T Nation

Trans-X from SciTec Nutrition?

I have always been a fan of Trans-X produced by SciTec *Nutrition. I will not paste the address of the website here, as I understand it is against the policy of T-Nation.

Recently there has been a lot of discussion on Norwegian Forums about the possible pollution of legal supplements, ie. that some supplement companies can add illegal substances to suipposedly legal supplements.

Esp. american products have been told to be high-risk. Companies that includes pro-hormones in their line of products are said to be avoided.

My question is, is Trans-X safe? I am a drugfree powerlifter lifting in the IPF, and would like to stay drugfree.

I do not think that this product is “polluted” by illegal substances, but I would like to hear your opinion.

Also do you think that the general warning from the Norwegian Anti-Doping Agency to avoid supplements produced in the USA is justified?

The content of Trans-X as listed on the package:

Dextrose
Creatine Monohydrate
D-Ribose
Glutamine
Arginine
Taurine
Z-MAX (Magnesium gluconate, zinc gluconate, potassium phosphate, dipotassium phosphate)
lipoic acid
natural and artificial flavors (naturlig og kunstig smakstilsetninger)
riboflavin (for farge)
citric acid

I love this product because it really gives me a boost the week leading up to competitions.

Any toughts as to this product is safe or not ?

(Safe defines as not including any “hidden” substances listed on the WADA doping list)

So nobody knows? What about supplements in the USA? Does competing powerlifters always trust the list of contents on the product?

Have there been cases where a lifter tests positive when he has used a supplements said to contain only legal ingredients?

I.e the supplement company has put illegal substances into the product?

There is no pollution of legal supps, unless you are looking into “legal steroids” which are bogus supps that have altered chemical structures to resemble a certain steroid, yet not be classified as it. Those supps can test positive for doping.

As long as you stay away from anything that is a prohormone, you’re fine.

[quote]BigRagoo wrote:
There is no pollution of legal supps, unless you are looking into “legal steroids” which are bogus supps that have altered chemical structures to resemble a certain steroid, yet not be classified as it. Those supps can test positive for doping.

As long as you stay away from anything that is a prohormone, you’re fine.[/quote]

So you are right, and the entire Norwegian Anti-Doping Agency is wrong?

There has also been a case in Norway where a olympix weightlifter named Stian Grimseth bought Ribose when he was in spain, and in effect he tested positive of nanoldrone.

He later got the supplement he bought analyzed, and actually the lab-analysis showed that it contained nanoldrone, and that the values in his samples was identical to the values that would be created by this contaminated supplement.

He later sued this company, and he got a lot of money out of them. But his career was of course ended because of the positive doping test.

[quote]stallion wrote:
BigRagoo wrote:
There is no pollution of legal supps, unless you are looking into “legal steroids” which are bogus supps that have altered chemical structures to resemble a certain steroid, yet not be classified as it. Those supps can test positive for doping.

As long as you stay away from anything that is a prohormone, you’re fine.

So you are right, and the entire Norwegian Anti-Doping Agency is wrong?

There has also been a case in Norway where a olympix weightlifter named Stian Grimseth bought Ribose when he was in spain, and in effect he tested positive of nanoldrone.

He later got the supplement he bought analyzed, and actually the lab-analysis showed that it contained nanoldrone, and that the values in his samples was identical to the values that would be created by this contaminated supplement.

He later sued this company, and he got a lot of money out of them. But his career was of course ended because of the positive doping test.
[/quote]

Ok, but was the company a US company? I don’t see how a company can “dope” an inexpensive supplement with a more expensive steroid and it be worthwhile and profitable.

Also, just to play devil’s advocate, how do we know he didn’t add the steroid to his ribose after he got busted?

BTW, that compound you mentioned is in a certain “natural” test booster. Again, one needs to be aware of anything that is intended to boost one’s test.

[quote]BigRagoo wrote:

Also, just to play devil’s advocate, how do we know he didn’t add the steroid to his ribose after he got busted?

BTW, that compound you mentioned is in a certain “natural” test booster. Again, one needs to be aware of anything that is intended to boost one’s test.

[/quote]

The company in question that he sued was Universal Nutrition, an american company.

Link to news story: http://www.vg.no/pub/vgart.hbs?artid=119502

To sum up the most important parts in the story:

  • The case took 6 years before they reached a settlement.

  • Three boxes with Ribose was tested, two of them delivered by the lifter and one directly from Universal Nutrition. Each box was tested at different labs.

  • All boxes contained nandrolone.

  • Also the american swimmer Kicker Vencill was a victim of the supplementfraud from the same company. His case went to court.

From an official document about the case:

He tested positive for 19-norandrosterone and the lab-tests showed that the supplement Ribose contained 4-norandrostenedione.

On the Ribose-product that he used it said: “Guaranteed quality - lab tested”.

John J. Barrett jr. advocate from the firm Saul Ewing LLP (New Jersey, USA) had the case of Stian Grimseth for Superior Court of New Jersey, Law Division,
Camden County. Universal Nutrition broke the New Jersey Consumer Fraud
Act, New Jersey Products Liability Act, and acted irresponsible.

