass. Talking your way out of violence is always the best way to go, but, sometimes, you have to ENFORCE the law.

Law Enforcement is a violent job and no amount of “social worker attitude” will change that.

[quote]pulphero wrote:
Well, to be fair, they are going to get about 10,000 times the latter calls compared to former.

I can’t lie, I wouldn’t mind seeing ‘beat’ police work drift more toward social worker than SEAL TEAM 6. My tend to change the personalities of the guys drawn to it in the first place.

There are guys who’d rock in a Ranger Battalion wearing PD uniforms now. But most of the time they should just be in combat arms instead of gearing up like Blackwater on a security convoy to the Baghdad International Airport.[/quote]

I am totally not on board with “social worker” drift. I will also submit that the cops back in the “officer friendly days” were much, much more likely to beat you onto a ventilator than today.

I am fine with verbal judo. But we should remember that it works best when actual judo remains a viable alternative. Police are charged, at least in part, with telling people who lack long term planning skills, impulse control, and empathy to stop doing what they want to keep doing. That can and often does lead to violence. The value systems of said individuals can be so very different that what we might support/share that reasoning isn’t going to get it done.

I will also submit that the US has, overall at least, some of the most ethical and professional law enforcement in the world. In the US bribery, corruption, theft, and abuse of power by LEO’s do get prosecuted. They are not considered the de-facto standard, as they are in many other nations. Furthermore, the very fact that America’s LEO’s do answer emergencies/calls from all citizens instead of merely striving to keep the social classes separated puts them on the top tier of historic law enforcement.

That doesn’t mean there are not plenty of lazy, shitty, and unethical cops. None of this is solace if one of those are in control of your well being. Just that they are a numerical minority.

Regards,

Robert A

I am with Robert A and Idaho here. I know a few coppers, and they are generally tough, capable, and decent. There are some wankers, of course, who give the rest a bad name, and it is worse when a copper isn’t on the straight and narrow, because he/she can make your life very fucking difficult. For the most part though they are decent people, with major flaws like the rest of us, having to make good decisions out of bad circumstances. The only exceptions of course are the wankers, and the ones that look like they couldn’t fight off a cold, even with Robert A’s hot toddy recipe.

That said, while I’d always be polite and respectful to the fuzz, I’d never tell them a fucking thing they didn’t know or weren’t going to find out for themselves very quickly. If they nick you, they aren’t your mates, they are trying to get you to say something incriminating. I don’t blame them for that, but you should think long and hard about the implications before you tell the police anything.

[quote]LondonBoxer123 wrote:
I am with Robert A and Idaho here. I know a few coppers, and they are generally tough, capable, and decent. There are some wankers, of course, who give the rest a bad name, and it is worse when a copper isn’t on the straight and narrow, because he/she can make your life very fucking difficult. For the most part though they are decent people, with major flaws like the rest of us, having to make good decisions out of bad circumstances.
[/quote]
Something no one wants to hear. The gravity of the job does not always confer “give a shit” to the people doing the job. There are always going to be the screw ups. More money won’t help. I have met surgeons/specialists and lawyers who seriously have a “fuck all that work” attitude. Thankfully these people are a small percentage in most professions/jobs. But they will always be there.

Tried it then?

I wonder if I should have linked to that in the “changed everything” thread.

Irish’s log gets a lot of views so it might be a re-hash anyway.

[quote]
That said, while I’d always be polite and respectful to the fuzz, I’d never tell them a fucking thing they didn’t know or weren’t going to find out for themselves very quickly. If they nick you, they aren’t your mates, they are trying to get you to say something incriminating. I don’t blame them for that, but you should think long and hard about the implications before you tell the police anything.[/quote]

I am not kidding when I say I start every day with the following 2 goals as a minimum, and council others to do the same.

1.) Not to have to talk about my genitals in an emergency room setting.

2.) Not to have to talk to the police.-I mean “have” as in compelled to talk here. So holding a door open or saying hi at the coffee shop is fine. Formal questioning/detention is to be avoided. It indicates I have either a.)been around some stupid shit b.)am suspected of doing stupid shit or c.)have fallen victim to stupid shit. Note: Those of you reading this who ARE the police should substitute whatever internal or external review board/agency is in a similar position to jam you up.

