T Nation

TRT, 61Y/O, Prostate Cancer History


#21

I am sorry, it has been a while since I posted, mainly because work has taken so much of my time.

Latest update:
I gave the Doc a list of blood tests and for some reason he only had the lab pull Total Testosterone and Estridol levels.
TT =560
Estridol = 17
Sorry I do not have the ranges, for some reason I can no longer access the information on the hospital website. I will work on fixing that problem.

Regardless, I saw the doctor tonight and he gave me a prescription for Testosterone Cypionate and syringes. We discussed testing and he told me to give it 1-2 months and we would blood test levels.

Injected first dose into quad Sunday. Splitting weekly dose into two injection.

So, if I am injecting Test, I automatically should I be starting HCG? I am confident the doc would prescribe.
250iu hCG SC EOD [every other day]. So this means I should inject 250 iu of hCG subcutaneously eod?
I will talk to doc.

1.0mg Arimidex/anastrozole per week in divided doses…
Should I do this regardless of the low E2 number? If so, how is it administered? Thanks Gary


#24

@KSman. Could you please respond to the post:

“TRT, 61Y/O, Prostate Cancer History”

thanks…Gary


#25

T–>E2 conversion is rate limited by FT/Bio-T. So if you increase T, T–>E2 will increase.

TT=560 is not low as far as most docs are concerned.

Keep in mind that E2 is a risk for prostate.

You can take 0.5mg anastrozole per week and after labs calculate up or take 1.0mg per week and possibly calc down or up. Please be aware of implications of anastrozole over-responders from the advice for new guys sticky.

Within a couple of days of starting TRT, LH/FSH–>zero. So now is the time for hCG. SC or SQ means subcutaneous. Benefits as per the advice for new guys sticky.

Any changes to body temperatures?


#26

Thank you for the reply @KSman,
Morning/Evening Body Temps ranging around 97.1 - 97.5, have not checked midday.
What is dose of hCG I should be taking?? I am taking .250ml (200mg per 1 ML) testosterone 2 times weekly at this time. that should give me 100mg per week, correct? I am into 3rd week right now.
Will be getting labs at 2 month point.
Thanks… Gary


#27

I mentioned this in my first post, but wondering if you have heard of problems with the following.
I had radioactive seeds implanted for Prostate Cancer in 2004. Pronounced clean of cancer in 2009. PSA has been near NIL for years now. Have you ever heard of TRT causing recurrences? Thanks… Gary


#28

There has not been many cases like yours here.
You should in any case be vigilant and checking PSA.
And note that E2 is a bigger risk factor for the prostate than T or DHT.

Improved sexual function will help clear seminal fluids that can otherwise be rancid and inflammatory affecting the prostate.


#29

@KSman

Started TRT in September. Took labs,
Total Test at 520 range 240 - 950 ng/dl
Estradiol 17 pg/ml range 11-44 pg/ml

Doc was very cautious started me on .50 ml. 200mg T Cyp injected weekly in 2 doses. after 3 months, did not take labs but reported no change in libido or energy and he recommended increased dose to .7 ml per week divided into 2 injections weekly.

Next lab was:
Free T 33 ng/dl range 3.67 - 13.9
Total T 1160 ng/dl range 240 - 950
Estradiol 17 pg/ml range 11-44 pg/ml

Noticed improved libido, lots of wood, felt great.

Continued same dose, three months later

Free T 33 range 3.67 - 13.9
Total T 1180 range 240 - 950
Estradiol 37 range 11 - 44

Went on 1 mg Anastrozole weekly split in 2 doses. Could not get 1/2 mg pills locally, splitting pills that I have, so small they are splitting inconsistently.

1 month later Libido is gone. Still getting some morning wood, The only time there is wood at all.

I go for Estradiol labs again next week.

Comments please?


#30

If E2 is very low, could be you are an anastrozole over-responder, which is not rare. You could then also have sore joints and have some mood problems.

As an over-responder, you would need to take 1/8th mg twice a week. Dissolve 1mg/ml in vodka and dispense by volume. Counting drops per ml with a dropper bottle would allow for dispensing by the drop. Perhaps a more dilute mix would be easier for dose refinement.

You would stop for 5-6 days then resume at lower dose.

See if you can move E2 labs forward.


#31

@KSman

E2 was very low first 3 months, then spiked to 37 (11-44) on last labs. Can you explain the “over responder” comment? I have been on Anastrozole for only 1 month. I thought I would be more likely to go up in dosage than down.
I can get my labs any time, is one month a reasonable time to check results? I will try dissolving the AI in vodka. Great Idea!
Thanks. Gary


#32

@KSman

Just got the latest Estradiol results. Last lab showed 37 pg/ml (11-44)
Was on 1mg Anastrozole Weekly for last 5 weeks. Test results back today show Estradiol at 10 pg/ml.
I just noticed you said to take an 1/8 mg in an earlier post and how to mix with vodka. I will do so.

