T Nation

Trying to Make My Own NPA


#1

Hey Jim Wendler. I’ve been reading on this forum and on yours, trying to gain correct information, while trying to stay true to your principles and books.
I would really appreciate your opinion on the programme shown belown. I hope I’ve done it right this time.

3 cycles of:
Throws and jumps are done prior to lifting - 20 total quality reps

Press - 5’s Pro (351 procentages)
Press - SSL 5x5
Chins - x100, Blast Strap Pushups - x100-200 (I have a hard time loading these myself so I just do a ton of reps?), Dumbbell Row - x50 ea., Fat Bar Curl - x25-50

Deadlift - 5’s Pro (351 procentages)
Deadlfit - SSL 5x5
Farmers Walk - 3-4x50-80m, Ab Work - x50-100, Kettlebell Swings - x50-100, Neck Work
Condition - Rowing Ergometer 5x300m

Bench Pess - 5’s Pro (351 procentages)
Bench Press - SSL 5x5
Chins - x100, Weigthed Dips x50-100 Dumbbell Row - x50 ea., Fat Bar Curl - x25-50

Power Clean - 5’s or 3’s Pro (what would be best?)
Squat - 5’s Pro (351 procentages)
Squat - SSL 5x5
Ab Work - x50, Kettlebell Swings - x50-100, Neck Work
Condition - Rowing Ergometer 2000m @ As fast as possible

2 cycles of (anchor):
Throws and jumps are done prior to lifting - 20 total quality reps

Press - 3/5/1, Push for PR on week 1 and 3, Followed by jokers.
Press - FSL 5x5
Chins - x100, Dumbbell Bench Press x50-100, Dumbbell Row - x50 ea., Fat Bar Curl - x50-100

Deadlift - 3/5/1, Push for PR on week 1 and 3, Followed by jokers.
Deadlift - FSL 5x5
Farmers Walk - 3-4x50-80m, Ab Work - x50-100, Kettlebell Swings - x50-100, Neck Work
Condition - Rowing Ergometer 5x300m

Bench Pess - 3/5/1, Push for PR on week 1 and 3, Followed by jokers.
Bench Press - FSL 5x5
Chins - x100, Weigthed Dips x50-100 Dumbbell Row - x50 ea., Fat Bar Curl - x50-100

Power Clean - 3/5/1, Push for PR on week 1 and 3, Followed by jokers.
Squat - 3/5/1, Push for PR on week 1 and 3, Followed by jokers.
Squat - FSL 5x5
Ab Work - x50-100, Kettlebell Swings - x50-100, Neck Work
Condition - Rowing Ergometer 2000m @ As fast as possible

Everyday: 100x band pull aparts, 2 mile walk, mobility

  1. Would the BBS work out instead of SSL in the leader? If so, how would I program it, as the SSL with BBS rep scheme (I think I saw you saying this somwhere on this forum)? For all movements or just for one UB and one LB, as stated on your site? I would really like to do it for Squat and press, as I really liked doing it for press when I did your ‘Building a Monolieth’.
  2. Could the FSL be reversed in the anchor for some added ‘short term’ frequency? (if this is retarded, then simply don’t answer it. Just liked it from when I did the Strength Challenge)
  3. Is the programming something that would work? Have i understood the Leader and anchor correctly?
  4. Can option two (for example week 1: 75,80,85% instead of 65,75,85), from the 531 second edition book, be used for the leader, as I am not going for PR’s on these cyles?

I’m really excited for your new book to come!

Thank you for your time! It’s really appreciated!


#2

I’m always really hesitant to chime in on these because a) I’m not Jim and b) I’ve only been running 531 for six months. However, since no-one’s said anything so far I wanted to pipe up.

I think it looks good from what I understand of Jim’s principles and what I understand of how especially the Beyond programming works (both of which are limited). I do have a couple of questions more about your thinking behind this.

Firstly, it looks great in theory - which means that I probably wouldn’t be able to fit it into my own schedule. I’ve got a young family and I work about 40 to 50 hours a week so while I’m not run off my feet by any means, I have two priorities above training that get given my time first. If I was single, different story. I’m not sure of your circumstances but I wanted to raise the question: is this something you’ll be able to complete in full 75% of the time?

