T Nation

TRT+HGH Protocols (KSman)


#1

I am trying to search all the threads to find any and all info on KSman's HGH protocols (and curious about others doing it for maximizing health and longevity). I only found one brief one.

I am not a bodybuilder or competitive athlete so am not interested in reading about its use to "getting ripped" or hypertrophy. I also do not use AAS but most threads are about "stacking" for results. Want to read about just TRT+HGH.

Curious mainly about KSmans protocol because he is so thorough on doing things right, but also anyone else on here who is doing it long term, or plans on doing it for life, not just competition.

Many of the threads on the roid forum vary opinions, doctors/clinic websites vary opinions, and BBB helped folks get amazing results but I am not sure if that has been updated or improved (but it seemed rather involved doing IV or pulsing shots numerous times a day etc- and it seemed to be for those looking to "get big or die trying").

Some say SQ, others IM, some say right before bed, others upon waking so as to not blunt the natural pulse during sleep, others pre-workout. Dosing seems to vary, too little crosses out any benefit, but then how much is just right and what ranges are too high (with I imagine individual variables). Start at low dose and gradually increase? Then there is the question of frequency, ED, EOD, E3D (which seems if people do EOD or E3D they just double up on dose for skipped days)...or the traditional 5 on 2 off (but I have read 2 days will not recover any natural production so that seems unhelpful). And then some doctors say to take a 30 day break every so often to see if natural production of other variables have declined significantly.

Seeing the cost is so high, individuals run the risk of having to stop HGH for indefinite periods of time. So what are prudent precautions to take in case one must stop at some point? What are the experiences of those being on for extended periods of time and any layoffs before resuming? Or stopping all together after extended use?

Just some of the questions I am curious about reading on. Most HGH threads on here and other sites are about maximizing performance and minimizing sides in chasing those goals. I want to read about those who are maximizing their health for the very long haul in life without pushing the risk factors just for short term how one might look in the mirror.


#2

If injecting every day, many would find a bed time routine easier. But whatever works. IGF-1 has a longer half life, so not much there to optimize. There is a huge amount of chatter to get through.

A first injection might create some unwanted response. Try 1/2 iu and plan to stay quiet for a while if needed.

It takes about six weeks for someone GH deficient to feel a good benefit, as the body and brain does some renewal. Forget what you read about healthy young BB guys doing GH, totally different context as they were not deficient and don't have to progress out of the hole.

There are no MP's here now.


#3

Yes bummer about the PMs.

Sadly most of the HGH info on websites is not for people using it for health concerns, and the HGH clinic or doctors websites all have different opinions as well.

If you have a more thorough write up anywhere or someone else knows of it please link it. I tried reading so many threads and it just gets confusing concerning timing, SQ or IM, doses, and long term use is not really discussed. Especially with time off, or what happens when you do go off etc.

Thanks for responding so fast!


#4

If you go off GH, levels will drop and you feel trashed, then levels recover and may be same or lower than before.

If you take 1iu/day, how and when is not so important. Like I said, there is a lot of chatter and speculation. No one has done clinical research to eval methods VS outcomes [probably impossible, but average IGF levels with multiple methods on each subject would be useful]. It really is about how you feel. Ones IGF-1 levels from a given protocol are really determined by what goes on in your liver and that varies person to person. Note that liver also responds to GH so it takes time to reach a steady state.

I did find something once that was clinical that suggested that IM delivered higher average IGF-1 levels. Can't recall significance.


#5

Yea, trashed sounds just about right. Nightmare experience.