T Nation

US Dairy farmers: F U from Obama...

Since US dairy farmers weren’t having a tough enough time – its a-hole to the rescue… of the Israeli farmer…

US removes import levy on Israeli milk products
Following diplomatic efforts, President Obama signs memo eliminating import subcharge on dairy products from Israel. Exports of milk products to US totaled $6 million in 2007
10/22/09

The United States has removed the import subcharge on dairy products from Israel, following diplomatic efforts exerted by the Israeli Embassy in Washington and the Israeli Agriculture Ministry.

Up to now, most of the world’s countries exporting milk products to the United States have been forced to pay a levy protecting local production. The financial damage caused to Israel’s farmers due to this tax amounted to tens of thousands of dollars.

President Barack Obama was recently asked to solve the problem, and several days ago he signed a presidential memo eliminating the subcharge on exports of dairy products from Israel to the US.

‘American colleague nearly gave up’

The memo followed diplomatic efforts on the part of Yaakov Poleg, the Agriculture Ministry’s agricultural attaché at the Israeli Embassy in Washington. Poleg managed to prove to the US Trade Representative that the trade agreement between Israel and the US prohibits placing taxes on exports from Israel.

Following the diplomatic efforts, the American authorities agreed this week to remove Israel from the list of countries forced to pay a similar levy in the future…

“Thanks to hard work, the American authorities have removed Israel from the list of countries on which the levy is imposed,” says Poleg.

“Moreover, in light of the fact that Israel was removed from the list through a presidential declaration, there is no fear that it will be placed on us again in the future.”
http://www.ynet.co.il/english/articles/0,7340,L-3792821,00.html

US Farmers’ incomes dry up as milk prices plunge about 50%
By Sue Kirchhoff, USA TODAY

WEST GROVE, Pa. – Milk prices have plunged by about 50% from the historic highs of last summer, pummeling producers such as Walt Moore, a fourth-generation farmer whose family has worked the rolling fields of southeastern Pennsylvania for nearly a century.

“If these prices stay low through 2009, there’s going to be a lot of producers that don’t make it,” Moore says, noting that several nearby dairy operators have already decided to sell their herds and get out of the business.

While many producers managed to sock away profits early last year, they still might not be able to survive. “This time, the rainy day will last a lot longer than one day,” Moore says.

Dairy operations across the country are taking an enormous hit as prices plummet. The number of dairy cows being sent to slaughter has risen by about 20% from last year, as desperate farmers cull their herds and sell at fire-sale prices. Adding to the problem, banks are less willing or able to extend farmers’ loan payments amid the financial turmoil.

The U.S. Agriculture Department has begun providing emergency aid, though the National Milk Producers Federation (NMPF) in a recent letter to President Obama warned that thousands of farms and tens of thousands of jobs could be lost this year without more aggressive federal efforts…
http://www.usatoday.com/money/industries/food/2009-03-24-dairy-farms_N.htm

Milk prices in Pa. get a boost to help farmers
(AP) – 6 days ago

HARRISBURG, Pa. – The Pennsylvania Milk Marketing Board is temporarily boosting the minimum price of milk across the state by a few cents a gallon to soothe hurting dairy farmers.

The three-member board voted Thursday to increase the premium paid to farmers by 23 percent.

For farmers, that means getting an extra 50 cents, or $2.65, per 100 pounds of milk. For consumers, that is expected to mean paying about 4 cents extra on a gallon of milk at retail.

The higher price is effective Nov. 1 through Dec. 31.

In September, Gov. Ed Rendell asked the agency to help dairy farmers, saying Pennsylvania’s milk producers were facing prices that were 40 percent lower than the prior year.

Dairy prices have dropped amid low demand. Pennsylvania is the nation’s fifth-largest dairy state.
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5ir8qdTfOfyifMFxXUfBtVu3QtBSwD9BGB8401

Gotta love the immpeccable timing… what a coincidence!

So?

So in the future there might even been cheaper whey protein out there. Sign me up for that.

yeah become dependent on other countries for even more great idea.

[quote]apbt55 wrote:
yeah become dependent on other countries for even more great idea.[/quote]

It actually is.

Cheaper products and less wars.

[quote]orion wrote:
apbt55 wrote:
yeah become dependent on other countries for even more great idea.

It actually is.

Cheaper products and less wars.

[/quote]

It’s only cheaper to import products currently because the U.S. producers are so inefficient because of a long history of market distortions.

Ideally, U.S. producers would be more efficient and prices would go down that way also.

In any case, “protecting” U.S. producers from outside producers only makes them more inefficient.