Following on from that, what of this is ‘unmissable’ and what can you miss if time is pressing? Just looking at it, I get the impression that everything is kind of equally important, so my question really is whether you have a back up plan and/or have you given thought to what you could drop for a day if needed.

I get around a lot of that by doing things between my main sets, so if I’m really rushed one day I’m not going to miss so much my cutting away chunks of assistance.


#3

Hey MarkKo! Thanks you your reply! I think you have a really cool perspective on this topic!
The leader (first 3 cycles) is something I’ve done before, and it only take me about 45 minutes to get through the 5’s Pro + SSL, depending on the week ofcourse. On my upperbody day, I’ll be supersetting all of my pulling with my pressing as I’ve always done, which spares time too!
This plan, from what I’ve tried yet, really dosen’t take that long! For the most part I think it takes me 90 minutes to get through, and this is inklusive conditioning.
If I am pressed on time, I’ll always be able to trash the assistance, but it hasn’t been an issue yet and I’ve been doing stuff like this for a while!

Thank you for taking your time to answer this, and for you time perspective! It’s always good to see things diffrently.


#4

1 – You should be able to do BBS instead of SSL, or you can even do BBS for some lifts and SSL for others to mix and match.

3 – It looks to me like the accessory volume should be reduced. I would do chins one day and dumbbell rows another, but not both for each press and bench day, throughout. For the Leader, I would eliminate the blast strap pushups, weighted dips and kettlebell swings for those cycles.


#5

Hey revchad! Thanks a lot for your response! This really makes sense, and I don’t know why I didn’t see it myself. But thanks for pointing it out, I really appreciate it!


#6

It looks like Jim allows a little bodyweight push assistance. I think it would be great with a little dips and pushups? You’ve got a point with the rows and chins, thanks for that!
Anyway, I really appreciate the reply!


#7

[quote=“Manze, post:6, topic:220694”]…
Assistance = Push x 25-50 total reps, Pull x 25-50 total reps, core/single leg x 25-50 total reps (this is per workout)…

It looks like Jim allows a little bodyweight push assistance. I think it would be great with a little dips and pushups?
[/quote]

I think it is important to always keep in mind what Wendler says about the push and pull of training: if you push something in, you need to pull else something out. So you have to not try to do everything at once, and when you look to add something you have to look for what to remove too. You are looking at the fact that in that program he has 25-50 push, but you are overlooking that he also has only 25-50 pull and 25-50 core. In the program as you originally wrote it, you had on your press and bench days 150 pulling assistance reps (between chins and rows) along with 25-50 curls, and on your deadlift and squat days you had 100-200 core assistance reps (between abs and swings). Given the high volume of pushing and low back work in the supplemental lifts, I was thinking it most valuable to keep in the pulling and ab work in the assistance, and if you are regularly doing 100 chins and 100 ab reps, to just cut out the pushing assistance altogether for the Leader cycles (and push it back in during the Anchor when your supplemental lift volume is pulled lower). That was my sense of it all, anyways. Of course, you can also include push assistance, but then you might want to reduce the pull volume some. Really, though, since you might want to just do the assistance exactly as Wendler wrote it in the section you quoted: 25-50 reps for each category each training day. At least that is what I would do, but as Aleister Crowley says, “Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law.”


#8

This was great. Thanks for remindind of the “if you push someting in, remove something”. I get you point and I see what you’re saying about leaving the push assistance out all together until the anchor.

Thank you for the reminder and help!


#9

Do you know what percentage to use for the BBS if I decide to go with that? Would it be the second set, as the first set would seem to light compared to the information on Boring But Strong on Jims website (Not saying that the first set percentage would be too easy though).


#10

What part of Jim’s website are you referencing? Do you mean when he posted the Boring But Strong Challenge? If so, the challenge starts at 70%, ends at 85% after months of building up, and you can see that the assistance is extremely minimal for that challenge. It is also worth noting that the rest is kept minimal, so while sets of 5 at 70% of training max might not be heavy, doing 10 sets with only 60 seconds rest between sets can be enough of a workout, especially if you keep a focus on the quality of the reps (e.g., focus on good bar speed). Currently, I am doing BBS with bench and squat at 60% with 60 seconds between sets. I do not recall whether or not Wendler has a general recommendation for BBS percentages, so off the cuff I would say 60%, 70%, or FSL percentages but definitely not SSL percentages (which are the sorts of weights for BBS that it seems one would only build up to over time with assistance cut way back and that constitute a challenge). If you are pushing in 5 more sets, what will you pull out? Adjusting the weight down (from SSL to FSL or lower) seems the easiest adjustment for going from 5x5 to 10x5. So, if you want to do BBS with higher weight, maybe do the challenge at some point and follow it all as written, but for the program you have I would just go with 60-70% or FSL percentages for the BBS sets, and always focus on rep quality.


