Trial By Written Declaration

[quote]critietaeta wrote:
but arent you guilty?[/quote]

Yes I am certainly guilty, but here in California, being guilty of a crime is hardly an indicator of whether or not you will pay the penalty for said crime.

Either way, there is no way in FUCK I am guilty 712 dollars worth for this tiny infraction.

[quote]critietaeta wrote:
but arent you guilty?
[/quote]

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:
Yes I am certainly guilty
[/quote]

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:
there is no way in FUCK I am guilty 712 dollars worth.[/quote]

LOL… lets get this straight:

  1. You were pulled over for speeding.
  2. The fine for your violation is $712.
  3. You admit to being guilty of the violation.
  4. You’re not $712 guilty?
  5. ???

Just cause you think the fine is too steep doesnt mean anything lol.

Im sure most people who get arrested for selling marijuana think their punishments are too high as well… too bad its not up to them.

[quote]gregron wrote:

[quote]critietaeta wrote:
but arent you guilty?
[/quote]

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:
Yes I am certainly guilty
[/quote]

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:
there is no way in FUCK I am guilty 712 dollars worth.[/quote]

LOL… lets get this straight:

  1. You were pulled over for speeding.
  2. The fine for your violation is $712.
  3. You admit to being guilty of the violation.
  4. You’re not $712 guilty?
  5. ???

Just cause you think the fine is too steep doesnt mean anything lol.

Im sure most people who get arrested for selling marijuana think their punishments are too high as well… too bad its not up to them.[/quote]

A law is not just, just because it’s the law.

[quote]KBCThird wrote:
A law is not just, just because it’s the law.[/quote]

so having a speed limit is not just?

Having a law that makes selling drugs is not just?

Bend over, buddy.

Consider moving.

You said it KBC. These “it’s the LAW” people are the reason people get assfucked by their governments all over the world on a daily basis.

[quote]gregron wrote:

[quote]KBCThird wrote:
A law is not just, just because it’s the law.[/quote]

so having a speed limit is not just?

Having a law that makes selling drugs is not just?[/quote]

Obviously no one is arguing against speed limits, the point is that the size of the fine is unjust and out of proportion to the infraction. Why stop at 712 dollars, why not make it 2000 dollars + 12 lashes. That would be ok with you, right? As long as the law was passed and it was all legal like. lol

[quote]Quick Ben wrote:
Obviously no one is arguing against speed limits,
[/quote]

It seems as though you are… otherwise your point doesnt make sense.

its unjust and out of proportion to the infraction? Who is to decide that, you? What’s a “proportional” fine? $300? What if I think $300 is too high? (see how this can keep going?)

[quote]
Why stop at 712 dollars, why not make it 2000 dollars + 12 lashes. That would be ok with you, right? As long as the law was passed and it was all legal like. lol[/quote]

Textbook “strawman” argument.

Link incase you dont know what a strawman is:

[quote]pushharder wrote:

[quote]gregron wrote:

[quote]KBCThird wrote:
A law is not just, just because it’s the law.[/quote]

so having a speed limit is not just?..

[/quote]

The punishment is unjust. Why is that so flippin hard for you to ascertain?

Would you lock up a shoplifter of a candy bar in the pen for one year?
[/quote]

is that the punishment for a shoplifter of a candy bar? one year in prison?

I understand that he was probably implying that the punishment is unjust (even though that isnt what he said) but who is to decide what a just punishment is?

I made an exaggeration to make my point. Which is that the longer people keep bending over, the harder they are going to get fucked. And a $712 fine for barely breaking the speed limit is ridiculous, chanting “it’s the law” does not make it any less so.

Who should decide? I don’t know man. But certainly there should be safeguards in place so that politicians can’t send the cops out to do highway robbery whenever the state fucks up and goes broke.

[quote]pushharder wrote:

[quote]fighting_fires wrote:

[quote]roguevampire wrote:
yes, best advice is to get a radar/lazer detector. one of the very best is called “Redline” by Escort. it has one of the longest ranges of any radar detector made. [/quote]

well that may be the best alternative. best advice is dont speed…[/quote]

That’s like asking a guy not to thrust when he’s fuckin’.[/quote]

No, it isn’t at all like that. Thrusting is an integral part of fucking. Exceeding the speed limit is not an integral part of driving.