I’m not an expert on the US Dairy industry, but I’m pretty sure this post is retarded.

First of all, $6 million of dairy exports to the US is less than peanuts, even if it were all restricted to the Pennsylvania market. Dairy sales in the US are measured in Billions, not millions. This would have literally no effect on the price for either sellers or buyers.

Also, the article you posted says that those duties were prohibited due to a trade agreement, so it isn’t screwing someone over, it’s living up to committments agreed to.

I didn’t see Israel blamed on the two other articles either.

[quote]orion wrote:
apbt55 wrote:
yeah become dependent on other countries for even more great idea.

It actually is.

Cheaper products and less wars.

[/quote]

yep

Here is an story taken from W. M. Curtiss’s The Tariff Idea, to explain protectionism.

[quote]
More than a century ago, Frederic Bastiat, a French
economist and an ardent opponent of protectionism, drew
on Daniel Defoe’s immortal classic, Robinson Crusoe,
to illustrate the evils of trade restrictions:
“You remember how Robinson Crusoe managed
to make a plank when he had no saw.”
“Yes; he felled a tree, and then, cutting the trunk
right and left with his hatchet, he reduced it to the
thickness of a board.”
“And that cost him much labour?”
“Fifteen whole days’ work.”
“And what did he live on during that time?”
“He had provisions.”
“What happened to the hatchet?”
“It was blunted by the work.”
“Yes; but you perhaps do not know this: that at
the moment when Robinson was beginning the work
he perceived a plank thrown by the tide upon the
seashore.”

"Happy accident! He of course ran to appropriate
it?"and began to reason thus with himself:
" ‘If I get this plank, it will cost me only the trouble
of carrying it, and the time needed to descend and
remount the cliff. But if I form a plank with my
hatchet, first of all, it will procure me fifteen days’
employment; then my hatchet will get blunt, which
will furnish me with the additional employment of
sharpening it; then I shall consume my stock of provisions,
which will be a third source of employment
in replacing them. Now, labour is wealth. It is clear
that· I should ruin myself by getting the plank. I must
protect my personal labour; and, now that I think of
it, I can even increase that labour by throwing back
the plank into the sea.’ "

Absurd Reasoning
“But this reasoning was absurd.”
“N0 doubt. It is nevertheless the reasoning of every
nation which protects itself by prohibition. It throws
back the plank which is offered in exchange for a
small amount of labour in order to exert a greater
amount of labour. Even in the labour of the Customhouse
officials it discovers a gain. That gain is represented
by the pains which Robinson takes to render
back to the waves the gift which they had offered him.
Consider the nation as a collective being, and you
will not find between its reasoning and that of Robinson
an atom of difference.”

time saved to something else?"
“What else?”
“As long as a man has wants to satisfy and time at
his disposal, there is always something to be done. I
am not bound to specify the kind of labour he would
in such a case undertake.”
“I see clearly what labour he could have escaped.”
"And I maintain that Robinson, with incredible
blindness, confounded the labour with its result, the
end with the means, and I am going to prove to
you … "
“There is no need. Here we have the system of
restriction or prohibition in its simplest form. If it
appear to you absurd when so put, it is because the
two capacities of producer and consumer are in this
case mixed up in the same individual.”
“Let us pass on, therefore, to a more complicated
example.”
“With all my heart. Some time afterwards, Robinson
having met with Friday, they united their labour
in a common work. In the morning they hunted for
six hours, and brought home four baskets of game.
In the evening they worked in the garden for six
hours, and obtained four baskets of vegetables.”

A Visiting Foreigner
"One day a canoe touched at the island. A goodlooking
foreigner landed, and was admitted to the

table of our two recluses. He tasted and commended
very much the produce .of the garden, and before taking
leave of his entertainers, spoke as follows:
"‘Generous islanders, I inhabit a country where
game is much more plentiful than here, but where
horticulture is quite unknown. It would be an easy
matter to bring you every evening four baskets of
game, if you will give me in exchange two baskets of
vegetables.’
"At these words Robinson and Friday retired to
consult, and the debate that took place is too interesting
not to be reported in extenso.
"Friday: What do you think of it?
"Robinson: If we close with. the proposal, we are ruined.
"F: Are you sure of that? Let us consider.
"R: The case is clear. Crushed by competition, our hunting
as a branch of industry is annihilated.
“F: What matters it” if we have the game?
"R: Theory! It will no longer be the product of our
labour.
"F: I beg your pardon, sir; for in order to have game we
must part with vegetables.
"R: Then, what shall we gain?
"F: The four baskets of game cost us six hours’ work.
The foreigner gives us them in exchange for two baskets
of vegetables, which cost us only three hours’ work. This
places three hours at our disposal.
"R: Say, rather, which are subtracted from our exertions.
There is our loss. Labour is wealth, and if we lose
a fourth part of our time we shall be less rich by a fourth.