#11

I just re-readed the blog, and I see you’re right. I can imagine that it would be tough to get through!

So from what I’ve learned from the thread I would do something like what’s shown below?:

3 cycles of:
Throws and jumps are done prior to lifting - 20 total quality reps

Press - 5’s Pro (Maybe with part two percentages?)
Press - BBS (FSL percentages?)
Chins - x100

Deadlift - 5’s Pro
Deadlfit - BBS (FSL Percentages?)
Farmers Walk - 3-4x50-80m, Ab Work - x50-100
Condition - Rowing Ergometer 5x300m

Bench Pess - 5’s Pro
Bench Press - BBS (FSL Percentages?)
Dumbbell Row - x50-100 ea.

Power Clean - 5’s or 3’s Pro (what would be best?)
Squat - 5’s Pro
Squat - BBS
Ab Work - x50-100
Condition - Rowing Ergometer 2000m @ As fast as possible

2 cycles of (anchor):
Throws and jumps are done prior to lifting - 20 total quality reps

Press - 3/5/1, Push for PR on week 1 and 3, Followed by jokers.
Press - FSL 5x5
Chins - x100, Dumbbell Bench Press x50-100, Fat Bar Curl - x50-100

Deadlift - 3/5/1, Push for PR on week 1 and 3, Followed by jokers.
Deadlift - FSL 5x5
Farmers Walk - 3-4x50-80m, Ab Work - x50-100, Kettlebell Swings - x50-100, Neck Work
Condition - Rowing Ergometer 5x300m

Bench Pess - 3/5/1, Push for PR on week 1 and 3, Followed by jokers.
Bench Press - FSL 5x5
Weigthed Dips x50-100 Dumbbell Row - x50-100 ea., Fat Bar Curl - x50-100

Power Clean - 3/5/1, Push for PR on week 1 and 3, Followed by jokers.
Squat - 3/5/1, Push for PR on week 1 and 3, Followed by jokers.
Squat - FSL 5x5
Ab Work - x50-100, Kettlebell Swings - x50-100, Neck Work
Condition - Rowing Ergometer 2000m @ As fast as possible

Everyday: 100x band pull aparts, 2 mile walk, mobility

BBS follows the prilepin’s theory better for the leader than?
Jim would still recommend something like this, then I could trash all the consideration and take 1-2 cycle of each to try it out:

I hadn’t seen the new SVR before now, which looks fun, so the above template could’ve been fun to try out.


#12

Looks much better than the original to me. It might be good to go, but I would suggest some minor changes.

Wendler generally recommends volume work for 6 weeks, so you would probably do Leader for two cycles and Anchor for 3 cycles.

In the Anchor, you want the assistance work to be “higher” but not necessarily high. The focus should be on the main lifts, particularly if you are planning to do some jokers. So, I would reduce the assistance work in the Anchor some more. You really do not need a lot of work after doing a deadlift PR, and jokers, and FSL, or after the cleans and squats for PRs and jokers. Given how much you have going on with the main lifts, on the deadlift and squat days I would just have assistance be “core work, 50-100 total reps,” and neck work if you want. I like the farmers walk, but maybe count it as a core exercise (e.g., just treat it as 50 reps). You should be able to just focus on the main lifts, and after that if you are wiped out do your 50 situps reps and leave, but if you feel great do some more. Likewise with the press and bench, a PR set, jokers, and FSL is a lot of work, so I would probably set assistance those days at “pull 50-100, push 25-50, curls.” If you do the first 50 pulls between sets of the main lift, then after the FSL you either just do 25 pushups and some curls, then leave, or if you feel great you do 50 more pulls and 50 dips or the like.

Regarding BBS (at FSL weight) vs SSL, just pick one for each main lift. Whatever seems cool to you. Remember, you can always switch it around in some future cycle, and either way you are getting in a good amount of work, so just pick one and go with it.

