T Nation

TT is 1353, I Don't Feel Different

I’m going to keep this brief. I started a TRT protocol on 9/11/18 of 300mg test cypionate once every two weeks. I had my third and final injection two Fridays ago. This has been a horrible experience for me, so I am going to discontinue this protocol.

I had a few tests done myself on 10/12.

Tt 1353
E2 31

Also had some thyroid labs, which are a little off because I am dialing in my thyroid meds. Sorry, did not get more extensive testing. It is costly.

Even so, shouldn’t I have high energy with TT levels this high? Shouldn’t my muscles be ripe for hypertrophy? I’ve been a bitch in the gym during the entire period I’ve been on TRT. I’m not even getting good workouts, so I sure as hell am not putting on muscle. Also, preworkout supps don’t appear to help matters.

I appreciate it if anyone has any insights or advice. I know with my limited testing there could be a host of other problems. But my experiences over the last month have made me very leery of TRT. I seem to see more people complaining about its side effects than proclaiming its benefits.

Thank you!

When in relation to your pin was your blood taken? Is that a trough reading?

SHBG, thyroid, vitD? Also 200mg TCyp every 14 days will mostly leave you feeling like shit as you trough out leading to your next shot. Why was the 3rd your final shot?

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I wouldn’t call what you’ve been doing TRT, injections every 2 weeks is ridiculous. Your testosterone levels are swinging wildly (like a woman on her period) and that’s why you feel the way you do. You need more testing to design a proper TRT protocol, minimum you need SHBG tested.

SHBG will dictate the type of protocol that will work for you. The reason why people have side effects on TRT is because they are working with incompetent doctors who don’t know what to do when a patient experiences side effects or how to design a proper TRT protocol.

200mg every 2 weeks which is something that was in practice more than 10 years ago during the first clinical trials. We see a lot of men quit TRT do to incompetent doctors.

A man will become a bitch when his estrogen is as high as a women’s.

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These are good for one thing only. Pump.

Other than that, its fancy caffeine, and some creatine. It isn’t magic, at all.

Some guys, including myself, did not feel “well” for a while after we started TRT, whether it was because anxiety, or other factors. Just fix your protocol, get labs, and be patient.

Yea that protocol is setting anyone up for failure with TRT.

I am so glad that I found this forum BEFORE I let my pcp talk me into some bullshit protocol like this. I refused to let her put me on this protocol, and luckily, I had read enough here before that first consultation pre TRT to be able to explain to her WHY I didn’t want her protocol (which was exactly what yours is at 200mg / E2Weeks). When she realized that I had really made an effort to research this, she agreed to let me self inject and gave me freedom to try my own protocol.

I have saved myself TONS of the problems that I read guys like you posting everyday.

Don’t give up man. Learn and convince your doc that you are competent enough to administer your own own injections and design a better protocol for yourself. If your doc won’t agree, then fire them and find another one. Remember, YOU are paying them (whether directly or through paying your insurance premium), not the other way around. That makes you the guy signing the checks, which in turn makes you the boss. If you don’t like what you’re getting for your hard earned money, quit giving it to them and find someone else more worthy of your labors.

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Your terrible protocol has been discussed so I will skip that. Your body takes time to adjust to the new hormones before making physiological changes. You should just start to notice changes weeks 4-5 and it gets better from there. Not enough time yet… be patient and change your protocol to more frequent dosing.

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I second what @blshaw said. GIVE IT TIME. I’m looking at your dates you listed thinking “YOU JUST STARTED!”. 9/10/18 was last month. I dont know why you started trt but it’s not a magic bullet and you still have to do the work. Fix your protocol. If your self injecting then do 100 mg a week minimum. You could also do 50 mg every 3.5 days. It’s up to you but you have to do the work. I wouldnt even consult my doctor about the protocol change. Just do it. You will be glad you did.

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Because as systemlord says, this protocol isn’t really even TRT. The morons who put me on this protocol don’t even understand the basics of TRT.

Regarding thyroid… I have had Hashimoto’s thyroiditis since I was 12. Long story short, in the past few months I’ve had to dial in my medication because I was somewhat overmedicated.

I’ve found at that thyroid hormones affect, among other things, SHBG and testosterone. When I was overmedicated, my fT, TT, and bioavailable T were all on the low side. TT was 306 ng/dL. Free T was way below normal. My SHBG was somewhat elevated.

Now I’m somewhat undermedicated.

My labs from Friday 10/12 had my TSH at 9.7. My fT3 and fT4 were just below normal range. I’ve upped my meds. So, every day I will see some improvement until they are optimal.

