Utah Passes Amnesty

[quote]USMCpoolee wrote:

[quote]John S. wrote:

[quote]Mufasa wrote:
The latest news is that more and more States…including all the Border States (most notably Texas)…have become very interested in what Utah has proposed.

Again…interesting.

Mufasa[/quote]

It is because of two words, tax revenue[/quote]

Would you mind explaining that a little?[/quote]

Agreed,

Taxing people who make minimum wage is not cost effective. I see this as more of a humanitarian thing than an economic one. And should this stand up, illegal aliens will flood Utah and send it to the 3rd world cesspool that California is now. Watch and see the strain of social infrastructure and program spending (which will come by tax increases) skyrocket to pay for all this.

Well, that was dumb. If you open the flood gates, expect a flood.

[quote]MaximusB wrote:

[quote]USMCpoolee wrote:

[quote]John S. wrote:

[quote]Mufasa wrote:
The latest news is that more and more States…including all the Border States (most notably Texas)…have become very interested in what Utah has proposed.

Again…interesting.

Mufasa[/quote]

It is because of two words, tax revenue[/quote]

Would you mind explaining that a little?[/quote]

Agreed,

Taxing people who make minimum wage is not cost effective. I see this as more of a humanitarian thing than an economic one. And should this stand up, illegal aliens will flood Utah and send it to the 3rd world cesspool that California is now. Watch and see the strain of social infrastructure and program spending (which will come by tax increases) skyrocket to pay for all this. [/quote]

I showed this article to my folks and they are both blazing liberals, and they were appalled. Basically for the reasons you listed. I just don’t see how the benefits of having a boatload more citizens that are probably making minimum wage could outweigh the strain that puts on the states economy. Could anyone explain how that would work in the states favor?

Some additional thoughts:

  1. I would imagine that the proposal has a few more provisions in it than the “shorthand” that this article presented.

  2. Most likely, Utah would like to see all States adopt similar policies to avoid the “flood” that was alluded to. I’ve read that Utah is not a “rich” State (as evidenced by its poor ranking and funding for its schools)…so it would most likely find it extremely difficult to fund a sudden influx of thousands of immigrants.

  3. As some have indicated, this proposal does appear to be more Humanitarian in nature. In other words, its not an enforcement proposal.

Mufasa

[quote]USMCpoolee wrote:

[quote]MaximusB wrote:

[quote]USMCpoolee wrote:

[quote]John S. wrote:

[quote]Mufasa wrote:
The latest news is that more and more States…including all the Border States (most notably Texas)…have become very interested in what Utah has proposed.

Again…interesting.

Mufasa[/quote]

It is because of two words, tax revenue[/quote]

Would you mind explaining that a little?[/quote]

Agreed,

Taxing people who make minimum wage is not cost effective. I see this as more of a humanitarian thing than an economic one. And should this stand up, illegal aliens will flood Utah and send it to the 3rd world cesspool that California is now. Watch and see the strain of social infrastructure and program spending (which will come by tax increases) skyrocket to pay for all this. [/quote]

I showed this article to my folks and they are both blazing liberals, and they were appalled. Basically for the reasons you listed. I just don’t see how the benefits of having a boatload more citizens that are probably making minimum wage could outweigh the strain that puts on the states economy. Could anyone explain how that would work in the states favor?[/quote]

Democratic votes, that’s the ONLY reason.

[quote]Mufasa wrote:
Some additional thoughts:

  1. I would imagine that the proposal has a few more provisions in it than the “shorthand” that this article presented.

  2. Most likely, Utah would like to see all States adopt similar policies to avoid the “flood” that was alluded to. I’ve read that Utah is not a “rich” State (as evidenced by its poor ranking and funding for its schools)…so it would most likely find it extremely difficult to fund a sudden influx of thousands of immigrants.

  3. As some have indicated, this proposal does appear to be more Humanitarian in nature. In other words, its not an enforcement proposal.

Mufasa[/quote]

That is both the scam and the con to this whole thing.

Those “provisions” you mentioned will NEVER be enforced. Once they get their foot in the door, it is hard to prevent the rest of them to enter as well. What happens if the illegal alien gets fired? Will he be deported? Nope. What if they don’t pay a fine, do they face deportation? Nope. You will see the racism card played to the letter here.

This is what happened here in Los Angeles. The policy here was that if you were caught driving without a license, your car was impounded. The illegal alien lovers bitched because there is no way for them to obtain a license. So what happened? Enough bitching and moaning rescinded the policy, so now they are just cited with a ticket and allowed to drive their car off. Imagine that, you are cited for driving without a license, and then allowed to drive your car away after the citation is given (this is only happening for illegal aliens, citizens and legal residents will have their cars impounded.)

I doubt that’s the case in the “reddest” and most Republican State in the Union.

Mufasa

I doubt that you will get many people to disagree that California has a “day of reckoning” coming, Max. It simply has promised too much to too many people…and it’s broke.

Curious…how much has California’s “initiative” type of voting added to the State’s problems?

Isn’t the Northern part of the State fairly Conservative?

Mufasa

[quote]USMCpoolee wrote:
Could anyone explain how that would work in the states favor?[/quote]

How can you question the benefit of competitive labor? Even if they don’t increase the amount of tax revenue for the state they increase the wealth of society as a whole.

As for the politics of it it only benefits the politicians with regard to the favors they will receive from the business owners who insist this legislation must be passed. In Utah many of the business owners are Mormons who go through their church to get things done for them.

[quote]Mufasa wrote:
I doubt that you will get many people to disagree that California has a “day of reckoning” coming, Max. It simply has promised too much to too many people…and it’s broke.