Regarding whether or not to trash the plan you wrote out and go with the other thing, I would say do the plan you just wrote out. There are endless cool alternatives, and it is easy to get lost if you keep considering new ones. You have a plan, you have already refined it to figure out the details, now you just have to actually do it. After those 5 cycles, you can do the Forever BBB/SSL/SVR plan. For now, though, it seems you have a fine 5 cycle plan meeting the prescription of a Leader with 5’s PRO, volume work (SSL or BBS) and moderate assistance followed by an Anchor focusing on PRs and intensity in the main lifts, lower volume (FSL), and somewhat higher assistance. Your plan also includes mobility, jumps, throws, hard conditioning, and easy/recovery conditioning, so your bases are covered. Go forth and follow it!


#13

Just a side comment from someone who has read and followed this thread. The RevChad writes in a manner that inspires me!!. I want to go train after reading . Thank you.


#14

Sounds like you’ve got it all worked out in that case - so yeah, that looks awesome.


#15

Thanks for your detailed respond revchad! This is really cool and I truely appreciate it!

Also, thanks for making up my mind about this, because this is honestly what i want to do!

Also, I’ll go for 2 cycle leader followed by 9 week anchor, with reduced assistance, as you’re saying. I guess I could replace leader 3 with SVR, without getting lost as you pointed out, as this looks like something that would work for an anchor?

So it’ll look like this:

2 cycles, Leader:
Main lift: 5’s Pro
Supplemental - BBS
Assistance - x50-100 pull for UB, x50 ab work for LB

1 cycle, Anchor:
Main lift - SVR
Supplemental SVR
Assistance - Push, Pull, Single leg/core - x50 total

2 cycles, Anchor:
Main Lift - 3/5/1
Supplemental - FSL 5x5
Assistance - Pull, core x50-100

Condition, mobility and jumps/throws remains the same

I think if I do like this I’ll get answer for what you’re saying about the reduced assistance, and for the 2 cycles of leader and 3 cycles of anchor?
Whatever the outcome, I’m glad for all the help you guys have given me!


#16

Change all of this:

Leader - 2/anchor - 2
Assistance work is all fucked up - change that.
If you add PC, something MUST come out; so choose wisely.

Your conditioning needs to be programmed and “Rowing Ergometer 2000m @ As fast as possible” is an absolute recipe for disaster. I’m not being a dick but this is NOT crossfit or P90X. This is actual training and programming so do not let the little kids come and play with the adults.

Other than that, you are solid. You did your homework and I appreciate it.


Programming 6 Cycles Ahead
#17

Thanks a lot for the help Jim!
Would something like this work?

2 cycles of - Leader:
Main lift - 5’s Pro
Supplemental - BBS
Assistance: Face Pulls x100 on UB and Ab work x50-100 on LB
Condition - Need to figure this out…

1 cycle of:
Main Lift & Supplemental - SVR II
Assistance - Chins x50-100 on UB and Ab work x50-100 on LB
Condition - Week 1 Medium, Week 2 Easy, Week 3 Hard - (from your blog)

1 cycle of:
Main lift - 3/5/1 - push for PR’s and jokers on week 1 & 3
Supplemental - 5x5 FSL
Assistance - Chins or Rows x50-100 on UB, Ab/Low Back x50 ea. on LB
Condition - Need to figure this out…

No worries! I don’t read this as rude, honestly I’m just greatful for your time and help!
Lately I’ve done 5x300m with 45-60 seconds of rest on the rowing ergometer, and I feel that this is very effective. I know you recommend otherwise, but would this better programmed or do I need to go another direction? Where I train we’ve got no aridyne, prowler, sleds or hills (denmark). Next best thing would be to do runs of 100-400m for a given total like 1600m as I’ve seen you write about?
Would anything need to be removed if I did: Jumps, PC, Squat, Ab Work - x25-50. ? Or are you refering to the even bigger picture of a cycle of something needed to be removed, such as supplemental variation like BBS?

I hope that above programming is closer in the right direction!

Thanks for your time, patience and help Jim Wendler! I really appreciate it!


#18

NPA? Leader? Anchor? will all these new jargon be in the new book? I have the previous book and 2 others, and i dont know this all mean.


#19

I bet it will. Jim says it’ll describe and detail everything a lifter needs and it sound very promising, at least for me!
I think the book will be out soon. I’m very excited to get it!


#20

Lol. Yep. You need to know your alphabet soup.