The last time I had my vit D checked it was at 30, the bottom of normal range. Over the years it’s always at 30. I don’t get much sun. I have since started taking 5000 UIs of vitamin D per day.

I need to make a correction. It was actually 300 mg shots of cypionate.

I realize more lab work would be helpful, such as SHBG, but I’m just trying to get a rough idea why I don’t feel much different with a TT of about 300 ng/dL compared to 1353 ng/dL.

One week to the day after my third and final injection. I made a mistake. I’ve been receiving 300 mg injections.

I was on 300mg every 2 weeks for awhile. Like the first year of TRT. Wasn’t bad. I didn’t feel much though except workouts and muscles grew BUT AFTER WEEKS of being on.

Youre quitting WAY too early. You body is going thru a huge change adding test to it. Youre gonna be moody and bitchy for a bit until you stabilize.

However, that protocol will need revisions after blood work. I would stay on until you can hone the protocol.

Getting off will just make you feel like shit again, the way you did before TRT.

Too early to jump ship imo.

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Yeah I would say you need to get your levothyroxine or Armour thyroid dialed in first. If thats not functioning well then you won’t get much benefit from TRT. Because with it out of whack a lot of the symptoms are the same as low T.

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Yes, in retrospect I wish I researched TRT more before I started it. How do you feel now in terms of strength, energy levels, and mood?

@roscoe88 what do you mean you didn’t feel much except workouts? You noticed a rapid improvement at the gym? How do you feel now compared to before TRT?

I understand what you’re saying about quitting too soon. Clearly, the dose I’m on is too high and infrequent to be effective. My TT shouldn’t be 1353 ng/dL midway between injections.

I felt like I did prior to TRT, but just that workouts improved (strength) and musculature. I didn’t feel much in terms of sex drive or arousal.

Right now I’m on an EOD protocol and I think it’s working. Mentally I feel great. Mood wise too. More talkative and aggressive. Like more alpha. I think it’s likely due to a good level of T, plus a low level of e2 due to the protocol. I haven’t tested bloods yet on this protocol yet as it’s only been about 5 weeks.

My advice to you (if you really want to try TRT and make it work) is to first ride out the 300 mg protocol until you’re 6 weeks in. Get bloods and post them here. We can help you. The members here likely are more knowledgeable than your DR, as we’re all basically guinea pigs.

You need to see what your levels are, ALSO your shbg level. It’s of utmost importance. TRT is something that will only work if you fine tune it. You cannot just start injecting large amounts of test and think things will improve.

Stay the course and listen to the posters here. READ too. Learn how this works and your body works. I, after almost 2 years on TRT (injections and gel) am just finally thinking I’m dialing in correctly.

Your choice.

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I won’t lie to you and tell you I feel like super man, but all in all I feel good. It could be better I think, but now at least in days when I don’t feel so hot I can usually pin it down to a reason (didn’t sleep well the night before, strayed from the diet, stressful day at work, etc)

Compared to how I felt everyday before I started TRT I can tell you that it’s night and day. My motivation to workout hard is back. I’m seeing body composition changes. I’m not where I want to be yet but I will wait until my bloodwork on the 30th comes back to see if there is room to tweak a little. If so then I may try to go up another 10-20mg per week and re asses. If not, then I can live with how I feel now. Again, compared to before, I can’t complain at all.

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And there are other reasons to be on TRT outside of things you feel or notice, like the fact low T is bad for your heart, etc. Things you don’t likely feel.

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I talked to an admin (not a dr.) at the clinic I use. Of course, he’s adamant that 300 mg per shot is not high. He says that dosage once every two weeks is the right way to do TRT due to the Half-Life of testosterone cypionate being.

He completely resisted my “own research” and my suggestion that this protocol is not right. He said he never heard of someone having my symptoms of anxiety, depression, and insomnia with TRT.

He says I’d have to be on a much higher dose and that a TT of 1353 seven days after an injection is perfectly normal. He was basically as nice as he could possibly be about making me sound like I’m crazy.

This is just an update. When I had my TT and e2 levels checked, my main concern was that my e2 would be high. Compared to my TT, though, I don’t think an e2 in the low 30s is high. It may even be low considering how high my TT was.

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Wow it sounds like that guy read his entire viewpoint right out of an fda manual lol! Did you ask him if he even knows what SHBG is?

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Next time you see him show him this. This is what the drug looks like on your current protocol in your system over ten weeks.

This is what it would look like if you did the same exact dosage, but split it up into 75mg E3.5D