T Nation

Very Short Cycles : Pro and Cons?


#1

There has been some debates that 2-3 week cycles with short acting esters could overall give better results for trainers who aren?t competitive PL and BB (who have to stay on all the time).

That is, you wont gain 30 pounds, but you?ll retain most of your gains and wont need PCT even if would still be useful. You dont have to wait 10-12 weeks for your next cycle while brooding with low test watching all your gains melt away.

I?ve seen very little feedback on this in the archives, and almost all the posters still talk about 8-10-12+ week cycles.

Let?s say you do two 12 week cycles or three 8 week cycles, you?d be "on" 24 weeks in a year. Would that give better results and less side effects than eight 3 week cycles ? still 24 weeks "on"? I?m interested in gains I CAN KEEP. Not doing the yo yo.

I stopped a planned Mag10 cycle (yep I still have some of those babies!!) after 4 DAYs for some timing issue. I noticed that I have really recuperated way better while on, yet I obviously don?t have any post cycle crash.

So? would taking fast acting orals on a 2 day on, 5 day off pattern be worth it, or just a waste of gear?

Anyone has tried 2-3 week cycles or 2-3 DAYS ?cycles? ???


#2

Just finished a 30 day test/winny cycle.
It was 50/mg test cyclodextrin (prop would work as well).. and 75mg winny (oral) ed.

Bodyweight started at 250, went as low as 235-240, and i am at 245 today. Bodyfat was 15% and now around 12-13%.

Strength gains were great, which was the idea, and recovery should be a breeze. Did 1 mg/eod of Arimidex. Will taper that, and a few weeks of Nolva, i'm all good.

Would i do it again, yes. Absolutely.

However, i plan on a 12 week test cyp cycle with 6 weeks tren/6 weeks of t-bol. Starting in mid/late june to cruise through summer with.

Again, both these cycles were for lean gains and to support a caloric defecit as i am trimming some bodyfat, and lifting BIG, cuz thats what i like. : )


#3

Yeah. The summer time does call out for longer cycles. Pretty young flesh everywhere...

What made you go the shorter route this time around? Previous experience?
How would you rate it versus longer cycles in terms of sides, gains, keeping the msucles, mood etc


#4

mmmm the long summer bulk

Dezz


#5

I went with the shorter one because of my mood coming off longer cycles. I really cant afford, nor do i like being so LOW post (long) cycle. But i have been getting some good advice on better (or alternative) PCT ideas on here, tappering etc, and i hope that will help with the long cycle one coming up.

I suppose i keep my gains more with the shorter cycle but thats becasue they are minimal to beigin with and a shorter cycle for me is more for strength. Which by the way, stays up.

I think both have their place depending on season, goals, and personal experience. As mentioned by others on this thread, a nice test cycle through the summer has its advantages.. : )


#6

A common thread is that while mass gains etc arent kept at 100%, or even at all sometimes, strenght gains do stay, at least a lot more in proportion than mass gains.

Your post cycle blues is one of the reasons short cycles seem so much better to me. Sure the gains arent as great as on longer cycles, but if you get to keep more, in the long run, 8 three week cycles SHOULD give you more muscle than 3 eight week cycles.

You'll never have looked as big as in the 8th week of a long cycle, but you'll be big year round with less side effects.

My 4 day Mag10 experience has got me tempted to do a 4 days on 7 days off kind of thing. mmmm. I'm sure somebody has tried that before. I feel no need to reinvent the wheel. Any feedback is appreciated.


#7

Interesting idea. Half lives would be a big consideration for this. I've definitely done high dose/2 week cycles and did not like them anywhere near as much as 6 week moderate/low dose cycles. But my goals are more athletic then physique oriented.
2 week high dose cycles were way too much of a roller coaster with the way I felt and performed.


#8

Really? I find that interesting. I thought that the post long cycle blues would be worse than a 2 weeks on 3 weeks off kind of thing.

I mean, you feel like a king for 8-12 weeks than like a chump for the next 2-3, than you feel normal and it's sad compared to superhuman status and if you care about your health you're months away from your next cycle.

With short cycles, you train like a madman for 2 weeks and glow with the gains, than basically only feel down a couple of days before going normal again - which doesnt feel so great anymore but you have only 2-3 weeks before you're on again.

Anyway, thanx for the imput.


#9

well, many experts say any dose above 100mg/week shuts you down all or none. they say it's length of time on that matters. If that's true, a short high dose cycle should leave you feeling great and a long moderate cycle should crash you pretty hard.

Something isn't right about that idea because in practice, with more than just myself, recovery is not as hard from 600mg/week or less of total steroid with a taper than with 2g week 1 and 1.5g week 2 and come off cycles. Could just be my local experience.

I think shutdown must follow some sort of gradient and not be an all or none thing. Or at least the symptoms I percieve to be shutdown were more apparent with high dose short cycle than mod/low dose longer cycle. I've never gone more than 8 weeks


#10

Interesting. Theory and reality are often 2 very different things.

But I never thought about using insane amounts on short cycles. Not in the 2g range anyway!

Summer's coming in so it's hard to juggle with the possibilities but for now I'm think I'm gonna try the 2 DAYS on/5 DAYS off approcah just to see what could that do. If it's a waste, well I wont waste much.

I'll train like a man possessed using CT's HS-100 on the two days on, and train 3 days out of the 5 with higher reps/intense cardio on the days off.

For now, I'll use MAG-10 and 1AD, but of course if this pans out to be a good idea, fast acting orals would be the way to go.