The Norwegian Anti-Doping Bureau especially warns against american companies that produces pro-hormones, and says that other products from these companies can be contaminated as well.

Here is the story about the case of the Swimmer Kicker Vencill:

http://www.usantidoping.org/files/active/athletes/newsletter/Kicker%20Vencill_USA%20Swimming%20story_May%2017%202005.pdf

It is disappointing to see how ill informed the posters in this post have been so far. Do you really think any ruling would not have been taking into consideration the possibility that Grimseth could have added the illegal substances to the product after he was caught?

And did you really believe that any supplement where the label says it is legal really is legit?

[quote]stallion wrote:
BigRagoo wrote:

Also, just to play devil’s advocate, how do we know he didn’t add the steroid to his ribose after he got busted?

BTW, that compound you mentioned is in a certain “natural” test booster. Again, one needs to be aware of anything that is intended to boost one’s test.

The company in question that he sued was Universal Nutrition, an american company.

Link to news story: http://www.vg.no/pub/vgart.hbs?artid=119502

To sum up the most important parts in the story:

  • The case took 6 years before they reached a settlement.

  • Three boxes with Ribose was tested, two of them delivered by the lifter and one directly from Universal Nutrition. Each box was tested at different labs.

  • All boxes contained nandrolone.

  • Also the american swimmer Kicker Vencill was a victim of the supplementfraud from the same company. His case went to court.

From an official document about the case:

He tested positive for 19-norandrosterone and the lab-tests showed that the supplement Ribose contained 4-norandrostenedione.

On the Ribose-product that he used it said: “Guaranteed quality - lab tested”.

John J. Barrett jr. advocate from the firm Saul Ewing LLP (New Jersey, USA) had the case of Stian Grimseth for Superior Court of New Jersey, Law Division,
Camden County. Universal Nutrition broke the New Jersey Consumer Fraud
Act, New Jersey Products Liability Act, and acted irresponsible.

The Norwegian Anti-Doping Bureau especially warns against american companies that produces pro-hormones, and says that other products from these companies can be contaminated as well.

Here is the story about the case of the Swimmer Kicker Vencill:

http://www.usantidoping.org/files/active/athletes/newsletter/Kicker%20Vencill_USA%20Swimming%20story_May%2017%202005.pdf

It is disappointing to see how ill informed the posters in this post have been so far. Do you really think any ruling would not have been taking into consideration the possibility that Grimseth could have added the illegal substances to the product after he was caught?

And did you really believe that any supplement where the label says it is legal really is legit?[/quote]

Well this is a case of a company with terrible lab practices. If they have a problem with their products contaminating one another, they should be under fire. That is inexcusable.

The reason I asked the question was because I had not heard of either cases. The cases of positive steroids tests in athletes I’m familiar with have been from blatant use of steroids. This is the first I heard of an athlete unknowingly being positive for steroids, and a prohormone at that.

[quote]BigRagoo wrote:
The reason I asked the question was because I had not heard of either cases. The cases of positive steroids tests in athletes I’m familiar with have been from blatant use of steroids. This is the first I heard of an athlete unknowingly being positive for steroids, and a prohormone at that.[/quote]
Not only that, but this makes no sense…How the hell do you buy vitamins that have nando in them? There’s a strong smell of bullsh*t with this whole story…

[quote]Blacksnake wrote:
BigRagoo wrote:
The reason I asked the question was because I had not heard of either cases. The cases of positive steroids tests in athletes I’m familiar with have been from blatant use of steroids. This is the first I heard of an athlete unknowingly being positive for steroids, and a prohormone at that.
Not only that, but this makes no sense…How the hell do you buy vitamins that have nando in them? There’s a strong smell of bullsh*t with this whole story…
[/quote]

Well, that’s where there manufacturing, packaging, and quality control is at fault. They didn’t take enough steps in manufacturing to isolate each product which allowed the cross contamination, allowed the packaging of products, and then their QA/QC (if they have a lab)didn’t detect the mistake. That’s just sloppy business. Honestly, being in the QA/QC field, this is down right disgusting, especially since this is a company that manufactures products for ingestion. What the hell else could have slipped in? Rat shit? Dead insects?

As far as the story goes, the company sent one of their products from stock to the independant lab, and it tested positive for the prohormone. So, it’s pretty clear that they were in the wrong.

I’ve heard of this before. People put something in the first batch of a new supplement, everyone gets outstanding results, then they quietly remove it from subsequent batches after word of mouth is favourable etc. Was an article about it or a reference in a T-Nation article ages ago (I saw it from reading archived ones).

To the OP I don’t think you can be 100% sure without having it independently tested basically. Sorry I can’t be more help, but that’s the only way out I can see.

