T Nation

Toughest US President

[quote]Headhunter wrote:
Andrew Jackson, easily.

Crushed Nicholas Biddle and the first central bank we had (similar to our Federal Reserve today), withstood first censure of a President then crushed them all. And let’s not forget the war of 1812!

Andy, where are you? There are few MEN in Washington anymore, just rodents.[/quote]

Agreed.

"Once he had a quarrel about a horse race, with a man named Dickinson. In consequence the two fought a duel, as was the customary way of settling quarrels in those days. Dickinson was a “dead shot” and boasted that he would surely kill Jackson. They met at the appointed time. Dickinson fired.

Then Jackson fired, and the boaster fell to the ground, dying soon after. Jackson, with his surgeon and a friend, had left the scene of the duel and gone some distance when his companions saw blood oozing from Jackson’s clothes. He had had two ribs shattered, but had told no one that he was wounded."

[quote]Mick28 wrote:
My top three:

3. Teddy Rosevelt-He was proficient at Judo and boxing. He also led the rough riders up San Wan hill.

2. Abraham Lincoln-Not many realize that this guy was a darn good wrestler. While there were no official championships for this sport in the 1840’s Lincoln used to travel around and kick some serious butt. He also had to be mentally tough to tak the nation through the bloodiest time in its history. And…hey he took a bullet in the head, that has to qualify him as tough…no?
[/quote]

How does getting assasinated make you tough? Lincoln is a bitch. A real man like TR gets shot then gives an hour-long speech with a bullet still lodged in him. It takes more than a bullet to stop a bull moose. Apparently it only takes one bullet to stop a pathetic tyrant and dictator though. Sic Semper Tyrannis indeed.

mike

[quote]Mikeyali wrote:
Mick28 wrote:
My top three:

3. Teddy Rosevelt-He was proficient at Judo and boxing. He also led the rough riders up San Wan hill.

2. Abraham Lincoln-Not many realize that this guy was a darn good wrestler. While there were no official championships for this sport in the 1840’s Lincoln used to travel around and kick some serious butt. He also had to be mentally tough to tak the nation through the bloodiest time in its history. And…hey he took a bullet in the head, that has to qualify him as tough…no?

How does getting assasinated make you tough? Lincoln is a bitch. A real man like TR gets shot then gives an hour-long speech with a bullet still lodged in him. It takes more than a bullet to stop a bull moose. Apparently it only takes one bullet to stop a pathetic tyrant and dictator though. Sic Semper Tyrannis indeed.

mike[/quote]

Did TR get a bullet through the head?

Also, TR let the Eastern Establishment split the Republican Party so Wilson could win. Wilson was a sock puppet of JP Morgan. Morgan was selling bonds for the British and French governments (gearing up for WWI) and making a bundle. He also was their purchasing agent. He wanted America in the war. That way, the Americans would give $$$ to the Brits and French who would turn around and buy through Morgan. WWI was Morgan’s baby and TR opened the door for him. TR was a blustering fool.

Morgan made millions upon millions of dollars.

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[quote]Headhunter wrote:
Andrew Jackson, easily.

Crushed Nicholas Biddle and the first central bank we had (similar to our Federal Reserve today), withstood first censure of a President then crushed them all. And let’s not forget the war of 1812!

Andy, where are you? There are few MEN in Washington anymore, just rodents.[/quote]

Jackson was also politically tough too. He paid off the entire federal debt during his time in office.
Though the Indian Removal Act could be considered a blot on his record.

[quote]Headhunter wrote:

Did TR get a bullet through the head?

[/quote]

I say again, how does getting shot in the head and dying make you tough?

This is like that bullshit with naming 9/11 Patriots Day. How does being in a hijacked airplane and getting murdered make you a patriot? You know what used to be called Patriots Day before 9/11? April 19th, the day REAL patriots fired upon the British at Lexington and Concord. Nowadays in America we celebrate victimhood above valor. We call abused women brave for taking an ass whooping instead of cowards for them staying with a man that abuses them and their children. By celebrating victimhood and calling that valor all we do is continue to propagate a society of cowards and small people.

mike

[quote]Mikeyali wrote:
Headhunter wrote:

Did TR get a bullet through the head?

I say again, how does getting shot in the head and dying make you tough?

This is like that bullshit with naming 9/11 Patriots Day. How does being in a hijacked airplane and getting murdered make you a patriot? You know what used to be called Patriots Day before 9/11? April 19th, the day REAL patriots fired upon the British at Lexington and Concord. Nowadays in America we celebrate victimhood above valor. We call abused women brave for taking an ass whooping instead of cowards for them staying with a man that abuses them and their children. By celebrating victimhood and calling that valor all we do is continue to propagate a society of cowards and small people.

mike[/quote]

Ummm…the original plan was for 3 of the conspirators to kidnap Lincoln as he rode, often alone, to the War Department, where he got the latest war news. They opted to shoot him because they were afraid that he would beat the shit out of them.

As for the stuff about women, I don’t think anyone calls such a woman brave, just terrified. If you were 120 lbs and a 200 lbs maniac threatened to hunt you down and torture you to death or kill the children if you left, what would you do?

I usually like to debate fellow crazy people like myself but you are too fucked up. Get lost.

[quote]Mikeyali wrote:
Headhunter wrote:

Did TR get a bullet through the head?

I say again, how does getting shot in the head and dying make you tough?

Hi Guys
I seem to remember that in the History Channel biog on TR they said he was shot while campaigning for the 1912 election and hardly paused his speech; that’s pretty hard.

Cheers
Chris

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[quote]Mick28 wrote:
Mikeyali wrote:
Headhunter wrote:

Did TR get a bullet through the head?

I say again, how does getting shot in the head and dying make you tough?

Okay junior (I hope you’re young otherwise there’s not much hope for you), I’ll have to explain it to you.

Lincoln was warned not once or twice but many times that there were people planning to assassinate him. Instead of cowering under his bed the way Bush or Clinton would have, he continued on with his schedule as usual.

He was well aware that if the enemy were allowed to dictate where and when he went places that it could have effected his ability to lead.

And he did this so that the north could see that there President was carrying on business as usual. He did this because he was a leader and leaders lead they don’t cower. And he did this because he was a great leader. And one very tough SOB.

[/quote]
laugh Junior. I like that. Okay, That still doesn’t make him tough. It makes him brave. Crack a dictionary chief. Tyrant or not, I won’t argue that he wasn’t brave, only that getting shot and dying (Lincoln) doesn’t make you tougher than getting shot and giving a speech (TR). [quote]

As to the 9-11 event…the hero’s on that one jet, who attempted to take it back from the hijackers were brave, very brave. They also foiled the terrorists plans by making sure that the plane did not hit the White House. [/quote]

True story. In fact, there were MANY people that demonstrated extraordinary valor on that day. However, if you haven’t heard the term “brave victims of 9/11” used as a collective term for all 3000+ then you haven’t been paying attention. All I am saying is that we have reached a point in American society in which we equate victimhood with valor and that it is a dangerous attitude to have. I’m also saying that you don’t downgrade the work of patriots who began the revolution by giving away their day to commemorate a terrorist attack because it is a political expedient. Now perhaps if you can get your panties untwisted then you would read the post rather than merely seeking to become offended because it’s your idealogical duty to get hurt when someone doesn’t blow Republicans in the form of Lincoln and 9/11 worship.

[quote]

You know very little about what it takes to be tough.

Now do us all a favor and shut the fuck up.[/quote]

Classy as always Mick. I don’t claim to be tough; I’m just a guy speaking up for what he believes. Semper Fi my friend,

mike

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Harrison Ford - toughest president ever.

Lincoln was pretty tough on Star Trek.

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“Get off my plane.”

Teddy Roosevel was shot while giving a speach…but the bullet hit the extremely thick written speech rolled up in his shirt pocket and saved his life.

Harry S. Truman was one of the the toughest presidents ever, in my opinion. He fired McArthur (very unpopular move) and go America out of Korea, which resulted in him getting one of the lowest presidential approval ratings ever. He also called out a writer who gave his daughter a bad review (for a play or musical or somthing). Basically he always did what he thought was right and didn’t give a fuck what people thought of him.

Hey also George Washington had to eat everyday with fucking splinters in his mouth, and never did he fucking complain. That is tough.

Read ‘Team Of Rivals’, even just the first few chapters, to get a sense of Lincoln and the stuff he was made of. It’s truly awe-inspiring, the manner in which he would be initially written off as an awkward, ugly, lanky hick, and would then proceed to to COMMAND the respect of everyone he encountered.

His internal fortitude and ability to stand by his convictions in the face of the greatest crisis this country has ever seen earns him my vote. Really, read the book, and you’ll see why his contemporaries (many of whom with their own set of steel balls) considered him to be the greatest man they’d ever met – and this was due in large part to the BALLS it took to stand by his convictions in that era.

[quote]SinisterMinister wrote:
Read ‘Team Of Rivals’, even just the first few chapters, to get a sense of Lincoln and the stuff he was made of. It’s truly awe-inspiring, the manner in which he would be initially written off as an awkward, ugly, lanky hick, and would then proceed to to COMMAND the respect of everyone he encountered. [/quote]

And those that didn’t respect him he threw in jail. The man was a bully and a tyrant.

mike

[quote]Mikeyali wrote:
SinisterMinister wrote:
Read ‘Team Of Rivals’, even just the first few chapters, to get a sense of Lincoln and the stuff he was made of. It’s truly awe-inspiring, the manner in which he would be initially written off as an awkward, ugly, lanky hick, and would then proceed to to COMMAND the respect of everyone he encountered.

And those that didn’t respect him he threw in jail. The man was a bully and a tyrant.

mike
[/quote]

Hey Mike, interesting thought. I have a favor to ask, though: Put down your Howard Zinn Reader and provide me an example of what flawless leaders you hold in high regard. (Something tells me to expect Jimmy Carter and maybe
Neville Chamberlain…)