"F: You are greatly mistaken, my good friend. We shall
have as much game, and the same quantity of vegetables,
and three hours at our disposal into the bargain. This is
progress, or there is no such thing in the world.
"R: You lose yourself in generalities! What should we
make of these three hours?
"F: We would do something else.
"R: Ah! I understand you. You cannot come to particulars.
Something else, something else-that is easily said.
Alternatives
"F: We can fish, we can ornament our cottage, we can
read the Bible.
"R: Utopia! Is there any.certainty that we should do
either the one or the other?
"F: Very well, if we have no wants to satisfy we can
rest. Is repose nothing?
"R: But while we repose we may die of hunger.
"F: My dear friend, you have got into a vicious circle.
I speak uf a repose which will subtract nothing from our
supply of game and vegetables. You always forget that
by means of our foreign trade nine hours’ labour will
give us the same quantity of provisions that we obtain at
present with twelve.
"R: It is very evident, Friday, that you have not been
educated in Europe, and that you have never read the
Moniteur Industriel. If you had, it would have taught
you this: that all tim~ saved is sheer loss. The important
thing is not to eat or consume, but to work. All that we

consume, if it· is not the direct produce of our labour,
goes for nothing. Do you want to know whether you are
rich? Never consider the enjoyments you obtain, but the
labour you undergo. This is what the Moniteur Industriel
would teach you. For myself, who have no pretensions
to be a theorist, the only thing I look at is the loss of
our hunting.
A Strange Idea
"F: What a strange turning upside down of ideas! But …
"R: No buts. Moreover, there are political reasons for
rejecting the interested offers of the perfidious foreigner.
"F: Political reasons!
"R: Yes, he only makes us these offers because they are
advantageous to him.
"F: So much the better, since they are for our advantage
likewise.
"R: Then by this traffic we should place ourselves in a
situation of dependence upon him.
"F: And he would place himself in dependence on us.
We should have need of his game, and he of our vegetables,
and we should live on terms of friendship.
"R: System! Do you want me to shut your mouth?
"F: We shall see about that. I have as yet heard no good
reason.
"R: Suppose the foreigner learns to cultivate a garden,
and that his island should prove more fertile than ours.
Do you see the consequence?
"F: Yes; our relations with the foreigner would cease. He

would take from us no more vegetables,. since he could
have them at home with less labour. He would bring us
no more game, since we should have nothing to give him
in exchange, and we should then be in precisely the
situation that you wish us in now.
Fears
"R: Improvident savage! You don’t see that after having
annihilated our hunting by inundating us with game,
he would annihilate our gardening by inundating us with
vegetables.
"F: But this would only last so long as we were in a
situation to give him something else; that is to say, so
long as we found something else which we could produce
with economy of labour for ourselves.
"R: Something else, something else! You always come
back to that. You are at sea, my good friend Friday;
there is nothing practical in your views.
"The debate was long prolonged, and, as often happens,
each remained wedded to his own opinion. But
Robinson possessing a great influence over Friday, his
opinion prevailed, and when the foreigner arrived to
demand a reply, Robinson said to him:
" 'Stranger, in order to induce us to accept your proposal,
we must be assured of two things: The first is, that
your island is no· better stocked with game than ours, for
we want to fight only with equal weapons. The second is
that you will lose by the bargain. For, as in every exchange
there is necessarily a gaining and a losing party,

we should be dupes, if you were not the loser. What have
you got to say?’
“‘Nothing,’ replied the foreigner; and, bursting out
laughing, he regained his canoe.”*

[quote]orion wrote:
apbt55 wrote:
yeah become dependent on other countries for even more great idea.

It actually is.

Cheaper products and less wars.

[/quote]

Like Oil. Why develop our own if we can just buy it from abroad.

That worked out great didn’t it?

[quote]hedo wrote:
orion wrote:
apbt55 wrote:
yeah become dependent on other countries for even more great idea.

It actually is.

Cheaper products and less wars.

Like Oil. Why develop our own if we can just buy it from abroad.

That worked out great didn’t it?

[/quote]

It would have, but did you keep your mitts to yourselves?

No you did not.

FYI, you get most of your oil from Canada,Venezuela and Mexico.