I am also checking the PSA due to the Prostate Cancer. There has been no change in the last 10 months I have been on TRT. PSA is still < .1 or nil.

Thanks… Gary


#34

@KSman

Attempting to adjust Estradiol. Here are the results of 3 months of trying.

Injecting .35 Test Cyp 2 x weekly.
June 10 Total T was running 1160 free T was 33 (results posted above)
Estrodial at 37 before Anastrozole. (results posted above)
June 10 Began 1/2 tab 1mg Anastrozole 2x weekly when injecting.
June 10 Dropped T injections to .30 2x weekly.
I adjusted the Test down because I was getting a little cranky and moody.
Libido completely gone at this point.

July 12 Estrodial @ 10 pg/ml (11-44) stopped Anastrozole for 5 days. Felt myself pass thru the sweet spot, good libido, strong hard wood for 4 or 5 days. This was a relief, I was beginning to think I had some other problem with the package before this awakening came along. Now I know it was all wacked up body chemistry.

July 14 Per @KSman resumed Anastrozole at 1/8 equivalent of 1mg tab in 4ml Vodka Solution 2x weekly. I dose on injection day.

August 22 Estrodial @ 16 pg/ml (11-44) Libido and wood falling off right about here.

                                           ******************

So where do I go at this point? Apparently my Anastrozole dose needs to go down from 1/8 tab. I must be extremely sensitive to the stuff. How do I go to 1/16th of a 1mg tab 2x weekly?

I could dilute the Anastrozole to say 1mg tab per 8 ml vodka and adjust dose accordingly. That is the only way I am going to be able to get the dose volume large enough to use. Is that the answer, or am I better off just skipping 1 of the current doses per week?
At this point I am drawing the shaken solution from a small glass bottle into a 3 ml syringe and just shooting it into my mouth.

My doc has been very good. Setting up labs for me, getting my drugs and needles filled. He was a little leery at first, but now is pretty happy with the way I am handling it. I am honest about the good and bad, I tell him when I think my levels are too high and I am getting bitchy. He orders labs to satisfy himself nothing is getting out of wack but other than that, he seems to be content to let me self guide. This situation is as good as it is going to get with him. His nurses think I am the worst patient ever.

Total and free T labs should be here within days.

Advice on the Anastrozole if you would sir. Thanks… Gary


#35

Injecting .30ml 2x per week.
1/8 tab Anastrozole 2x per week

Latest Labs: Collected 8/23/2017

TESTOSTERONE, TOTAL 1,051 ng/dL 221 - 716 ng/dL
FREE TESTOSTERONE CALCULATION 26.55 ng/dL 4.7 - 24.4 ng/dL
ESTRADIOL, SERUM 16 pg/mL 11 - 44 pg/mL
ALBUMIN 3.9 g/dL 3.5 - 5.0 g/dL
SEX HORMONE BINDING GLOBULIN 35.0 nmol/L 11 - 78 nmol/L

WBC 13.19 10(3)/mcL 4.00 - 12.00 10(3)/mcL
RBC 5.65 10(6)/mcL 4.40 - 5.80 10(6)/mcL
HEMOGLOBIN (HGB) 16.9 g/dL 13.0 - 16.5 g/dL
HEMATOCRIT (HCT) 49.4 % 38.0 - 50.0 %
MCV 87.4 fL 82.0 - 96.0 fL
MCH 29.9 pg 26.0 - 32.0 pg
MCHC 34.2 g/dL 31.0 - 36.0 g/dL
PLATELET COUNT 221 10(3)/mcL 140 - 440 10(3)/mcL
RDW 12.9 % 11.8 - 15.5 %
MPV 10.9 fL 8.0 - 12.6 fL
NEUTROPHILS 65.3 % 40.0 - 68.0 %
LYMPHOCYTES 20.2 % 19.0 - 49.0 %
MONOCYTES 9.9 % 3.0 - 13.0 %
EOSINOPHILS 4.1 % 0.0 - 8.0 %
BASOPHILS 0.5 % 0.0 - 1.0 %
ABSOLUTE NEUTROPHILS 8.63 10(3)/mcL 1.40 - 5.30 10(3)/mcL
ABSOLUTE LYMPHOCYTES 2.66 10(3)/mcL 0.90 - 3.30 10(3)/mcL
ABSOLUTE MONOCYTES 1.30 10(3)/mcL 0.10 - 0.90 10(3)/mcL
ABSOLUTE EOSINOPHIL 0.54 10(3)/mcL 0.00 - 0.50 10(3)/mcL
ABSOLUTE BASOPHILS 0.06 10(3)/mcL 0.00 - 0.10 10(3)/mcL
NRBC PER 100 WBC 0

Any problems here? White blood count is a little high, I was fighting a bad cold at the time, could that be the reason? thanks… Gary


#36

Hematocrit is on the high end. Maybe consider donating blood.