I want to see if I can find some vintage baton/“hands on” footage to add to this thread.

Regards,

Robert A

Sweet cars, trick shots with revolvers, throw a few girls in there and you’ve got an Academy Award winner IMO

This might be the only decent thread about LEO’s I’ve ever seen on T-Nation.

Let’s hope the Off Topic crowd doesn’t show up.

idaho, ever think about making a specific combat thread geared for LEO’s?

[quote]Melvin Smiley wrote:
Sweet cars, trick shots with revolvers, throw a few girls in there and you’ve got an Academy Award winner IMO[/quote]

Not award worthy, but I thought the gun handling in Lawless was fairly “period correct”.

[quote]WN76 wrote:
This might be the only decent thread about LEO’s I’ve ever seen on T-Nation.

Let’s hope the Off Topic crowd doesn’t show up.
[/quote]

Not sure what that means exactly. Is off-topic “non-LEO”?

Regards,

Robert A

30 odd years later

Honestly, this works less viable/workable to me.

Am I missing something?

Regards,

Robert A

[quote]Robert A wrote:

[quote]WN76 wrote:
This might be the only decent thread about LEO’s I’ve ever seen on T-Nation.

Let’s hope the Off Topic crowd doesn’t show up.
[/quote]

Not sure what that means exactly. Is off-topic “non-LEO”?

Regards,

Robert A[/quote]

There is a pretty strong anti-LEO sentiment over there for sure.

Older than the '69 film, WWII era

I so want to launch tracers from a Gov’t Model.

I get a kick out of the 1911 needing “an upward” torque of the wrist. Today it is the defacto proper and Glocks “point high”.

[quote]WN76 wrote:

[quote]Robert A wrote:

[quote]WN76 wrote:
This might be the only decent thread about LEO’s I’ve ever seen on T-Nation.

Let’s hope the Off Topic crowd doesn’t show up.
[/quote]

Not sure what that means exactly. Is off-topic “non-LEO”?

Regards,

Robert A[/quote]

There is a pretty strong anti-LEO sentiment over there for sure.
[/quote]

Oh, you mean “off topic”/GAL.

I thought off topic was posters who weren’t sworn officers. Which would have put me in the catagory of “don’t show up.”

I pretty much keep to this board, or in the GeekShit or Zombie threads in GAL. Things are much less rough here in the combat board (ironic or expected?).

One of the GAL shit shows did prompt Cephalic_Carnage to come over and start some terminal ballistics/firearms discussion here. So, it’s not all bad.

There is currently an entertaining cop stories thread “Domestic and Street Stories” that idaho started that might interest you.

Regards,

Robert A

[quote]Robert A wrote:

[quote]WN76 wrote:

[quote]Robert A wrote:

[quote]WN76 wrote:
This might be the only decent thread about LEO’s I’ve ever seen on T-Nation.

Let’s hope the Off Topic crowd doesn’t show up.
[/quote]

Not sure what that means exactly. Is off-topic “non-LEO”?

Regards,

Robert A[/quote]

There is a pretty strong anti-LEO sentiment over there for sure.
[/quote]

Oh, you mean “off topic”/GAL.

I thought off topic was posters who weren’t sworn officers. Which would have put me in the catagory of “don’t show up.”

I pretty much keep to this board, or in the GeekShit or Zombie threads in GAL. Things are much less rough here in the combat board (ironic or expected?).

One of the GAL shit shows did prompt Cephalic_Carnage to come over and start some terminal ballistics/firearms discussion here. So, it’s not all bad.

There is currently an entertaining cop stories thread “Domestic and Street Stories” that idaho started that might interest you.

Regards,

Robert A[/quote]

Yes, I was referring to the other forum and not “non-LEO”.

It seems the posters in the Combat Forum are actually interested in the exchange of information and ideas, and not a pissing contest. This is my favorite forum to read. I don’t post in it because I am too busy reading it.

Robert A, you are easily one the best contributors to these boards as far as I am concerned. I’m sure many would agree. I hope you didn’t take my comment to come across as “non-LEO” persons having nothing worthwhile to contribute.

Might be of some interest:

Regards,

Robert A