[quote]JustTheFacts wrote:
Since US dairy farmers weren’t having a tough enough time – its a-hole to the rescue… of the Israeli farmer…

US removes import levy on Israeli milk products
Following diplomatic efforts, President Obama signs memo eliminating import subcharge on dairy products from Israel. Exports of milk products to US totaled $6 million in 2007
10/22/09

The United States has removed the import subcharge on dairy products from Israel, following diplomatic efforts exerted by the Israeli Embassy in Washington and the Israeli Agriculture Ministry.

Up to now, most of the world’s countries exporting milk products to the United States have been forced to pay a levy protecting local production. The financial damage caused to Israel’s farmers due to this tax amounted to tens of thousands of dollars.

President Barack Obama was recently asked to solve the problem, and several days ago he signed a presidential memo eliminating the subcharge on exports of dairy products from Israel to the US.

‘American colleague nearly gave up’

The memo followed diplomatic efforts on the part of Yaakov Poleg, the Agriculture Ministry’s agricultural attachÃ?© at the Israeli Embassy in Washington. Poleg managed to prove to the US Trade Representative that the trade agreement between Israel and the US prohibits placing taxes on exports from Israel.

Following the diplomatic efforts, the American authorities agreed this week to remove Israel from the list of countries forced to pay a similar levy in the future…

“Thanks to hard work, the American authorities have removed Israel from the list of countries on which the levy is imposed,” says Poleg.

“Moreover, in light of the fact that Israel was removed from the list through a presidential declaration, there is no fear that it will be placed on us again in the future.”
http://www.ynet.co.il/english/articles/0,7340,L-3792821,00.html

US Farmers’ incomes dry up as milk prices plunge about 50%
By Sue Kirchhoff, USA TODAY

WEST GROVE, Pa. – Milk prices have plunged by about 50% from the historic highs of last summer, pummeling producers such as Walt Moore, a fourth-generation farmer whose family has worked the rolling fields of southeastern Pennsylvania for nearly a century.

“If these prices stay low through 2009, there’s going to be a lot of producers that don’t make it,” Moore says, noting that several nearby dairy operators have already decided to sell their herds and get out of the business.

While many producers managed to sock away profits early last year, they still might not be able to survive. “This time, the rainy day will last a lot longer than one day,” Moore says.

Dairy operations across the country are taking an enormous hit as prices plummet. The number of dairy cows being sent to slaughter has risen by about 20% from last year, as desperate farmers cull their herds and sell at fire-sale prices. Adding to the problem, banks are less willing or able to extend farmers’ loan payments amid the financial turmoil.

The U.S. Agriculture Department has begun providing emergency aid, though the National Milk Producers Federation (NMPF) in a recent letter to President Obama warned that thousands of farms and tens of thousands of jobs could be lost this year without more aggressive federal efforts…
http://www.usatoday.com/money/industries/food/2009-03-24-dairy-farms_N.htm

Milk prices in Pa. get a boost to help farmers
(AP) – 6 days ago

HARRISBURG, Pa. – The Pennsylvania Milk Marketing Board is temporarily boosting the minimum price of milk across the state by a few cents a gallon to soothe hurting dairy farmers.

The three-member board voted Thursday to increase the premium paid to farmers by 23 percent.

For farmers, that means getting an extra 50 cents, or $2.65, per 100 pounds of milk. For consumers, that is expected to mean paying about 4 cents extra on a gallon of milk at retail.

The higher price is effective Nov. 1 through Dec. 31.

In September, Gov. Ed Rendell asked the agency to help dairy farmers, saying Pennsylvania’s milk producers were facing prices that were 40 percent lower than the prior year.

Dairy prices have dropped amid low demand. Pennsylvania is the nation’s fifth-largest dairy state.
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5ir8qdTfOfyifMFxXUfBtVu3QtBSwD9BGB8401

Gotta love the immpeccable timing… what a coincidence![/quote]

Welcome back, man! I was wondering where you were. You always come with the FACTS!!

Amazing how Israel just owns us…sad and amazing. George Soros and Rahm Emmanuel are really paying off for these elitist scum.

[quote]orion wrote:
hedo wrote:
orion wrote:
apbt55 wrote:
yeah become dependent on other countries for even more great idea.

It actually is.

Cheaper products and less wars.

Like Oil. Why develop our own if we can just buy it from abroad.

That worked out great didn’t it?

It would have, but did you keep your mitts to yourselves?

No you did not.

FYI, you get most of your oil from Canada,Venezuela and Mexico.[/quote]

Yep. Formatting is a little off, but you get the point.