Regarding the AI, any reason to just take it once a week? Maybe half way between your injections? I don’t know if that’s a good plan, I’d ask your dr, but seems to make some sense.


#37

I am cutting my Anastrazole to 1/16th of 1mg x 2 times a week . 1/8 mg 2 times a week was too much and was dropping my Estrodial down in the teens.I dissolve the Anastrazole in vodka and suck it up in a syringe then shoot it into my mouth on injection day. I have to dilute it an extra amount to get enough to measure. I am going to go 8ml of Vodka to 1 mg pill, or possibly 16ml vodka to 1 mg. At least I can see it to suck it up in the syringe before I shoot it into my mouth. Thanks for replying. Gary


#38

your numbers look great. I’m surprised you were able to achieve the Testosterone levels at .3 ML 2x / week. Is the Testosterone dosed at 100 mg / ml or more like 200- 250 mg / ml? Also, how is your PSA / prostate doing with all this?


#39

Test is 200mg per 1 ML… Sorry, that was stated in top of thread.

I am checking psa every 3 months. running nil (<.10 ng/ml.) and I have ran the same reading since 2010.

This is the desired final reading after being seeded. I was seeded in 2004.

I have been on TRT since December 2016

Thanks for replying… Gary


#40

how do you feel now ? libido and erection are good?


#41

I keep passing thru the sweet spot on Libido/erections.
ESTRADIOL was 16 pg/mL 11 - 44 pg/mL Last check.
Dropping Anastrozole to 1/16 of 1mg 2x week trying to get it in the 22 range.
Other than the tidal rise and fall of libido, I feel great.


#42

@KSman
How ultra sensitive can I be to the Anastrozole? I am dosing .30ml of Test Cyp 200mg 2x per week Wednesday afternoon and Sunday morning.

I started with a solution of Anastrazole and was taking a 1/8 mg solution twice a week, a total of 1/4 mg a week with the results below.

8/23/2017 test results showed
TESTOSTERONE, TOTAL 1,051 ng/dL 221 - 716 ng/dL
FREE TESTOSTERONE CALCULATION 26.55 ng/dL 4.7 - 24.4 ng/dL
ALBUMIN 3.9 g/dL 3.5 - 5.0 g/dL
SEX HORMONE BINDING GLOBULIN 35.0 nmol/L 11 - 78 nmol/L
ESTRADIOL, SERUM 16 pg/mL 11 - 44 pg/mL

At this point libido was dead.
I cut back on Anastrozole, this time I dissolved 1 1mg tab in 16 ml of Vodka giving me 1/16 tab of 1mg in 1 ml of vodka and after a 5 day wait, began dosing 1 ml solution every injection or 1/8 of 1 mg per week.

Libido came and went. I again felt that my Estradiol was low. I stopped the solution doses, meant to get Estrodial checked that day, but the soonest I was able to get it done was 4 days later.

9/26/2017 results were.
ESTRADIOL, SERUM 27 pg/mL 11 - 44 pg/mL
I can feel it when I hit a good spot, this time I believe the reading was low and when I stopped dosing the solution, passed thru the ideal Estradiol Range ending up at the 27pg/ml level.
CBC:
WBC 10.09 10(3)/mcL 4.00 - 12.00 10(3)/mcL
RBC 5.61 10(6)/mcL 4.40 - 5.80 10(6)/mcL
HEMOGLOBIN (HGB) 17.1 g/dL 13.0 - 16.5 g/dL
HEMATOCRIT (HCT) 48.7 % 38.0 - 50.0 %
MCV 86.8 fL 82.0 - 96.0 fL
MCH 30.5 pg 26.0 - 32.0 pg
MCHC 35.1 g/dL 31.0 - 36.0 g/dL
PLATELET COUNT 186 10(3)/mcL 140 - 440 10(3)/mcL
RDW 12.3 % 11.8 - 15.5 %
MPV 10.9 fL 8.0 - 12.6 fL

I gave blood at the local center yesterday to get the Hematoocrit to a better level.

I have now cut back again, dosing 1/2 a ml of the last solution, making the total Anastrozole 1/16 of 1 mg per week. I will check the results again in 1 month. I have read a lot of posts, but have seen no one taking this small a dose to get a handle on the Estradiol. At Estradiol levels of 16 morning wood is there, soft erections, at 27 exactly the same. Other than this I feel good.

I am trying to do this methodically, I am shaking the solution well before drawing into a 1ml syringe and shooting into my mouth. I am testing every 30 days, but cannot seem to hit the number and keep it there.

Any suggestions? Thanks.


#43

Is there anyone still replying in this forum? I am having some problems and need advice. Should I stay or try to find another spot to ask my questions?
thanks… Gary