[quote]Blacksnake wrote:
BigRagoo wrote:
The reason I asked the question was because I had not heard of either cases. The cases of positive steroids tests in athletes I’m familiar with have been from blatant use of steroids. This is the first I heard of an athlete unknowingly being positive for steroids, and a prohormone at that.
Not only that, but this makes no sense…How the hell do you buy vitamins that have nando in them? There’s a strong smell of bullsh*t with this whole story…
[/quote]

What smells wrong here is you.

Coria, the high-rated tennis player is one of several athletes that have tested positive on supplement use.

Link:

The point is that the company in the Grimseth case had produced pro-hormone products on the same machines that produced the Ribose, even on the same day.

If you still think the 10million dollar settlement Coria had with Universal Nutrition is bullshit, you should go to the media and tell them all that you know it all and that the entire case is bullshit.

BigRago had a very intelligent and god response to your comment as well.

Yes, independent testing of a product is the only way to go. But this might be very expensive?

[quote]stallion wrote:
Blacksnake wrote:
BigRagoo wrote:
The reason I asked the question was because I had not heard of either cases. The cases of positive steroids tests in athletes I’m familiar with have been from blatant use of steroids. This is the first I heard of an athlete unknowingly being positive for steroids, and a prohormone at that.
Not only that, but this makes no sense…How the hell do you buy vitamins that have nando in them? There’s a strong smell of bullsh*t with this whole story…

What smells wrong here is you.[/quote]

On the contrary, I plainly stated my suspicions, since I also had not heard of the case. I was then informed of things I was ignorant of by Bigaroo, educated to the realities of the business. I learned that I was wrong about the subject, due to his experience.

You, on the other hand, chose to launch an unwarranted personal attack on me, something I am well known to avoid, and did so after the man had set me straight on the subject by your own admission. Therefore: Fuck you, needle dicked asshole

Whoa! Ok guys, no need to gnash teeth.

This is a very unfortunate event for these athletes affected, and should have more publicity to perusade other companies to tighten their manufacturing processes. This is a black eye on all supplement companies as it gives doubt as who is really reputable on a guarantee of product quality.

The only thing in the compaines favor is the rule of the USADA that each athlete is absolutely responsible for what he/she ingests and is held accountable under any circumstance. Shitty for the unknowing athlete, but it is a fair rule.

Oh, Stallion,to answer your question about the supp that you like, ckeck and see if Sci Tech has ever made any products that are banned. If they haven’t, you’re probably fine. If they have in the past, maybe it’s best to not use it, or if it really is something that’s worth it to you, have it analyzed by an independant lab.

Blacksnake:

Lol, angry are we?

You can blame yourself for acting like a fool. If you had read all the first posts properly, you would already learned what BigRago so nicely summed up.

I wrote:

  • Three boxes with Ribose was tested, two of them delivered by the lifter and one directly from Universal Nutrition. Each box was tested at different labs.
  • All boxes contained nandrolone.

Universal Nutriton admitted their wrongdoings in a court of law, yet you manage to say:

Not only that, but this makes no sense…How the hell do you buy vitamins that have nando in them? There’s a strong smell of bullsh*t with this whole story…

If you had read the paper I linked to, you would have seen that the positive tests was caused by producing legal supps and pro-hormones on the same machinery…

Therefore I said that it was you that smelt, and not the story.

In Norway this is not considered much of a offense, but maybe so in the USA?

Anyway, what always irritates me is when uninformed people rush to conclusions when they really do not know what they are talking about.

No need to start a war. Just think before you speak next time.

[quote]stallion wrote:
Just think before you speak next time.[/quote]
Excuse me? I unashamedly admitted that I spoke out of ignorance to the facts. I dont have a problem owning up to being wrong on a subject. You, on the other hand, are clearly challenged in this area, and apparently revel in your immaturity. So be it!. I bow to you, O’ great repository of all knowledge worth seeking, you are clearly the superior mind of the century. How dare I even speak, I am so unworthy to participate, and beseech thine forgiveness to exist in your realm, and beg to grovel at your sacred feet…Please forgive me my existence, I shall never question your obvious superiority on all matters ever again…

Lol, relax dude, it is just an internet forum. :wink:

Oh come on guys.

Look, it was vague on both sides as to what happened without researching the claims. But since Universal manned-up and confessed that they sold comtaminated products, after tests of their stock producs, there is no need to beat the already dead horse.

Now you two kiss and makeup. We don’t need bad blood between we ironheads to perpetuate the “meathead” stigma. We have more in common than we have differences.

If Blacksnake ever comes to Norway, he’s welcome to join a workout or two. :slight_smile:

No bad blood here. :slight_smile:

[quote]stallion wrote:
If Blacksnake ever comes to Norway, he’s welcome to join a workout or two. :slight_smile:

No bad blood here. :)[/quote]
Great! Now I have to save up to go to Norway and then decide between training and eating right, or drinking too much vodka and trying to marry a cute Norwegian girl! Stallion, you really know how to hurt a guy! (and be careful what you wish for, I might well really take you up on that offer, cause’ Norway girls Rock!/:wink: