T Nation

TRT without Hcg Protocol Adjustment?


#1

Hi everyone,

I'm in the UK, administering my own TRT using body building drugs. I don't have the support of doctors due to cost and being let down by our national health service and several private endos who all prescribed Gels and refuse injectables and definitely refuse self injection.

Being in the UK, complicates things as I cannot buy bloods without a doctors order and HCG is not recognised in the treatment of low t here. In any way. Aging that I have had prolonged periods of success ..but have some problems hitting the estrogen sweet spot.

My question is this..

Do I need to use less anastrazole than mentioned in the protocol if I don't use hcg? And should I use more test without hcg? And if so what is the appropriate Max ? And would this increase in test input require a similar amount of anastrazole?

I have been told that hcg can lift estrogen levels more than test alone...

I am 45 about 18% bf in shape and exercise regularly. When in the zone I wake every morning with wood that lasts a good way through my morning pee. Thanks to a loving wife even out of the zone I wouldnt say I suffer from ED but have been known to use Viagra to get round a slow start :frowning: .. I also suffer dramatic mood swings thanks to not being in the zone. I wish I had access to bloods but I don't. Simple as that. I've never had gyno and also wondered if there is a sure fire way of telling the difference between low and high e2 sexual difficulties.

Hope this makes sense..and thanks for any response.


#2

hCG only increases E2 significantly in two situations. One is when the dose is too high. The other is when [rare] a guys simply is very sensitive to hCG. Read the advice for new guys, and other stickies, to understand such issues. <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

If you take anastrozole and find a dose where you feel better, you did not need labs to get there.

You will find useful into revolving around 100mg/week T esters. Not gear. We do see guys on higher T doses who never feel balanced until they get to a lower dose. If you take a lot of T and can’t find a balance, you will not find advice here that will help, but by reading the stickies, you can understand the mechanics of what is going on and make intelligent decisions.

Don’t have T tunnel vision. There can be many factors that effect well-being other that T and estrogens.

Read the stickies, that will take a long time.


#3

Thanks I have read the stickies.


#4

For me…

High E - sensitive nips, weight gain (water)/bloating, potential for morning wood, major mood swings, emotional

Low E - achy joints, weight loss (water loss), no wood potential, constant feeling of dehydration, somewhat spacey feeling in head, down in the dumps mood but it stays level, tired as hell, basically feel like a heap of garbage

Excluding the sensitive nipples, which is the bane of my existence… I would rather have high E.

I am on 100mg test cyp a week, spread over 4 shots. No AI, no HCG. Considering adding HCG back in, but want to dial in test cyp first. With test cyp alone my T hovers around 800. When I added 250iu HCG twice a week, total T jumped to +1500. Hard to dial that in when you are first starting all of this jazz.

-Jim


#5

[quote]Jimstigator wrote:
For me…

High E - sensitive nips, weight gain (water)/bloating, potential for morning wood, major mood swings, emotional

Low E - achy joints, weight loss (water loss), no wood potential, constant feeling of dehydration, somewhat spacey feeling in head, down in the dumps mood but it stays level, tired as hell, basically feel like a heap of garbage

Excluding the sensitive nipples, which is the bane of my existence… I would rather have high E.

I am on 100mg test cyp a week, spread over 4 shots. No AI, no HCG. Considering adding HCG back in, but want to dial in test cyp first. With test cyp alone my T hovers around 800. When I added 250iu HCG twice a week, total T jumped to +1500. Hard to dial that in when you are first starting all of this jazz.

-Jim[/quote]

Thanks mate, that’s valuable info. Never had sensitive nipples getting more and more certain that I over use ai / anastrazole. So will follow sticky advice.