T Nation

UK Conservatism ?


#1

Labour leadership could be going to Jeremy Corben next election and quite a few people I know are supportive of him and his old labour politics. He has made statements that 70-80% tax is not too high, he is against cutting welfare benefits, he is against the renewal of trident etc.

I noticed quite a few conservatives supportive of many of his general points and rich people supportive on his tax stance but at odds with him on cultural and national issues relating to immigration etc. This made me think of how much conservatism and nationalism is so different in certain countries. How do these classifications of conservatives by country sound ? Keep in mind these are wildly painting with a broad brush for general grouping.

UK conservatives

High taxes
Big state
Social security net
Cultural heritage
National identity
Anti immigration
Anti multiculturalism
labour movement and blue collar identity

U.S conservatives

Small government
Gun rights
Strong military
Free market
Low taxes
Religious identity
National heritage
Illegal immigration

Russian conservatives

Religious identity
Strong focus on being against gay and alternative lifestyles
Big state
Big military
Strong leaders
Militarism

Arab conservatives

Religious identity
Religious law
Strong focus on being against gay and alternative lifestyles
Internationalism / pan arab unity
Strong leaders
Historical narratives

Interesting how conservative ideas in one country are completely at odds with others. I find the cultural differences quite fascinating.


#2

Not so strange at all.

All a conservative is is someone who wants to keep (conserve) things as they are, and as they have been.

The radical liberal fringe of the English revolted against the conservative English in North America back in the 18th century and started their own country.

Now that enough time has passed, the radical liberal ideology that sparked this revolt has become thought of as “conservative”.


#3

[quote]Varqanir wrote:
Not so strange at all.

All a conservative is is someone who wants to keep (conserve) things as they are, and as they have been.

The radical liberal fringe of the English revolted against the conservative English in North America back in the 18th century and started their own country.

Now that enough time has passed, the radical liberal ideology that sparked this revolt has become thought of as “conservative”.[/quote]

Yeah i guess in general way that is the meaning however for example in England, much of the conservative crowd are for things that don’t currently and never have existed, so they are not conserving anything they are more like revolutionary nationalists in the national socialist sense ( not that they are politically similar but rather they are not yearning for the past or the present system but a new one that has never existed in the nation)

For example taking a look at some popular sentiment amongst the right wing in the UK you see:

Higher and tighter corporation tax
Higher tax brackets
Secular strong state
Anti interventionist
strong labour movement and rhetoric ie British jobs for British workers
Nationalisation of major services arguing it is a natural monopoly
pro state run manufacturing and other government jobs as a form of job creation and good living
for regular people

Many of these things have never been and are not currently happening. So they would be revolutionary conservaties in the national socialist vein. Not that they share racial or religious or any other ideology with the Nazi’s.


#4

The last conservative Prime Minister I can remember was W.S. Churchill.


#5

[quote]oldtimer3 wrote:
The last conservative Prime Minister I can remember was W.S. Churchill. [/quote]

Is that the same Churchill, that served in the UK government as President of the Board of Trade,Home Secretary, Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster,Minister of Munitions, Secretary of State for War, Secretary of State for Air and Secretary of State for the Colonies? As a Liberal?


#6

[quote]TQB wrote:

[quote]oldtimer3 wrote:
The last conservative Prime Minister I can remember was W.S. Churchill. [/quote]

Is that the same Churchill, that served in the UK government as President of the Board of Trade,Home Secretary, Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster,Minister of Munitions, Secretary of State for War, Secretary of State for Air and Secretary of State for the Colonies? As a Liberal?[/quote]

I think you’re forgetting a more important post he served in as a conservative.


#7

[quote]Legalsteel wrote:

[quote]TQB wrote:

[quote]oldtimer3 wrote:
The last conservative Prime Minister I can remember was W.S. Churchill. [/quote]

Is that the same Churchill, that served in the UK government as President of the Board of Trade,Home Secretary, Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster,Minister of Munitions, Secretary of State for War, Secretary of State for Air and Secretary of State for the Colonies? As a Liberal?[/quote]

I think you’re forgetting a more important post he served in as a conservative. [/quote]

Yes, but that was in a coalition government between Conservatives, Labour and Liberals. There was nothing particularly conservative about his actions. In fact, he handed over the running of the country to Attlee and Bevan (both Labour) while he got on with winning the war. This is not to denigrate Churchill, who was exactly what Britain needed in 1940, but the American right-wing hero worshipping on him as a particularly conservative icon is misplaced unless you refer to his premiership in 1951-55 when he did run a Conservative government.


#8

[quote]TQB wrote:

[quote]Legalsteel wrote:

[quote]TQB wrote:

[quote]oldtimer3 wrote:
The last conservative Prime Minister I can remember was W.S. Churchill. [/quote]

Is that the same Churchill, that served in the UK government as President of the Board of Trade,Home Secretary, Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster,Minister of Munitions, Secretary of State for War, Secretary of State for Air and Secretary of State for the Colonies? As a Liberal?[/quote]

I think you’re forgetting a more important post he served in as a conservative. [/quote]

Yes, but that was in a coalition government between Conservatives, Labour and Liberals. There was nothing particularly conservative about his actions. In fact, he handed over the running of the country to Attlee and Bevan (both Labour) while he got on with winning the war. This is not to denigrate Churchill, who was exactly what Britain needed in 1940, but the American right-wing hero worshipping on him as a particularly conservative icon is misplaced unless you refer to his premiership in 1951-55 when he did run a Conservative government.[/quote]

As I wasn’t around during WW1 and an infant in WW2, yes it was 1951-55 that I remember. PM Eden was ousted because of Suez and Super Mac told us we “never had it so good.” After that it all went downhill as far as conservative traditional values were concerned!