T Nation

Update: Mood Issues when on Injection

Took a break from trt and tried clomid but it had very little effect. Now i am a week and a half into 50mg 2x a week sub q. I know this dose gets me around 250 total and 75 free and e2 around 57 based on all my past labs. The issue has always been that I am moody and do t feel as good. I felt better on clomid at 150 total and 45 free but I have no other labs for anything other than free and total on clomid cause my doc is an idiot which I am trying a new doc in a few weeks.
Why do I feel so moody and grumpy? My wife wants me to stop trt all together due to the strain it puts on our marriage. Any thoughts or opinions or anyone else have this issue? If I get my t numbers up could this go away?

I would venture to say that your problem is one of ratio. That is a serious E2 for that T level, unless this is in some metric that I’m not familiar with. You also may be aggravating a completely different condition - like a mineral deficiency. Your T is simly not high enough for that E2, Probably. Do you have lab ranges?

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See range. I know my e2 is out of whack. I am going to try 200mg a week eod if I can get a script for that

Go to discountlabs (dot) com and search Fatigue Panel (I added a few labs in addition). It will list labs that you can print and take to your doc to test. I did this and figured out why I didn’t feel good on TRT regardless of the protocol. Turns out I needed to supplement Iron, B12 and ashwagandha and it has been life changing. I also have thyroid issues that I haven’t resolved yet but I’m feeling great.

Here’s everything I tested for:

CBC With Differential/Platelet; Comp. Metabolic Panel (14); Lipid Panel w/ Chol/HDL Ratio; Iron and TIBC; Testosterone, Free+Total LC/MS; Testosterone,Free and Total; Hemoglobin A1c; Thyroxine (T4) Free, Direct, S; DHEA-Sulfate; Cortisol; TSH; Prolactin; Reverse T3, Serum; Estradiol, Sensitive; Thyroglobulin Antibody; Vitamin D; Vitamin B12; Ferritin, Serum; Thyroid Peroxidase (TPO) Ab; Triiodothyronine (T3), Free; progesterone; Sex Horm Binding Glob, Serum; Venipuncture

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If you need a doc and willing to pay out of pocket about $150/month I can put you in touch with one that will prescribe 200mg/week sent to your door. Email is in bio. There are plenty docs out there that will do the same.

Thanks. I see my current endo wednesday and am going to show him the list. I relocated about a year ago and there aren’t many docs here in northern Colorado but I think I found one just gotta wait a month to get in. I’ll keep the you in mind if it doesn’t work out.

I believe @physiolojik (who doesn’t have time to post here) who is a legit endo has a practice in Colorado. If I was there I would be getting in with him in a heart beat. His email is in his bio. You should definitely reach out to him and see if it’s a good fit.

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I see your problem, you are profoundly estrogen dominant. Your TT is low and estrogen high, either you need to inject daily or step away from TRT because you’ll always going to feel bad when estrogen dominant.

You are a high aromatizer meaning you excessively convert T -->E2, daily dosing is really your only option unless you want to continue to have problems.

As long as you are estrogen dominant you will always act like a menopausal women, this is how I felt when TT was 496 and estrogen 53. See how TT is lower than midrange and E2 above range, this is estrogen dominance.

You need TT higher in relation to estrogen, example TT 800 and E2 25-30. This is how natural men’s hormone profile look, yours is upside down.

It sounds like your wife is not concerned about your health or having healthy testosterone levels, maybe she just wants you to quit TRT to make it easier on herself and doesn’t care if you have low testosterone.

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He is testosterone deficient! Come on guys! 50mg twice a week and you expect him to feel good with this? Guys!!

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My estrogen before TRT was 48 (top range was 45) so technically I could be considered “estrogen dominant” and TRT + fixing deficiencies has fixed me. Don’t get E2 in your head or you’ll blame everything on it when most likely it’s some other shit going on. Until you get thorough full spectrum labs done no one knows what’s going on with you.

This OP is the perfect example of a guy that may require a low dose AI in order for TRT to work if daily dosing doesn’t show good results.

If the OP triples his TT levels, his E2 will likely be 100+ because his body favors estrogen dominance.

I completely disagree!

Get his T levels up! That is how s ONLY concern right now!

I literally tripled my total T levels and estrogen went from 48 to 77. I feel a million times better than when using an AI, low dose AI and on less of a dose with no AI (100-160mg). I think telling him things like he is estrogen dominant, needs an AI and his E2 will be on the hundreds is only going to make him attribute any little thing to estrogen. I was there. Ksman literally said the exact same thing and I spent over 6 months miserable until I stopped doing what he said. For sake of argument he very well may be all of what you say but we really don’t have enough info to have any clue and until he gets labs & tries different things no one really knows what will happen. I just think putting that in his head will cause him to end up feeling worse. I’m not against someone using an AI if it works for them either.

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Ratio. He’s out of ratio, you found one that works for you.

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Yes 100% and the only thing we really know with this guy is that he doesn’t have enough lab work to know what’s going on with him. That, and the fact that what works for me likely won’t have the same effect on him. I just think saying he is doomed is going to put him in a state of mind that is hard to get out of.

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We’re not talking about you, you feel good at those levels and that great and all, but the OP is not doing so well with estrogen dominance. He is describing moodiness and is easy to see why.

His T to E2 ratios are way off, he is not even close to where he needs to be.

I have never had an ai. I can see when on 7 pumps of fortesta gel on thighs my trt was 650 and free was 180 but my e2 was 80. I felt better but unstable. I am a big guy currently 320 down from 365. Im.in the gym again eating smart lifting and hiit cardio for the few years months. I just want to feel decent not like I’m 20 again, I just turned 40.

No. There is no need to try to adjust your own ratio. Simply get your free testosterone optimized and let the rest will fall into place on its own. It works 10 times out of 10.

I promise you will feel better if you commit to daily injections, you will be able to achieve higher T-E2 ratios than any protocol before it. Once I got E2 <30 and TT 400>, this is when things started improving for me.

I agree. Daily dosing really helped me