T Nation

Tried Clomid Failed, Hypothyroid? 23 Years Old


#1

I know it is typically best to expand on a personal thread once you have started one. However, I have not posted in so long and I have so much new information that I feel it would be best to create a new thread.

Story:

I am currently 23 years and I work out regularly. I maintain a good diet and stay with from drugs and alcohol. I have had symptoms of low-t for approximately 4 years. Averaging total T around 300, and free t at 6-8 in a 9-26 normal range. I also had a varicocele since 15, which was repaired at 21, I think it is back somewhat.

My E2 levels, cortisol levels, prolactin levels, b12, vitamin D, iron, brain mri etc; have been all thoroughly investigated. My prolactin is consistently towards the top of the range (sometimes above) and my E2 is always very low.

Final in June of 2011, I found a Dr. who was willing to let me try clomid before I went on trt. I was hopeful that I was secondary, since my fsh and lh were both terrible.

Before the clomid, my LH and FSH were consistently below the normal range. Since early June I have taken clomid 3x a week through September, 2x a week in october, and now I am at 1 time a week in November.

The results have been extremely disappointing. My LH and FSH have barely responded. I have had two sets of labs since being on the clomid. My labs from September showed that my FSH was barely in the lower normal range and my LH remind not in the normal range! After clomid! My testosterone was in the 500's and my free was around 12 in a range of 9 to 26. I do not have access to these labs, but the second set of labs from October I do. The clomid has not made me feel any better. The labs are below:

My prolactin is better and my LH is slightly improved, but the differences are not that important. Prolactin being so variable and LH being emitted in pulses.

My tsh has previously come in at 1.9 in May of 2011, 2.7 in June of 2010, and recently Oct 2010 my tsh is over 4!!!! I obviously was not pleased with this TSH, and told my doctor that based on my endless symptoms that seem hypothyroid and my family history of it, I really think the chance of me being hypothyroid should be taken more seriously. He agreed to prescribe me armour, but then when on this big rant though that he is afraid by me taking it,â?? i could be taking another pill for a long time that I don't need.â?? I want to try it but I don't want to make a big mistake. Best on my labs and your knowledge is trying it worth the chance of possibly feeling better? I have read the stickies and countless posts.

Labs from Oct 2011

Chemistries
Glucose, Serum 87 65-99 mg/dL
BUN 19 6-20 mg/dL
Creatinine, Serum 0.93 0.76-1.27 mg/dL
eGFR If NonAfricn Am 115 >59 mL/min/1.73
eGFR If Africn Am 133 >59 mL/min/1.73
Note: A persistent eGFR <60 mL/min/1.73 m2 (3 months or more)
may indicate chronic kidney disease. An eGFR >59 mL/min/1.73 m2
with an elevated urine protein also may indicate chronic kidney
disease. Calculated using CKD-EPI formula.

BUN/Creatinine Ratio 20 H 8-19
Sodium, Serum 141 135-145 mmol/L
Potassium, Serum 4.3 3.5-5.2 mmol/L
Chloride, Serum 104 97-108 mmol/L
Carbon Dioxide, Total 24 20-32 mmol/L
Calcium, Serum 9.1 8.7-10.2 mg/dL
Protein, Total, Serum 7.0 6.0-8.5 g/dL
Albumin, Serum 4.4 3.5-5.5 g/dL
Globulin, Total 2.6 1.5-4.5 g/dL
A/G Ratio 1.7 1.1-2.5
Bilirubin, Total 0.6 0.0-1.2 mg/dL
Alkaline Phosphatase, S 60 25-150 IU/L
AST (SGOT) 40 0-40 IU/L
ALT (SGPT) 37 0-55 IU/L
.
Thyroid
TSH 4.070 0.450-4.500 uIU/mL
Thyroxine (T4) 8.0 4.5-12.0 ug/dL
T3 Uptake 35 24-39 %
Free Thyroxine Index 2.8 1.2-4.9
.
Immunoassay
Cortisol - AM 16.2 6.2-19.4 ug/dL
Insulin-Like Growth Factor I WILL FOLLOW
Testosterone, Serum 517 348-1197 ng/dL
Please note reference interval change

LH 3.6 1.7-8.6 mIU/mL
FSH 1.3 L 1.5-12.4 mIU/mL
Prolactin 9.7 4.0-15.2 ng/mL

Osmolality 295 275-295 mOsmol/kg

Osmolality, Urine 416 mOsmol/kg
24 hr : 300 - 900
Random: 50 - 1400
After 12hr fluid
restriction: >850