DB

DB

[quote]pushharder wrote:

[quote]gregron wrote:

…its unjust and out of proportion to the infraction? Who is to decide that, you? What’s a “proportional” fine? $300? What if I think $300 is too high? (see how this can keep going?)

[/quote]

Check the stats then. I’ll bet you a year’s supply of MAG-10 against a weekend in bed with your girlfriend (if she’s hawt) that a $712 fine for a simple “13 over” is waaaaaaay beyond the U.S. average.

[/quote]

the most recent data listed on that page is from 1999 lol

[quote]Quick Ben wrote:
A $712 fine for barely breaking the speed limit is ridiculous
[/quote]

^^Agreed… but the fee in california for driving at an unsafe speed, 1 to 15 MPH over the limit (VC 22350) is $154

No way he has a $700+ fine for that violation alone.

Who “chanted 'its the law”?

[quote]
Who should decide? I don’t know man. But certainly there should be safeguards in place so that politicians can’t send the cops out to do highway robbery whenever the state fucks up and goes broke.[/quote]

I agree that there should be safeguards… but I wouldnt call police officers writing citations to people who admittedly were guilty of breaking the law “highway robbery.” If you’re not speeding you’re not getting speeding tickets.

I never once said that I didnt think that a $700 fine for 13MPH over the limit wasnt high… I just dont believe the OP was ONLY cited for that one offense.

EDIT: Some good old fashioned friendly discussion.

[quote]Quick Ben wrote:
I made an exaggeration to make my point. Which is that the longer people keep bending over, the harder they are going to get fucked. And a $712 fine for barely breaking the speed limit is ridiculous, chanting “it’s the law” does not make it any less so.

Who should decide? I don’t know man. But certainly there should be safeguards in place so that politicians can’t send the cops out to do highway robbery whenever the state fucks up and goes broke.[/quote]

Unfortunately, the states govern the privilege to drive and the states control the fines for violating their driving laws. Sounds like another reason to leave the State of California. Aren’t the fines based on a grid in CA? In most places, you don’t really have much to argue because they have a fine system, such as 1 to 5 mph over =$75, 6-10 over = $100, etc.

In NJ, the car insurance rates are ridiculously high, so high that many years ago, the State cut a deal with the insurers that, in order to keep rates down, they enforce a mandatory surcharge of $300 per year for 3 years, payable to the insurer, for anyone who gets a moving violation worthy of 3 points or more. You may have guessed that the standard speeding violation carries 3 points, so while going 78 in a 65 might only get you a fine of $135, you will pay $900 over the next three years in higher insurance costs. At least that’s the way it used to be.

That’s why a lot of people show up in court, plea bargain with the ADA to get the speeding changed to a different moving violation that carries the same fine, but no points. The municipality makes its fee and you don’t get the points and the insurance company doesn’t get the $900, but they don’t know about it anyway, so everyone is happy.

Doesn’t sound like that will help the OP, except that he could get out of points on his license and keep his insurance premium down. But, it looks like he might be out the $712.

DB

[quote]gregron wrote:

[quote]pushharder wrote:

[quote]gregron wrote:

[quote]KBCThird wrote:
A law is not just, just because it’s the law.[/quote]

so having a speed limit is not just?..

[/quote]

The punishment is unjust. Why is that so flippin hard for you to ascertain?

Would you lock up a shoplifter of a candy bar in the pen for one year?
[/quote]

is that the punishment for a shoplifter of a candy bar? one year in prison?

I understand that he was probably implying that the punishment is unjust (even though that isnt what he said) but who is to decide what a just punishment is?[/quote]

Wow, can’t believe there’s been so much back and forth over this. My original statement was to point out that in no way were you justifying the punishment based on anything more than an attitude of “those are the rules.” If you based it on the costs to society of high speed driving, or the price point needed to deter speeding, that would be one thing, but you didnt.

If you want to adhere strictly to the rules, then OP is fully entitled to plead not guilty, as he’s assumed to be innocent until proven guilty, or pleading guilty, in a court of law, not some internet forum.