Hello. I’m getting things put together for my 2nd cycle. I’ll be running:
1-12wk Test E 500mg
1-10wk Tren E 400mg
1-10wk EQ 400mg
I have no experience with neither the tren nor the eq. If I were to run both and hit some bad sides I wouldn’t know for sure which one was causing it. Would it be better to skip the eq solely for the sake of controlling side effects? I’m mainly using the eq for the increased appetite.
Also, I was originally planning on letro. But I already have enough joint issues as it is and would like to avoid adding more to the mix. Would adex be enough for this cycle? Or should I stay with a low dose of letro due to the tren?
If you have never used EQ or Tren before to start them both out concurrently is potentially more of a gamble than one or the other individually of course. Jumping into the Tren pool with 10 weeks of enanthate or any number of weeks of enanthate is slightly less than ideal.
Speaking from personal experience it takes about a 5-7days for the “negative” side effects to dissipate[sp?] after your last shot of enanthate. Most guys are generally advised to steer towards Ace for their first tren go around since those sides will clear in 2-3 days after discontinuation, generally speaking. Having said that Tren E is way cheaper than Tren A so I understand the inclination to run it.
Also 5-7 days is not an eternity. Sides are usually excessive sweating and hydration needs, sex-drive issues, higher blood pressure and a complete knock to your aerobic power. If you overshoot your personal tren tolerance that’s what you’d have to deal with for a week or so. Only the blood pressure bothered me to the point where I thought it was getting to be too much.
IMO 400Tren to 500Test is not my ratio choice. In my body, nor19’s tend to hit me harder than most in terms of sex-drive issues. I can tolerate 300mg a week of tren or nandrolone but 400mg+ is where I notice the sides. My last cycle I ran 300mg a week of Tren E and 750mg TestE a week. Over a 2-1 test to tren ratio.
Most guys are ok with a 3-2 or 5-3 Test to tren ratio. Its important to keep both the ratio and the product totals in mind as well. I could not run 500mg of Tren a week even on 1500mg of Test. 500mg for me is just too much tren. Now mind you everyone is slightly different. I seem to be more sensitive to nor19’s than many as I said. But I’m also much more estrogen resistant than most.
750mg of Test, 300mg of tren and 350mg of dbol a week and I never needed any estrogen control product. Some guys get gyno off 500mg of test a week alone. So there always is variance.
A-dex would control your aromatization gyno from the test and eq but tren gyno, while rare comes from prolactin. If you truly want to cover your bases you’ll get some cabergoline. I did though again I never needed it at all. Good thing about caber is it does have a secondary benefit between the sheets so to speak
If your dose is low enough letro or adex or any AI can be tolerated.
I’m not saying don’t run all three; just go in with eyes wide open. If you choose to pick between EQ and tren go with the one more suited to your training goals.
Thanks for the reply Saps! I’ve been following your log along with that of Furious George. This tren cycle is proving to be more of a beast than I had originally anticipated. Mainly due to the prolactin issue.
There’s probably no way I’ll be able to use the dose I first planned. I may have to start at 250mg tren and work it up to a max of 300mg if I tolerate it well enough. Using the ace makes sense but I’m stuck with the e since I already have it.
I’ll most likely use adex just as a precaution. Hopefully I wont develop prolactin gyno if I can control the estro. I would opt to have caber handy just in case but the price is ridiculous. But I can get it fairly quickly if it comes to that point.
I’ll drop the EQ for the sake of simplicity. I wanted it to increase my appetite but hopefully I’ll be okay with the B12 sup that RB recommends.
I would probably be better with a test/eq cycle but I already have the tren so f it. lol. The only thing that’ll stop me is blood pressure issues.
Oh man. It can’t be THAT bad can it? And yes, I’m looking to bulk.
Most people agree that tren is better for cutting, but it should be okay to bulk considering the major strength increases. The big problem is the appetite. So you don’t think that the supercharged B12 is going to do much good here?
You make a really good point about the recovery issues. I honestly don’t care about the sleeplessness, but it WILL have an impact on growth. That truly never crossed my mind. Thanks for that tidbit!
Oh boy. So this might be a test/eq cycle afterall. I could save the tren for my cut so it’s still okay.
[quote]AlteredState wrote:
You didn’t say what your goals for this cycle are.
If it’s mass, then drop the tren but if its leanness, then drop the EQ.
I suspect you want mass, since you talk about using the EQ for appetite boosting.
Personally, I will never attempt to use tren for bulking again, since it erases my already-poor appetite. Also, the night sweats and insomnia make it damaging to recovery also.[/quote]
A-S makes great points above and yes it can be that bad. I was running 150mg of Tren E twice a week. After a month or six weeks I tried to add 50mg ED of Tren Ace for a super strength boost,… or so I thought. On the functional equivalent of 600mg a week of tren I got tren dick, was sleeping 90 minutes a night, needed an extra gallon of fluid, and got out of breathe wiping my ass. It was crippling! Three days into this additional tren ace I stopped; I had to. I dropped back to TrenE only and in 2-3 days I was fine again. Everyone’s tolerance level is different of course. But if and when the tren sides hit they hit hard.
Re: tren for bulking versus cutting. I didn’t add my tren until my week 2. During my cycle I gained 8lbs the first week and like 12-13 by the end of week 2. However, at my heaviest I was only 18lbs above starting point that means from week 3-9 I never was more than 6 lbs heavier than the end of week 2. Now you could say I lost a bit of bodyfat with tren which I think is true. But equally true is that I added dbol starting in week 3 and only netted 6 further lbs on dbol, test and tren as a three-some.
Admittedly, at my stage in my gear career those were still decent gains. Again my focus was strength so I was not per se trying to bulk up or anything like that. But as A-S mentioned tren can make eating a literal chore for some. I gained so much weight the first 2 weeks because I could literally feed myself up. After a couple weeks on tren sometimes I could go half a day without eating unless I forced myself to eat.
Finally gear should keep for years after its produced. So you could get some EQ and save the tren. You could still run a trifecta. Some try to use EQ to offset the tren lack of hunger syndrome. Further some on EQ say they notice an increased aerobic benefit; though I doubt it would off-set tren’s crippling effects.
It just gets worse and worse…lol. Okay, I will heed the advice from both of you. The whole test/tren/eq cycle popped into my head after RJ said it was an excellent bulker. In reality I would most likely drop the tren midway due to the sides. A wasted cycle since it would end up test only. I wasn’t planning on having eq on hand but knowing me I would rush to get some as a replacement. That would have me running test for 16 weeks or so.
I will heed your advice and use the tren with a later cycle. Thanks again guys for saving me a lot of potential frustration.
And that’s fine but again please understand I’m not advising against you using tren. Just be aware of the potential bad stuff. A-S and I pointed out most of the bad.
But the reason we both have tried it multiple times and likely will again is despite all the above bad, it has overwhelming good. In my first five weeks on test and tren my squat was up nearly 100lbs.
I was doing DB rows with 35lbs more per arm. My 2 board press was up 45lbs. I was doing sets of 8 at weights which I could not do for 2 reps just 5 weeks earlier. I wasn’t trying to lose any bodyfat but I did despite gaining scale weight.
So sure there is potential for bad. But the good is oh so good. Believe me when I tell you I’m considering running Test, Tren and EQ myself next go around