Creatinine, Urine 57.7 24.0-392.0 mg/dL

Sodium, Urine 53 Not Estab. mmol/L

Older Thyroid Related labs :

Component Your Value Standard Range Units
T4, Free 1.26 0.82 - 1.77 ng/dL

General Information
Collected:
5/9/2011 2:48 PM

T3, total 114 71 - 180 ng/dL

General Information
Collected:
5/9/2011 2:48 PM

TSH, 3rd generation 2.720 0.450 - 4.500 uIU/mL

General Information
Collected:
6/17/2010 11:46 AM

T4, Free 1.20 0.82 - 1.77 ng/dL

General Information
Collected:
6/17/2010 11:46 AM


#2

Yes, I have read thyroid madness


#3

Link to your old thread

Your clomid protocol isn't all that good, IMO...steroid users for PCT use clomid and nolva every day for weeks at 40 mg or so per day before tapering it down to 20 mg a day...how much were you taking in your 3x weekly dose?


#4

Three times weekly I was taking a 50mg pill.

Links to old threads:

http://tnation.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_training_performance_bodybuilding_trt/wellbutrin_1

http://tnation.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_training_performance_bodybuilding_trt/new_to_site_searching_for_testosterone_advice_before_probable_trt


#5

Jrv...your thyroid looks fine. Your TSH may not be 'low' or below 2.5 like some people say it should, but your actual hormones are good and I wouldn't mess around with taking thyroid meds because it won't solve your issues.

Was your clomid generic? Maybe trying Tamoxifen would be better? When I took psychiatric meds and sleeping meds I always used brand name because the generics SUCKED and didn't work. Before going on TRT, I would try Tamoxifen, if that doesn't work I would try the brand name clomid as a last resort...also listen to VT.


#6

VT, Retinoid,

Thanks for the input concering my clomid use. The clomid I took was definitely generic. My doctor is not willing to let me keep taking it, so soon my prescription would run out. I think it would be hard for me to find a doctor who would prescribe me more clomid, I went through a ton of doctors before I found one who would give it a try. Are there any reliable and safe online pharmacies that sell these drugs? Or do I just need to find another doctor?

I hope you guys are right and my thyroid is fine. I went to the dentist today, and he said that my thryoid seemed enlarged, without me first bringing up the subject.

I have taken 1mg-2mg of melatonin a night for over a year. I have stopped that recently because some articles say that it can lower LH. This theory seems to be disputed, but I figured it was worth a try in case the idea has some merit.


#7

The only thing I could think of is a research chemical (that is where I am getting arimidex)...it isn't the brand name of course. Tamoxifen is cheap online, while clomid isn't. But the research chemical will be cheaper.

Your thyroid hormone levels are good...they are mid range. Taking thyroid replacement won't make you feel any better in my opinion...plus your TSH is fine...deviating slightly from optimal. If it is enlarged, then maybe you can get an ultrasound and an antibody test for Hashimoto's, perhaps it is inflamed and the effects haven't showed up yet.

For the past 5 days I have been taking 10mg of melatonin (5 alone doesn't work for me)...And I have been waking up refreshed around 7 am every day while before I woke up around 11am feeling tired. Not sure if I am actually getting enough sleep though (like 6hrs vs. 8-10hrs before). Still have no morning erections so I can't say if it is lowering LH or raising prolactin (heard both). But I don't care as I have tried so many tranquilizers and none have worked. Hypogonadism can cause insomnia...

You are a young guy. With low fsh and lh levels. I just don't think you need TRT until everything is exhausted. Though I know it is a long and arduous journey especially with doctors that are misinformed and try to even THWART us.


#8

You say you can't find a doctor who will prescribe you what you need, but I recommended my doctor to you in one of your other threads. Did you ever go see him? They are not afraid to push the envelope there when warranted and demonstrated by bloodwork. They are very good in that regard.


#9

I remember looking in to the guy, but I didn't want to see him because I no coverage to see him, or to get labs, mri's etc from him. Which would total into the thousands... I still don't have the money, but maybe I should get a loan or something if it would mean a radical health improvement.


#10

You don't have insurance? Or is it an HMO that won't cover labs and stuff written by other docs?


#11

I can't go to anyone outside of a portion of the Virginia Area - they are called out of network and instead of pay like 5 percent, i pay like 60 percent or something insanely high.