[quote]
Crude Oil Imports (Top 15 Countries)
(Thousand Barrels per Day)
Country Aug-09 Jul-09 YTD 2009 Aug-08 YTD 2008
CANADA 2,007 2,110 1,928 1,873 1,926
MEXICO 1,057 985 1,126 1,292 1,209
VENEZUELA 1,007 865 1,014 1,146 1,049
NIGERIA 877 858 694 1,035 998
SAUDI ARABIA 745 1,137 1,022 1,533 1,537
IRAQ 500 365 459 663 675
ALGERIA 404 143 253 348 313
ANGOLA 352 320 484 483 512
BRAZIL 269 375 332 169 217
COLOMBIA 260 286 261 247 190
RUSSIA 229 267 266 120 126
KUWAIT 148 261 179 203 205
EQUATORIAL GUINEA 132 123 96 123 68
ECUADOR 131 112 192 291 209
UNITED KINGDOM 72 45 112 41 58

Total Imports of Petroleum (Top 15 Countries)
(Thousand Barrels per Day)
Country Aug-09 Jul-09 YTD 2009 Aug-08 YTD 2008
CANADA 2,524 2,639 2,459 2,247 2,473
MEXICO 1,159 1,316 1,265 1,401 1,318
VENEZUELA 1,070 959 1,138 1,305 1,207
NIGERIA 917 879 735 1,166 1,066
SAUDI ARABIA 766 1,153 1,053 1,573 1,556
ALGERIA 551 329 473 530 526
RUSSIA 512 637 621 490 491
IRAQ 500 365 461 663 675
ANGOLA 364 320 494 495 523
BRAZIL 275 392 350 208 245
COLOMBIA 269 305 284 257 210
UNITED KINGDOM 225 188 248 222 218
VIRGIN ISLANDS 223 273 291 298 326
NETHERLANDS 160 118 144 143 163
KUWAIT 148 261 182 203 208

http://www.eia.doe.gov/pub/oil_gas/petroleum/data_publications/company_level_imports/current/import.html

This is rather like the New York Post, back in the day, publishing a screaming utterly giant-font headline (took up half the page): “FORD TO NYC: DROP DEAD” when President Ford refused to make a special loan of a billion dollars or more to the city.

Ford didn’t say that, nor is the action equivalent.

And Obama didn’t say FU to dairy farmers, nor is the above action equivalent.

[quote]Bill Roberts wrote:
This is rather like the New York Post, back in the day, publishing a screaming utterly giant-font headline (took up half the page): “FORD TO NYC: DROP DEAD” when President Ford refused to make a special loan of a billion dollars or more to the city.

Ford didn’t say that, nor is the action equivalent.

And Obama didn’t say FU to dairy farmers, nor is the above action equivalent.[/quote]

agreed.

Squats and soy milk?

[quote]hedo wrote:
orion wrote:
apbt55 wrote:
yeah become dependent on other countries for even more great idea.

It actually is.

Cheaper products and less wars.

Like Oil. Why develop our own if we can just buy it from abroad.

That worked out great didn’t it?

[/quote]

I’m pretty sure that was forced. We had entanglements, which is not good. However free trade is not.

[quote]meangenes wrote:
Squats and soy milk?[/quote]

Buy a cow and a bale of hay and some ‘milk pills’ it would be cheaper to do it that way, plus you’d be getting real whole milk.

[quote]orion wrote:
hedo wrote:
orion wrote:
apbt55 wrote:
yeah become dependent on other countries for even more great idea.

It actually is.

Cheaper products and less wars.

You miss the point. We buy it from abroad because the government won’t allow us to develo our own resources.

Like Oil. Why develop our own if we can just buy it from abroad.

That worked out great didn’t it?

It would have, but did you keep your mitts to yourselves?

No you did not.

FYI, you get most of your oil from Canada,Venezuela and Mexico.

[/quote]

[quote]hedo wrote:
orion wrote:
hedo wrote:
orion wrote:
apbt55 wrote:
yeah become dependent on other countries for even more great idea.

It actually is.

Cheaper products and less wars.

You miss the point. We buy it from abroad because the government won’t allow us to develo our own resources.

Like Oil. Why develop our own if we can just buy it from abroad.

That worked out great didn’t it?

It would have, but did you keep your mitts to yourselves?

No you did not.

FYI, you get most of your oil from Canada,Venezuela and Mexico.

[/quote]

Well that is obviously idiotic, but since it is like it is free trade helps to make the best of it-