Curious…how much has California’s “initiative” type of voting added to the State’s problems?

Isn’t the Northern part of the State fairly Conservative?

Mufasa[/quote]

The voting initiative is a huge problem, because people always vote yes without knowing the truth, facts, and ramifications of the initiative. We just found out that 10 Million was wasted on trying to make community college campuses “green” with wind and solar. When someone neutral finally crunched the numbers, it was determined that the energy requirements were not even close to being met because of things like areas where there is little to no wind, and not enough space for solar panels to fuel the colleges. These were factors that should have been considered during the proposal, not after it being approved and paid for.

Then you have another imbecile who wants to remove highways and make for highly dense lanes paths for people to get to work. No shit, this fuck-stick wants to create super bike lanes assuming that people are willing to bike to and from work. What this moose knuckle doesn’t understand is, here in Cali, people drive many miles to work. It is not uncommon for people to drive 40-50 miles each way to their job, and this asswipe thinks people will bike that LOL !
Yea buddy, you first.

What you have here, are Liberal fuckheads who are never voted out, who think of scams and continually fudge the numbers with no one (not even the media) to question the validity of it. Do you know how this shithead mayor of Los Angeles did to try to move his green movement? He Ok’d energy costs by up to 30%, so basically people won’t use as much energy because it’s too expensive. And he is bragging about this bullshit! The dumb fuck mayor has a population of 8.5 million people in LA, and thinks that this will make a dent in the world population of maybe 6 Billion people? LOL ! So people leave the state, companies and businesses leave because of the taxation and regulation, along with those jobs, and it’s this continuous downward spiral. And when funds get low, the gov’t thinks more taxes, but there are less wealthy people in the state.

Northern Cali is pretty Liberal, you aren’t getting any Conservative ideas passed there for shit.

[quote]Mufasa wrote:

I doubt that’s the case in the “reddest” and most Republican State in the Union.

Mufasa[/quote]

That “reddest” state gives illegal aliens drivers licenses, in state tuition, and now a form of residency. Not as red as people thought.

LOL!

You could be right, Max!

However; even with this proposal; I don’t think anyone is going to start calling Utah some hotbed of liberalism any time soon!

Mufasa

You would be surprised Mufasa, in a matter about 20-30 years, California (population 38 million) became largely Liberal. Now, downscale that to Utah (population 3 million). It won’t take that long.

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:

[quote]USMCpoolee wrote:
Could anyone explain how that would work in the states favor?[/quote]

How can you question the benefit of competitive labor? Even if they don’t increase the amount of tax revenue for the state they increase the wealth of society as a whole.

As for the politics of it it only benefits the politicians with regard to the favors they will receive from the business owners who insist this legislation must be passed. In Utah many of the business owners are Mormons who go through their church to get things done for them.[/quote]

Wouldn’t the drain on the economy of having to support that many more people outshine the plus that comes along with competitive labor?

The legislation part makes sense, thank you.

USMC:

I’m thinking the same thing.

It appears to me that the only way for this to really “work” is for other states to adopt similar proposals…especially neighboring states.

I know that many states are looking at Utah.

Mufasa

[quote]Mufasa wrote:
USMC:

I’m thinking the same thing.

It appears to me that the only way for this to really “work” is for other states to adopt similar proposals…especially neighboring states.

I know that many states are looking at Utah.

Mufasa[/quote]

Yea if all of Utah’s neighbors adopted that policy I could see it working, but as it stands with just Utah opening their gates, I just don’t see how the pros outweigh the cons.

You guys are seeing the trees but not the forest.

Illegal aliens don’t just come to work, as they claim, but they have kids, they get sick, and get arrested, etc. Their cost is ALOT more than their contribution. These people also send a good portion of their money back to their home country, which takes away from recycling it back into our economy.

Do people really think that taxing minimum wage workers will outweigh all of that ^^^?

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
You guys are seeing the trees but not the forest.

Illegal aliens don’t just come to work, as they claim, but they have kids, they get sick, and get arrested, etc. Their cost is ALOT more than their contribution. These people also send a good portion of their money back to their home country, which takes away from recycling it back into our economy.

Do people really think that taxing minimum wage workers will outweigh all of that ^^^?[/quote]

So, basically they wanted to incentivize MORE illegal immigration. Everytime any sort of amnesty is passed it basically says, “See? Get here and stick it out long enough for the next round of amnesty.”

Edit: Gotta love the libertarian fools and their “competitive” labor. Yeah, that labor working for $4 bucks an hour will support the politicians who promise more education and healthcare dollars. And if they can’t vote, their multitude of sons and daughters will. “Hey, let’s replace ourselves with throngs of uneducated, unskilled labor. Surely, it’d be great for a small government movement!” Umm, no.

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
You guys are seeing the trees but not the forest.

Illegal aliens don’t just come to work, as they claim, but they have kids, they get sick, and get arrested, etc. Their cost is ALOT more than their contribution. These people also send a good portion of their money back to their home country, which takes away from recycling it back into our economy.

Do people really think that taxing minimum wage workers will outweigh all of that ^^^?[/quote]

Wow, I did not think about any of that. I really hope this does not get Fed approval.

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
You would be surprised Mufasa, in a matter about 20-30 years, California (population 38 million) became largely Liberal. Now, downscale that to Utah (population 3 million). It won’t take that long. [/quote]

You’re probably right. Mormons have prophesied that Utah will become a den of iniquity, and the church will need to relocate to the New Jerusalem in Jackson county, Missouri. So Utah will go liberal, and Missouri will go even more conservative.